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[Phmcw]

No actually, you cannot win this terror war.
And I say terror war because it's a war were both side use terror to try to batter his opponent into submission.

As for Israel internal policy, let's say that each and every human right movement are condemning it.

But I will let you in your dream world were you "fight the good war" on the "bad guys".

[HideousBeing]

Its kind of like Vietnam, except if we leave they will start blowing shit up again.

Americans are pretty crazy about free speech issues and even moreso about nondemocratic governments. Governments like China are by definition tyrannical to us.

EDIT: Which makes it a really easy rallying cry.

[Forumsdwarf]

No actually, you cannot win this terror war.

Every day that Salman Rushdie, Matt Stone, Trey Parker, Ayaan Hirsi-Ali, and others like them continue to publish we win another victory in our ongoing War on Terror.

This:

http://www.amazon.com/Satanic-Verses-Novel-Salman-Rushdie/dp/0812976711/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_3

This is why we are fighting.  I haven't read it, but I can, with a couple of mouse clicks and a credit card.  That's what this war is all about.

Whenever we might find ourselves beginning to doubt whether the price is worth it, whether we can win, whether the religious fanatics are just too devout, too committed, too ruthless for us to continue the fight, we can find renewed strength from a simple visit to our local bookstore.  There on the shelves are the whole and unadulterated visions of their authors and publishers made real with ink and paper unstained by the taint of religious censorship.
Those books are there, even those that condemn the fight to preserve them, because our heroes, heroes like Todd Beamer, Paul R. Smith, and David Petraeus, fight, fought, and sometimes died protecting those freedoms.  They form an unbroken chain all the way back to Martin Luther's 95 theses -- another time of religious darkness whose heroes' actions were measured in words on pages.

As for Israel internal policy, let's say that each and every human right movement are condemning it.

In between fawning over their collections of Nazi memorabilia.

“VERY nice Hitler signature selection”
"That is so cool! The leather SS jacket makes my blood go cold it is so COOL!”
 -- Mark Garlasco, Human Rights Watch "Israel Expert"

But I will let you in your dream world were you "fight the good war" on the "bad guys".

The life of letters is often abstract, but it is also said the pen is mightier than the sword.  While in the long arc of history that has proven to be true, the pen needs to call for backup now and again.

[Phmcw]

First point : mainstream Islam is not for censorship, and Usa doesn't make war for freedom of speech. Actually, the puppet  government they use to try to have a tiny bit of legitimacy are strongly authoritarian and not the least bit concerned about human right. 

Second point, the fact that one of the expert (not one of the militant) is a nazi collector doesn't even prove that he is antisemitic.
And that is one case, in one organization. Beside his conclusion has been validated by other expert. Burning civilian with white phosphorus for nor reason is a must bigger crime than censoring piglet.

third point: You don't even make sense . Why would pen need backup from something weaker.
What you're saying is "pen is weaker than the sword and need it to protect it". And that prove you've understood nothing about the saying.

[ChairmanPoo]

QFT

[Phmcw]

QFT

Quantum field theory?

[PTTG??]

Quiet: found toasters?
 
Quit hogging the toasters!

[Electronic Phantom]

.......Hi.

Re: Unwinnable Wars.

See: The War on Terror, The War on Drugs, The War on *Insert badly defined idea here*

-(e)EP

[Phmcw]

Seriously what does QFT mean? (apart Quantum field theory obviously)

For this whole "freedom of speech" thing.
Forumsdwarf I understand that you'd like that it is what these war are about.
Unfortunately, I have to point out that it have never been part of the US agenda.
For one, US is a strong ally of the Saudi Arabia, the motor behind the spreading of radical Islam.
Taliban? Inspired by Saudi Arabia. Al Qaida Yes, from Saudi Arabia. Islamist popaganda in the Magerb, Saudi Arabia.
In Tunisian blog, the main complain about America, apart of his support to Israel, is his support to Saudi Arabia, and thus to radical Islam.

Another point is : none of the government appointed or allied to the American in the "war on terror" enforce free speech.
Pakistan? Nope. current Iraki government? Nope. Current Afghan government? So corrupt even US is cutting on aid.

This is a war for domination, not freedom. if you side with the US, you can ge away with almost everything (exept wasting their money apparently)

[ChairmanPoo]

Seriously what does QFT mean?

Quit feeding trolls.

[Siquo]

Forumsdwarf is not a troll, I think he actually believes the stuff he sais, as unbelievable as it may seem.

[Bralbaard]

One of the most ridiculous things is that Geert Wilders is claiming to defend the rights of free speech, while his own party is structured as a dictatorship. The party does not have members, as other Dutch parties do, and lacks any democratic structure. Other people in his party are not allowed to voice their opinion on anything that does not directly relate to the field they are responsible for. Meanwhile he sues his opponents for voicing their oppinion.

True, he makes up brilliant oneliners, and has mastered the art of acting hurt, or unjustly treated when he is opposed. He is also very good at getting media attention. In the end though, his party is founded on fearmongering and racism, and nothing else. By openly embracing Jewish culture, Wilders avoids being associated with neo-nazism, but he uses the same tricks. His treatment of muslims is not different from other cases of political racism in history, some of which have ended very badly indeed.

[Muz]

Geert Wilders plays the same tricks everyone else does. But in a post 9/11 world, people really want to believe him. It's not so much of him being good with the media, it's that the media is telling people what they want to hear.

[Siquo]

[disclaimer: I was making this shit up as I was going along]

More "telling them what they think the people want to hear". With nothing left to struggle for, boredom makes people hungry for misery.

Really, movies about people shooting other people? If you're from a war-torn country and have seen your family die by violence, would you want to see violent movies? Would you want to read about death and hate and rape? People love that shit, because they don't really know what it is. That's what the media serves us, that's what we crave. We need fear and struggle to give our lives meaning. We need "us" vs "them" to get a sense of belonging. We need to know that we are the good guys, fighting the good fight.

Unless of course you've got a little bit more brain and can rationalise that it's exactly that craving that makes the world a sadder place.

[Phmcw]

[disclaimer: I was making this shit up as I was going along]

More "telling them what they think the people want to hear". With nothing left to struggle for, boredom makes people hungry for misery.

Really, movies about people shooting other people? If you're from a war-torn country and have seen your family die by violence, would you want to see violent movies? Would you want to read about death and hate and rape? People love that shit, because they don't really know what it is. That's what the media serves us, that's what we crave. We need fear and struggle to give our lives meaning. We need "us" vs "them" to get a sense of belonging. We need to know that we are the good guys, fighting the good fight.

Unless of course you've got a little bit more brain and can rationalise that it's exactly that craving that makes the world a sadder place.

It's funny because it's what Dwarf Fortress is about : awesomeness and misery.