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YES! (i would use it)

NO! (i would not use it, and i think it is pointless/unethical/gross etc.)

yes, but i would dissable it if it was an init option (all yes voters are assumed to be for an init option, only vote here if you think it should be included but you would not use it)

[Askot Bokbondeler]

how did you reach the page with the power goals and bloats and stuff? cant seem to find it on the new site :\

[Footkerchief]

It was taken down on April 1 so that Toady could improve the dev item system, which now seems to have been kind of premature.  I got a copy (and one of dev_bugs) from the Google cache a few weeks ago.  Google cache doesn't seem to have them anymore, so here you go.

[Askot Bokbondeler]

hey, thanks a lot

[lucusLoC]

I think you misunderstood Zangi there. Zangi elaborated on the point I was making and which seems to have been rebutted by LucusLoC with reference to the OP stating that this discussion is NOT to be about how things get implemented. Although, I don't really think that LucuLoC was really rebutting that argument there, but probably referring to the discussion about using different terms/implementations - somehow this thread has gotten quite confusing (^_^;;

in retrospect it was foolish of me to think i would be able to have any say in the direction of this thread. i never intended for it to become a general feces/filth/sewage/scat discussion thread, and i was trying to steer the discussion to the already existing threads and keep this one to a more simple yea/nae and a short description of why. that has obviously failed utterly. i will amend my OP to reflect reality and to avoid any further confusion.

(edited OP)

[Zangi]

Locking this would prevent discussion... a simple yes/no poll is never simple otherwise.

[Deathworks]

Hi!

And frankly, I regularly purchase online items from Japanese download shops that would probably make a lot of people here gross out and want to burn me on a stake or never talk to me again.

Rapelay?

Nope, rape or guro is not really down my alley (and I am NOT a furry!). Besides, judging from the screenshot/title screen there, they seem to go for a relatively realistic/3D look. But I think we should not go into detail here as a) it is OT and b) not necessarily a good thing to discuss here - let's just say that even those who are understanding find some things hard to stomach.

On Topic: LucusLoC, I am afraid that Zangi is correct about it not being a simple matter. As the discussion may have shown you, there are many, many fine nuances that may require people to discuss and elaborate. And even those with similar thoughts may be quite different.

For instance, while I think that an explicit fecal system will cause a major disruption to the community, I don't think that adding sexuality would necessarily have the same effect. This is because of how I see the reasons of the effect I have described before. Other people feel slightly differently and would say that sexuality would have the same effect.

In addition, while you may ask people just to state their personal opinions, people usually want their own idea to be the winning one, so they are bound to campaign openly or secretly for their idea.

Finally, I think Zangi is right to propose locking this thread. I mentioned before that I think the implementation question is basically what is interesting. Not only because it would provide something to present to Toady One, but also because we do not really know what we are voting for or against, otherwise. Some people said they were concerned about how much that would burden the player with extra tasks - a factor that depends on how things are implemented. Likewise, my own worries may be reduced by an implementation that finds a smart way to hinder the worst abuses of the system.

If you wanted a really fair vote under these circumstances, your options would need to be "Yes, always", "No, never", and "Depends on how it is implemented", and I have a feeling that you would get a majority on that last one (^_^;;

Deathworks

[lucusLoC]

well, my original hope was to have anyone who wanted to discuss it go the the other thread and do it there, but since we have come so far we may as well just continue to do it here.

as to the vote options, that would not be a horribly informative vote i think. near as i can figure it we would need a new vote with something like 8 or 9 options, presenting all of the common proposals (from "shit" down to "filth" "manure" and "scat") and a simple no, plus all of the combinations to allow for an ini option. basically we would need to set up a survey with multiple questions, which i don't think the forum is capable of doing.

oh well, i will stick to my simple vote, since it seems to be doing the job adequately. it does not give us the fine grain insights, but it gives us a pretty good general overview.

please continue to elaborate in your posts and i will continue to keep the OP updated with the relevant info.

[GRead]

It could probably be improved on though.
I normally hate the 1-5 rating system so many customer service surveys use, but in this case I think it could be useful.

5 - I am firmly for biological waste in DF, and am upset by the assertion it should not go in.
4 - I am for biological waste in DF, but would not be heart broken if it didn't go
3 - I don't really care either way
2 - I am against biological waste in DF, but would not be heart broken if it went in
1 - I am firmly against biological waste in DF, and am upset by the assertion it should go in.

It doesn't provide amazing fine-grain detail, but it does allow a voter to differentiate between a strong 'no' and a soft 'no', or a strong 'yes' and a soft 'yes', or even to just be indifferent overall.

[Urist McDepravity]

In short, the standards of the community will go to hell for it.

Primo: You can not call something 'standards' if it is supported only by half of community.
Secundo: DF community survived far more greater challenges, like /b/-like board. ToadyOne and ThreeToe are good enough at enforcing their perspective on community well-being, including deployment of mass-bans when needed.

[Raz]

It is pretty impressive how Zangi is able to predict the outcomes to the community with such great certainty.

[Xzalander]

It is pretty impressive how Zangi is able to predict the outcomes to the community with such great certainty.

Urist McToady Cancels Implementation: Interrupted by Mad Prophet Zangi.

[Askot Bokbondeler]

i am *pro* filth, but i think zangi has a good point, he just failed to explain it as sensibly and diplomatically as Deathworks and Kilo24. still, i trust that toady and three toe will be able to keep the forums shit-joke free, and seeing that more than half of the forums find these jokes distastefull*, i think the ones that find these funny will be discouraged enough from posting  their exploits here


(*acording to the poll, half of the forum really has a problem with this, and acording to this thread, atleast a few, but probably more than just a few of the people who voted yes also arent really interested in shit jokes)

[GlyphGryph]

Goddamnit, This thread is a cockup of epic proportions.

I'm making a new one with a slightly different title and options and see how that fares.

Plus I really want to know how many supporters would change sides with slightly modified language. (how much is about the argument/implementation, and how much is about the topic)

[Djohaal]

i am *pro* filth, but i think zangi has a good point, he just failed to explain it as sensibly and diplomatically as Deathworks and Kilo24. still, i trust that toady and three toe will be able to keep the forums shit-joke free, and seeing that more than half of the forums find these jokes distastefull*, i think the ones that find these funny will be discouraged enough from posting  their exploits here


(*acording to the poll, half of the forum really has a problem with this, and acording to this thread, atleast a few, but probably more than just a few of the people who voted yes also arent really interested in shit jokes)

Exactally. People act as if this forum was completely unmoderated. A little moderation pressure early on against excessive or distasteful shit jokes could curb the apocalypse that the rapture of sewage might lead the forums to, according to some prophets.

[Vester]

While we're at it, let's all head on over to GlyphGryph's thread.