Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[TomiTapio]

I suppose I could convert my raws to ascii using Gen3.19... maybe takes 40-70 mins with WinMerge. Hmm... copy all the tile-related things from 3.19asc

Edit: don't hold your breath, maybe I'll give ascii version tomorrow, in 14 hours.

When using graphics tiles, one does not need to set all the creatures to have specific tiles.  They can be left as their normal, ASCII values.

Then their corpses and caged blinking will be *gasp* ascii! Or was that caged blinking in 2009 version...

[Dutchling]

Weren't coins just worth just as much as what they are made of?

You know, I just don't know.  In my experience, the actual value doesn't seem to correlate heavily to the material they're made of.  I've had a copper coin be more expensive than an iron, one time. 

I meant in RL

[Deon]

I rather don't care about currency since I don't adventure. But the pet and steel item values should be the basis of all other values I think. Pet rat, 10 €. pet tiger, 550 €. Pet mammoth, 1500 €. So I think one gold coin maybe... 1/40th of a mammoth, so 40 goldcoin=1500.
Hmm... 1 copper = 1 crap meal,
100 copper = 10 € pet rat,
1 gold = 4000 coppers = 40 rats = 400 € = 1 tame lion.

Food values are just wonky and I have nerfed cooking skill leveling -- dorfs are not known for their cuisine. Dorfs should export stone and metal items.

ps. I was D&D basic set (not AD&D) dungeon master in 1987-1990. First ever English-language product I read was a Dragon Magazine 1988-somemonth.

pps. reported bug "snow does not stop fires", http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=4555

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Hum, it might only be my RPG background but the jump from 100 (silver) to 10k (gold) seems a bit steep. (Understanding that I've never actually stuck with a fort long enough to have an economy established.) Typical D&D (or at least 3.5e, the version I "grew up" on) ratios go 1 (copper)/10 (silver)/100 (gold)/1,000 (platinum). I am way too sleepy to offer a well-reasoned suggestion on how to better balance the economy, but I thought another perspective on 'fantasy' economies might help a bit.

And now I'm going to go stagger off to bed! G'night, guys! ♥

I rethought the idea today and I am going to make the difference to be less steep. Spread the values a bit.
Zinc-Copper-Nickel-Iron-Steel-Aluminum-Gold-Platinum. I've tested it and 10'000 value coin is too much, shops can have only one of those .

By the way, can't you trade coins in fortress mode? I didn't try it, but if you can, then 10k value coin would be very game-breaking.

Weren't coins just worth just as much as what they are made of?

You know, I just don't know.  In my experience, the actual value doesn't seem to correlate heavily to the material they're made of.  I've had a copper coin be more expensive than an iron, one time. 

I meant in RL

Yes, in real life. The year, the country and the value of the coin matter much more than the material it is made of.

So... When can I expect the ASCII version? I'd really like to get caught up, I haven't played since Genesis 3.19!

I wanted to release it today, but it will probably be a tad later, since I was really busy in the lab today.

[Deon]

Something I'd like to point out for Deon's benefit:

When using graphics tiles, one does not need to set all the creatures to have specific tiles.  They can be left as their normal, ASCII values.  The raw/graphics files will change them into creature pictures just fine.  The only thing that really NEEDS to be changed in the raw files is the plant and inorganic tiles, as trees, plants, and minerals tend to vary between graphical sets...

I object, if I follow your advice, corpses will look like "V" and "U".

Also the "only" thing in your list is the only thing I am concerned about since it takes a lot of time to make. All creature tiles are set at once with a single command.

I suppose I could convert my raws to ascii using Gen3.19... maybe takes 40-70 mins with WinMerge. Hmm... copy all the tile-related things from 3.19asc

Edit: don't hold your breath, maybe I'll give ascii version tomorrow, in 14 hours.

When using graphics tiles, one does not need to set all the creatures to have specific tiles.  They can be left as their normal, ASCII values.

Then their corpses and caged blinking will be *gasp* ascii! Or was that caged blinking in 2009 version...

Yeah, they now blink as skeletons . It actually really bothers me, I hope Toady fixes it one day.

[Jeoshua]

Oh, I had forgotten about that.  I kind of would prefer if cages blinked what their creature was, and corpses were corpses.

OH well.

[Elone]

Huh... I'm new here... am I understanding wrong, or does this mod force a tileset/graphics? I'm not very keen on using one.

[KarolineDianne]

Right now it does. The ASCII version will hopefully be out soon.

[asfghn]

Gooood morning, thread!

I actually noticed the 'cage blinking skeleton' bug, but I wasn't aware it was a bug—the first time I saw it, I was terrified that somehow I had murdered whatever I had assigned to the cage (I think an extra breeding pair of peafowl, in case the loose pair went afoul of the plagues of giant gargoyles that periodically fell upon that fort).

Oh, Kat.  How is it you embark with dragon raptors, anyway?  Do you set your embark points really high?  I ask because it's like 1,000 points per raptor.  I embarked with 2k more points than normal for my glacier attempt, and I ended up with like five mastiffs, two bulldogs, two spaniels, and those together are less than a single raptor.

I do sometimes set my embark points pretty high on certain worlds (mostly when I'm feeling depressed and need a quasicheaty pick-me-up), which is the only way I was able to take along dragon raptors. Regular raptors I've altered for my personal raws (which I can upload if anyone's interested, though I can guarantee they're not as awesome as Tomi's) to be [COMMON_DOMESTIC] and I believe I lowered their petvalue a bit (to around ~100), since I love embarking with like a million critters and setting up breeding/war-training programs.

Speaking of my personal raws, I've also been trying to beef raptors up a bit skill-wise. I'm not sure if I've gone overboard, but I'm also not sure if that's really undesirable. These xkcd strips pretty much exemplify the nature of 'raptors' I was trying to invoke in their creation, and mine tend to die pretty easily despite being able to level up their skills*, so I think it's acceptable for the moment.


*I am not sure what did it exactly but for a little while there while I was tinkering my raptors kept trying to start parties. (Un?)Fortunately they were tied up outside my fort entrance and so I would get 'Stray War Raptor cancels Attend Party: no space' or something like that.
---
[pre-post edit] Hi, Elone! Welcome to the Genesis thread. To answer your question, the most current version does 'force' a special graphical tileset, but both the creator (Deon) and his 'assistant' (Tomi) are working on an ASCII version, and it might be out tomorrow-ish.

Until then, I think you can check the older versions (linked near the bottom of the first post) for the last ASCII update no actually I just checked and the last ASCII version was 3.19, and it's linked very near to the top of the OP, so not that far behind updatewise if you're dying to try out the mod now.

[edit2] Aaand ninjered by KarolineDianne. Oh well.

[Elone]

Oooh, thank you for quick replies! Yes, I checked in the meantime, the latest ASCII one is 3.19. Tomorrow you say? That's not so long at all, thank you! I'm not actually a modder yet, but would it not have been easier to build in ASCII natively?

[Jeoshua]

Speaking of which, I need to go check to see if my Raptors have [CANOPENDOORS]

Ooh look... they do! Thanks Deon!

Although I'm thinking they might need [MOUNT_EXOTIC] since it would take a Dungeon Master to make one of them WILLINGLY let you ride it.

[Elone]

Kat: Like this? Seen in an actual office, so, no photoshop. (eek the image is big)


Jeoshua: You're talking about Gordito here, I can tell!

[asfghn]

Elone: I've heard (from someone in this thread actually, though it slips my mind at the moment just who; sorry!) that it's actually not necessary to take graphics into the equation of creature-modding, though it does for things like inorganics and plants and such. And I know Deon at least uses a raw tile selector, which I have heard (though I've not played with it myself) really very much simplifies things.

Jeoshua: Actually, the core raptor stuff is mine! I submitted it a waaaaaay long time ago (like, last summer?) for Deon's use in Genesis. It's since been updated with skills (which I have since tinkered with) and in-depth body materials and such, which I don't think existed when I first made them.

[CANOPENDOORS] and [NOFEAR] were musts, of course. I think I've since given them [LIKES_FIGHTING] and [TRAPAVOID]. [MOUNT_EXOTIC] actually sounds like a good idea for the reason you mention; I am going off to alter my raws now.

All in all, I think I would probably hate to ever run into wild raptors, and it would probably be the end of the world.
When I was first tinkering with their skills, I fully expected to roll worlds where all civilizations near raptors collapsed. Sadly this hasn't yet happened, maybe I should try harder.

[pre-post edit] Oh my gosh I LOVE that sign, Elone! I am saving it to my HD, and yes, that is EXACTLY what I had in mind. 8D

[TomiTapio]

halfway done ascii-fying, still plants and items to go, I'll do that in my morning. Ofcoz needs cursory testing in the morning also.

[MOUNT_EXOTIC]  does nothing as Dungeon Master is still useless due to a DF bug. You must choose MOUNT or not.

I don't think towns can fall to regular predators (wolf, raptor etc.). Only to semimega and mega.

[Deon]

Speaking of which, I need to go check to see if my Raptors have [CANOPENDOORS]

Ooh look... they do! Thanks Deon!

Although I'm thinking they might need [MOUNT_EXOTIC] since it would take a Dungeon Master to make one of them WILLINGLY let you ride it.

There are no exotic pets because DM does not work in DF yet.

Oooh, thank you for quick replies! Yes, I checked in the meantime, the latest ASCII one is 3.19. Tomorrow you say? That's not so long at all, thank you! I'm not actually a modder yet, but would it not have been easier to build in ASCII natively?

It wouldn't since it requires to remap all tiles and ores, and in ASCII they use much more symbols than in graphical tilesets .

[Jeoshua]

I don't think towns can fall to regular predators (wolf, raptor etc.). Only to semimega and mega.

Not true.  Regular beasts (like Trolls for example) can beat a city into submission, killing off all their farmers, and making the population starve to death.  Seen it happen in 10 civs in my world genning just this very day.

I made Trolls less frequent and to have lower pop numbers because of it.