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Author Topic: Digital Piracy  (Read 12695 times)

Virex

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #105 on: March 27, 2010, 08:51:08 pm »

That's being shortsighted at best. First I do hope that your little trip to the university isn't only motivated by the financial aspect.
It's motivated by my dream of working for a chemical company. No research at chemical company => no future for me. Sure I could do academic research, but frankly, most of that isn't realy exiting and all the exiting stuff is being done in collaboration with chemical companies. I highly doubt they'd continue doing that if there was no chance of making a decent profit out of the research.
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Then you assume that somehow enforcing an ownership on your idea is the only way to attract investor? Excuse me but that is stupid, if only because intellectual property is a notion fist formulated in the sixties and only recently widespread.
The basic patent law has been around since the 17th century, at least in England and coppyright sprung up around the same time. Trade secrets have been protected since much earlier, as the glassblowers from Murano can attest. Intelectual property itself, as a term may be new, but it encompasses some realy old things.
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Einstein, Niels Bohr, Feynman, have all worked, and gotten rich without any intellectual property of their idea. An interesting thinking experiment would be figuring out what would have happened if that notion was enforced at the time. Probably nohing good as Mileva Marik couldn't have communicated Lenhart's work in  progress to Einstein. So no article on photoelectric effect for the world. It's only a start of course.
Argh! Doesn't this ever stop?!

I'm trying to argue about protecting inventions and every other sentence people drag fundamental research into the picture. for God's sake why do you guys keep doing that?

Anyway, to counter your question, would Bakeland have pursued the development of Bakelite if his competitors could just have piggy-backed on his invention?
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When I talk about intellectual property, I talk about the precise concept. I'll admit wikipedia as a valid source for the definition.
I can see where this is going and I don't like it. The precise concept can either be a definition so broad that it prevents me from saying the word "space shuttle" without explicit permission from NASA, or it can be so narrow that I'd need to know every line in the US, EU and brazilian patent law by heart. Wikipedia defines it very broad, but there are so many points you can find something to nitpick that a smokescreen is transparent compared to the reasoning we're going to end up with here and at the end one can easely claim that because DNA sequences and game concepts can be patented in the US, patent law should be abandoned forever.

But first, let me ask you a few questions: Do you realy believe that it is in everyone's best interest to make it so that companies can freely use the resarch, branding and product development done by others without compensating the one that invested in it?
Do you realy believe it is right that I can just start producing Coca Cola and piggyback on the companies fame without ever giving them credit for anything?
Do you expect people to put up with the idea that everything they have worked for their whole life will essentialy be for naught because some start-up company is going to take the tech and use the billiosn they saved by not developing anything to instead build more production capacity?
Or to be more general: Do you realy believe that developing a product doesn't cost anything at all?
« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 08:59:36 pm by Virex »
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LegoLord

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #106 on: March 27, 2010, 08:59:51 pm »

@legolord When I say I'm sure it's not maybe. It's I'm know it. Ever watched a clip on Youtube? Guilty (if the submitter isn't the right owner) ever borrowed a software from a friend? Guilty. Ever gave copy of a book or a part of a book (you have if you're at the university)? Guilty. I stop here the list is too long
I plead not guilty.  Besides, not every youtube video is up there illegally (in fact I'm fairly certain there is some system in effect to discourage that).  If I watch something on youtube, either a)  it was put their by the creator, b)it's is by some other mechanic public domain, or c) There is nothing indicating that it was posted illegally, and since I would not know it was illegally placed, can't be prosecuted for it - not in any court anyone would take seriously.  Besides, most of the laws concern the distribution as far as I'm aware.

And I'm well aware what anarchy is.  You can't exactly have laws when there are no leaders; you can only have mutual agreement.  If someone disagrees, things fall apart.  When someone tries to enforce the majority opinion, things begin tilting away from anarchy.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 09:04:54 pm by LegoLord »
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cowofdoom78963

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #107 on: March 27, 2010, 10:02:22 pm »

Come on legolord.

You cant seriously think someone might get sued for looking at music uploads on youtube.

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or c) There is nothing indicating that it was posted illegally, and since I would not know it was illegally placed, can't be prosecuted for it - not in any court anyone would take seriously.
Dont act like you dont know those videos are uploaded by people with no connection to the producer. I seriously doubt someone named InuyashaX46 would have any connection to Warner Brothers.

Not only that but ignorance of the law is no excuse. You are guilty of piracy just like everyone else.
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Zai

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #108 on: March 27, 2010, 10:05:58 pm »

Come on legolord.

You cant seriously think someone might get sued for looking at music uploads on youtube.
I can't find where he brought that up. Specific quote?
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cowofdoom78963

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #109 on: March 27, 2010, 10:08:04 pm »

Come on legolord.

You cant seriously think someone might get sued for looking at music uploads on youtube.
I can't find where he brought that up. Specific quote?
"There is nothing indicating that it was posted illegally, and since I would not know it was illegally placed, can't be prosecuted for it - not in any court anyone would take seriously."
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LegoLord

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #110 on: March 27, 2010, 10:46:10 pm »

That's exactly what my point was, cowofdoom.
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or c) There is nothing indicating that it was posted illegally, and since I would not know it was illegally placed, can't be prosecuted for it - not in any court anyone would take seriously.
Dont act like you dont know those videos are uploaded by people with no connection to the producer. I seriously doubt someone named InuyashaX46 would have any connection to Warner Brothers.
I don't use youtube often at all.  And if you have to do your own civilian investigation for every video - well, that's just dumb, isn't it?
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"Oh look there is a dragon my clothes might burn let me take them off and only wear steel plate."
And this is how tinned food was invented.
Alternately: The Brick Testament. It's a really fun look at what the bible would look like if interpreted literally. With Legos.
Just so I remember

cowofdoom78963

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #111 on: March 27, 2010, 10:50:43 pm »

That's exactly what my point was, cowofdoom.
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or c) There is nothing indicating that it was posted illegally, and since I would not know it was illegally placed, can't be prosecuted for it - not in any court anyone would take seriously.
Dont act like you dont know those videos are uploaded by people with no connection to the producer. I seriously doubt someone named InuyashaX46 would have any connection to Warner Brothers.
And if you have to do your own civilian investigation for every video - well, that's just dumb, isn't it?

That's the point genius. You pled not guilty to piracy and yet you admit yourself that you do.
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LegoLord

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #112 on: March 27, 2010, 11:05:58 pm »

What?  How do you get that from it?  If no one can sue you for something, then that something, under the law, isn't wrong.
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"Oh look there is a dragon my clothes might burn let me take them off and only wear steel plate."
And this is how tinned food was invented.
Alternately: The Brick Testament. It's a really fun look at what the bible would look like if interpreted literally. With Legos.
Just so I remember

cowofdoom78963

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #113 on: March 27, 2010, 11:13:32 pm »

What?  How do you get that from it?  If no one can sue you for something, then that something, under the law, isn't wrong.
You still broke the damn law.
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Nivim

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #114 on: March 28, 2010, 04:50:59 am »

Without paying attention to most of this thread to check if anyone has posted this; Baen Free Library. Involving some authors and their collective take on piracy.
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LegoLord

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #115 on: March 28, 2010, 08:52:00 am »

What?  How do you get that from it?  If no one can sue you for something, then that something, under the law, isn't wrong.
You still broke the damn law.
No.  Youtube is its own thing.  They and they're members are responsible for its content, not me.  I don't even have an account for it.  Like I said, if it was expected of citizens to do their own investigations of every video they watch, it would just be plain stupid.  And it's so massive, you can hardly expect them to even be able to scour its contents for illegal pirating.  Also like I said, I hardly ever watch things on youtube.  I highly doubt that any of the few things I've watched on it were there illegally.
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"Oh look there is a dragon my clothes might burn let me take them off and only wear steel plate."
And this is how tinned food was invented.
Alternately: The Brick Testament. It's a really fun look at what the bible would look like if interpreted literally. With Legos.
Just so I remember

Jreengus

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #116 on: March 28, 2010, 09:22:01 am »

What?  How do you get that from it?  If no one can sue you for something, then that something, under the law, isn't wrong.
You still broke the damn law.
No.  TPB is its own thing.  They and they're members are responsible for its content, not me.  I don't even have an account for it.  Like I said, if it was expected of citizens to do their own investigations of every torrent they download, it would just be plain stupid.  And it's so massive, you can hardly expect them to even be able to scour its contents for illegal pirating.  Also like I said, I hardly ever download things on TPB.  I highly doubt that any of the few things I've downloaded on it were there illegally.
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Rafal99

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #117 on: March 28, 2010, 11:19:16 am »

What?  How do you get that from it?  If no one can sue you for something, then that something, under the law, isn't wrong.
You still broke the damn law.
No.  TPB is its own thing.  They and they're members are responsible for its content, not me.  I don't even have an account for it.  Like I said, if it was expected of citizens to do their own investigations of every torrent they download, it would just be plain stupid.  And it's so massive, you can hardly expect them to even be able to scour its contents for illegal pirating.  Also like I said, I hardly ever download things on TPB.  I highly doubt that any of the few things I've downloaded on it were there illegally.
Yeah exactly. I was just going to post about this exact similarity.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2010, 11:22:15 am by Rafal99 »
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Rooster

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #118 on: March 28, 2010, 11:46:02 am »

What?  How do you get that from it?  If no one can sue you for something, then that something, under the law, isn't wrong.
You still broke the damn law.
No.  TPB is its own thing.  They and they're members are responsible for its content, not me.  I don't even have an account for it.  Like I said, if it was expected of citizens to do their own investigations of every torrent they download, it would just be plain stupid.  And it's so massive, you can hardly expect them to even be able to scour its contents for illegal pirating.  Also like I said, I hardly ever download things on TPB.  I highly doubt that any of the few things I've downloaded on it were there illegally.
Yeah exactly. I was just going to post about this exact similarity.

Ta sama rzecz na stadionie w warszawie. Co z tego że podrabiane? Kupiłem legalnie.

Translation: Same thing with stadium in warsaw. Who cares it's pirated? I bought it legally

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Bauglir

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Re: Digital Piracy
« Reply #119 on: March 28, 2010, 11:53:18 am »

-snip-
« Last Edit: May 03, 2015, 01:09:39 am by Bauglir »
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