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[Cheddarius]

I... don't see the problem here. He's attacking you. Combat is a large part of the game. This would be like playing Risk and saying "What, you can't attack me" or whatnot.

That being said, war generally makes both sides unhappy. I am willing to loan you a deterrence force at very reasonable prices.

[Vanigo]

I... don't see the problem here. He's attacking you. Combat is a large part of the game. This would be like playing Risk and saying "What, you can't attack me" or whatnot.

That being said, war generally makes both sides unhappy. I am willing to loan you a deterrence force at very reasonable prices.

Please. If his civilization had a mass mind control special ability, that'd be one thing, but seeing as how his civ hasn't been statted out at all yet... He's got nothing to attack me with. And even if he did, he hasn't located my city.
(Also: If his civ does wind up with a mass mind control special ability of this caliber, that's completely gamebreaking unless it inexplicably fails against military units. But that's a separate issue entirely.)

[Cheddarius]

Ah. I thought you were outraged at the moral aspect, not the practical aspect. Yes, he will need several turns before he attacks you, at the very least.

[IronyOwl]

I think he's just trying to come up with where his civ came from; since it's more a cult than a race, I guess he figured it'd be former members of other civs/races.

This still raises a lot of questions, so I'm thinking he would have been better served by just, you know, amassing barbarian tribes or something, rather than waltzing out of a capital city with pillaged goods and traitor fanatics.

[Knight Otu]

You mean your arrival/foundation? You have reasonably free reign there.

The keyword here is reasonably. Players screwing with other players' stuff 'unannounced' isn't generally liked, as just demonstrated. Something like that should be talked about with the player in question.

If things would happen the way abculatter_2 wrote them, Vanigo's numbers would not be affected. He would not lose population and resources. And the caliber of the mind control would be a one-time event, not repeatable.

[abculatter_2]

Sorry, I didn't think it would be that big a deal, I could always unite barbarians then move on to preachers in the other, more civilized areas later. I'll go ahead and rewrite what I have, plus there was some more stuff I failed to mention yesterday. EDIT: I just realized how much I have to rewrite...

If things would happen the way abculatter_2 wrote them, Vanigo's numbers would not be affected. He would not lose population and resources. And the caliber of the mind control would be a one-time event, not repeatable.

How would you explain where 3000 people suddenly came from? The one-time mind-control thing is fine so long as I can keep the Enlightening ritual, which would have the downside of further complicating immigration, which I was planning on being the primary way I gain population. (just thought of a negative trait for my nation, they almost never breed because they're all partially brain-washed fanatics who are too busy obeying orders)

I guess this happening would also create some good tensions between my nation and Vanigo's, which should make things interesting.

Also, the "Enlightening" ritual I mentioned in my civ sheet was supposed to be a kind of mind-wash ritual which turns them into fanatics. It won't be used outside of the city after the city is made.

[Vanigo]

How would you explain where 3000 people suddenly came from?

That's a less significant issue than "I'm screwing you over with absolutely no justification." This is a game and games have rules. Even freeform roleplay generally doesn't let that kind of shit fly.

[Knight Otu]

How would you explain where 3000 people suddenly came from?

The easy way would be that it happened some years before the Eredor entered the game, especially so that your people can grow from that 3000 people to the number your cult needs to be on a mostly level field with the rest of the players. Even I as the GM can't simply go and say, you lose 3000 citizens, the 3 labor and 1 or 2 money they'd have provided, and a whole bunch of resources, short of a natural disaster roll. Imagine a chess player painting an opposing piece with his color during the game.

Edit to add:

I guess this happening would also create some good tensions between my nation and Vanigo's, which should make things interesting.

Sure, that's true. Nothing wrong with tension between two civilizations in the game. But it shouldn't come about due to tension between the players themselves, which is why something like that should be collaborated upon.

[abculatter_2]

Yeah, sorry. I'll just take a bunch of barbarians, then... what kind of barbarians have been made so far? How large and wide-spread are the greenskins, if that has been determined? I guess since I'm going to be in the middle of a large Savannah-like plain I could have the chosen one come from an African-like tribe... which gives me more ideas...

I'll rewrite my post after I'm done with this drawing, which shouldn't be too long...

[Vanigo]

The easy way would be that it happened some years before the Eredor entered the game, especially so that your people can grow from that 3000 people to the number your cult needs to be on a mostly level field with the rest of the players.

Except that an event like that would have completely changed Eredor, and it'd bear little resemblance to the civ I'm playing. One guy wanders into the city, brainwashes a third of the population in an hour, and walks out? That's the kind of shit that turns civilizations into paranoid military dictatorships.

[Cheddarius]

Why can't you just say he raided the little-known Enigmaron tribe in faraway lands or something? This seems to me like you are making a lot of argument over a relatively simple solution.

[abculatter_2]

I had a better idea, though the way I've written the beginning it may be a bit too much story then you guys may like...

Basically, instead of building a whole new city from scratch and from other people's, well, people, I'm going to have an afican-like village already at the location I want, and have the great prophet come from there. Then I'm going to have him unite a bunch of other villages with a great religious movement, then either a) raid you guys (and some other barbarians) or b) send firebrands to attempt to convert your people (and some other barbarians).

It does remove the showing of religious fanaticism by building an entire, gleaming city designed to reflect heaven itself in only a few years, though there are other ways to show that.

[Knight Otu]

Except that an event like that would have completely changed Eredor, and it'd bear little resemblance to the civ I'm playing. One guy wanders into the city, brainwashes a third of the population in an hour, and walks out? That's the kind of shit that turns civilizations into paranoid military dictatorships.

Easy ways and good ways do not always mesh, and that's the case here. It just was an example on why it wouldn't have impacted your position in the game if it had happened (which would only be the case if you had agreed - no matter what, the Eredor are your civilization). It's off the table now, anyway.

[Cheddarius]

Then I'm going to have him unite a bunch of other villages with a great religious movement, then either a) raid you guys (and some other barbarians) or b) send firebrands to attempt to convert your people (and some other barbarians).

You can't make up other peoples' pasts. It's all right if you do it for barbarians, but you can't just say "Hey, yeah, my guys totally owned your guys in this one battle, hahah" or whatnot. Any interactions you want, you will have to earn; in this case, by really raiding them.

[abculatter_2]

Then I'm going to have him unite a bunch of other villages with a great religious movement, then either a) raid you guys (and some other barbarians) or b) send firebrands to attempt to convert your people (and some other barbarians).

You can't make up other peoples' pasts. It's all right if you do it for barbarians, but you can't just say "Hey, yeah, my guys totally owned your guys in this one battle, hahah" or whatnot. Any interactions you want, you will have to earn; in this case, by really raiding them.

I know. I was giving my plans for later turns. Which I probably shouldn't have.


On another note, what kind of mounts do you think would suit an african-themed village? Should I make up an animal or just use horses or zebras (elephants I'm already using, and I'd like something faster anyway)?