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Author Topic: The Scale of the Universe  (Read 7998 times)

MrWiggles

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #75 on: February 16, 2010, 04:25:27 pm »

Lolz
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ductape

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #76 on: February 16, 2010, 05:40:54 pm »

heres the real facts (from the experts):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWVshkVF0SY

and another just for backup (also one of the most noted on the subject):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_J5rBxeTIk&feature=related

and something more modern:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFy5FN06_zU&feature=related
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Farce

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #77 on: February 17, 2010, 09:44:19 am »

Er, don't suppose anyone knows the title of the song to this thing?

lastofthelight

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #78 on: February 26, 2010, 09:49:09 am »

Reading this thread was interesting, a mixture of wonder and arrogance. The original link sadly is now dead, but I still find the comments interesting, and can easily imagine the sort of thing it linked to, having seen thousands of such things. I take interest in this sort of thread since I have a degree in a related field.

Anyways, whats interesting to me is just how grossly most people, in my opinion, overestimate how much we know of the universe, and our place within it. This is rather easy to do since we live in a culture which, like the Romans before it, assumes that it has essentially mastered everything worth mastering, and if there is anything left uin-mastered, it will soon fall before us or be understood.

Unfortunately, those scientists who keep abreast of the foundations of their fields know that they are never as solid as others would like to believe, and physics is no exception. If the string theorists whose theories are still in vogue (though less so every year) are correct, we see less of the universe then any caveman saw of the world, even with all of our telescopes and particle accelerators. If they are wrong, which they very well could be, then we are left with many puzzling questions about the fundamental nature of reality, and no clear answers except that our brains clearly did not evolve in such a manner as to allow us to easily comprehend it.

I don't really imagine most reading this post will pay much attention, or even understand what I mean, at least not to the scope of what I'm saying, which is a pity. I will say however that the more I learn of the universe, the more I am convinced we are but a dim candle in the middle of a dark room, and we cannot see much past our own flickering light. I don't think we've even really -begun- to understand the rules upon which the universe works, just the ones which happen to be the most prominent in the relatively small scale of energy and distance upon which our electromagnetic life operates. Even the portion of the universe along about the same scale and energies of us which we can perceive (i.e. the visible sky) isn't necessarily anything we can ever get to; despite what science fiction movies have trained you to believe.

But all this is natural, because each human is the center of his own world, within his own mind. Such it is, such has it always been.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2010, 09:55:02 am by lastofthelight »
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MrWiggles

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #79 on: February 26, 2010, 05:01:20 pm »

I'm personally hopping that the LHC tears asunder the standard model with some unexpected discovery.


There is lots we dont know, and the more we know the more we dont know. Kinda of awesome, if you grow conformable with the notion of not knowing. (Which most peeples are not okay with.)

Though we must have some things with a degree of correctness. The modern world is an appliance of science in many ways.
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Sowelu

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #80 on: February 26, 2010, 05:18:18 pm »

The original link sadly is now dead,

Works for me.  Maybe Newgrounds just bounced for a little while?  It's a very reliable site and I would be quite surprised if it went down or started deleting old movies...
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MrWiggles

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #81 on: February 26, 2010, 05:20:45 pm »

Newgrounds only delete movies that have a low score with the vote count.
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Sowelu

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #82 on: February 26, 2010, 05:29:14 pm »

Newgrounds only delete movies that have a low score with the vote count.
Which, if you've seen how people vote, is just about freakin' nothing.

I stumbled across some stupid "mech dressup" where you click buttons to cycle through different parts on a mech.  The interface was bad, the music was stolen, and the sounds were recorded too high so they were all staticky.  It got a LOT of reviews that rated it 9/10, and said it would be perfect if they added arena mode or something.  LOTS of people said it was a "great game".

...It wasn't a game.  It wasn't playable.  It was just a dressup.  There was nothing.  there.

Newgrounds is a pretty good site, but its users are braindead drooling morons.
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MrWiggles

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #83 on: February 26, 2010, 05:42:54 pm »

Newgrounds only delete movies that have a low score with the vote count.
Which, if you've seen how people vote, is just about freakin' nothing.

I stumbled across some stupid "mech dressup" where you click buttons to cycle through different parts on a mech.  The interface was bad, the music was stolen, and the sounds were recorded too high so they were all staticky.  It got a LOT of reviews that rated it 9/10, and said it would be perfect if they added arena mode or something.  LOTS of people said it was a "great game".

...It wasn't a game.  It wasn't playable.  It was just a dressup.  There was nothing.  there.

Newgrounds is a pretty good site, but its users are braindead drooling morons.

They can be. Almost all my votes show that I bring down the average, by .00013 percent.

The portal system based votes does stop various amount of trash getting through.

Though it is curious what they allow to get through. Thankfully the front page will rarely have shit like that dress up.
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lastofthelight

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #84 on: February 26, 2010, 07:21:02 pm »


The standard model, to be honest, has more holes then swiss cheese right now. Its not so much a 'model' as a patchwork of contradictory theories without any real philosophical basis to unify them.  We already -know- its wrong. The problem is for more then 30 years we've never found a better solution, unless you count String Theory, which despite its popularity with a good deal of people whose tenure and reputation now depends upon it, is clearly on the fast track to nowhere. This is actually the longest period physics has ever had, counting since the time of Newton's first public publication, without some sort of major revolution that overturned the paradigm. Which means whatever is coming is going to be huge.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2010, 07:22:34 pm by lastofthelight »
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Sowelu

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #85 on: February 26, 2010, 07:32:26 pm »

Hence the LHC!
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MrWiggles

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #86 on: February 26, 2010, 07:40:36 pm »

Double Post
« Last Edit: February 27, 2010, 07:59:26 pm by MrWiggles »
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MrWiggles

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #87 on: February 26, 2010, 07:43:23 pm »


The standard model, to be honest, has more holes then swiss cheese right now. Its not so much a 'model' as a patchwork of contradictory theories without any real philosophical basis to unify them.  We already -know- its wrong. The problem is for more then 30 years we've never found a better solution, unless you count String Theory, which despite its popularity with a good deal of people whose tenure and reputation now depends upon it, is clearly on the fast track to nowhere. This is actually the longest period physics has ever had, counting since the time of Newton's first public publication, without some sort of major revolution that overturned the paradigm. Which means whatever is coming is going to be huge.

Indeed. Every revolution in physics has change the world forever. Its an exciting time. We're on the cusp of being the future, ya know?



I havent been a fan of string theory, in its many flavors simply due to it not being science. Its just very nice looking math, but without empirical experimentation and observation its just speculation
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lastofthelight

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #88 on: February 27, 2010, 07:20:12 pm »

Yeah, I hesitate to say that in public, but no, string theory is not a science. It has failed in every major goal it has set itself, and there isn't even one set list of mathematical equations or derivations which allow one to say 'this is string theory'. Its just rubbage, really, and it is probably what has kept us back for the past 30 years, because a lot of very powerful faculty members in some big universities are fans of it, and their reputations and tenures depend on it.
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MrWiggles

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Re: The Scale of the Universe
« Reply #89 on: February 27, 2010, 08:11:00 pm »

Yeah, I hesitate to say that in public, but no, string theory is not a science. It has failed in every major goal it has set itself, and there isn't even one set list of mathematical equations or derivations which allow one to say 'this is string theory'. Its just rubbage, really, and it is probably what has kept us back for the past 30 years, because a lot of very powerful faculty members in some big universities are fans of it, and their reputations and tenures depend on it.

It also doesn't appear to be waning. It seems like academia is clinging to it, in absence of anything better or of equal substance.

On the face of it, all matter everywhere is attached to everything (at every time for some string theory flavor), sounds kinda of cool. It engages my imagination. Great for story telling. Poor science.


Hopefully the LHC, or the Nasa X-ray deep space telescope will provide some new observation to require a new theory. Maybe we'll get a handle on Dark Matter, and its even worse cousin Dark Energy.
This is refreshing; generally I end up defending science academia, and debating woo. Its nice to have a conversation acknowledging its flaws without it being used to disregard it as a whole.
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