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[Maximum Spin]

Not true anymore. Those are *old* diesel engines. Modern diesel engines arenīt fuel-interchangeable anymore.

I hadn't heard this. What a phenomenally terrible design decision.

[hector13]

Not true anymore. Those are *old* diesel engines. Modern diesel engines arenīt fuel-interchangeable anymore.

I hadn't heard this. What a phenomenally terrible design decision.

Only if you assume their main concern is who uses the vehicle.

[ChairmanPoo]

Not true anymore. Those are *old* diesel engines. Modern diesel engines arenīt fuel-interchangeable anymore.

I hadn't heard this. What a phenomenally terrible design decision.

IIRC the problem is the pumping system to kickstart the engines. Modern diesel engines use high efficiency pumps which are very sensitive to what kind of stuff you put into the tank.


EDIT:

https://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-efficiency/fuel-consumption/vegetable-oil-fuel.htm

To effectively use vegetable oil as fuel, some significant engine modifications are required. Start by installing some new fuel injector nozzles with an extensive filtering system to make sure only clean fuel gets into the combustion chamber. Those who use dirty cooking oil from restaurants must run the oil through several filters before they can pour it in their gas tank. Any fine, durable fabric can be used as a filter to keep out bits and pieces of food or other contaminants that could clog fuel lines -- a 40 micron mesh filter is recommended. New glow plugs, used to ignite the fuel in cold start conditions, can also improve performance if they are designed specifically for use with vegetable oil. Additional heating of the fuel can be accomplished by placing engine coolant lines in contact with fuel lines. The hot coolant will reduce the vegetable oil's viscosity.

Several companies produce kits that include everything needed to perform this modification. They range in price from a few hundred dollars to almost $3,000, not including installation. The Elsbett Company produces engines designed specifically to run on vegetable oil, although the company also performs engine conversions.

[LordBaal]

Thats a shortsigth... however yeah, one is supposed to be able to make a choice. It seems then that changing the fuel pump one migth get by? Oh saw the 3000 price tag... for that ammount you can buy a year supply worth of gas on the black market.

[ChairmanPoo]

Thats a shortsigth... however yeah, one is supposed to be able to make a choice. It seems then that changing the fuel pump one migth get by?

You can make an adaptation

And it's not shortsighted. Modern engines are more fuel efficient. You're matching the theoretical benefit of widespread use of alternative combustibles with the practical benefit of requiring less of the commercial ones.

[LordBaal]

Thats what I said one is supposed to be able to chose, not forced to. In ideal conditions thats nice, not everyone has to worry about fuel.

[ChairmanPoo]

You're "forced" to do many things on a daily basis, either by legal or economical constraints. It's naive to expect to be able to do anything at any time just because. In this scenario, there are many reasons not to bulk-build diesel cars to be able to use any fuel: it's a costly addittion, has clear economical and ecological drawbacks due to efficiency, and the gains are questionable (I dont think there are enough alternate oils produced in any given place to run the entire car fleet these days)

[LordBaal]

Either you are missing my point or something is lost on translation. What you wrote is what I meant. At first it would seem as an oversigth, however once you realize most people are not forced to find fuel alternatives like we do it makes sense.

Nevertheless the price of the convertion kit alone would buy you like 1000 L at current black market price, perhaps not a whole year worth of gas but almost a year. However we are reaching the point were even if you had the money there is not simply gas.

[ChairmanPoo]

And there still wouldn't be. You can't conjure used oil out of thin air. )

[LordBaal]

And there still wouldn't be. You can't conjure used oil out of thin air. )

I was talking about gasoline, diesel is still findable.

Theres still plenty of fertile soil, we could be using up ethanol or something like corn oil or whatever, and plenty of old tractors that could use alternative fuels to harvest and all, I should know, one of my works is selling spare tractor engine parts.

Solar electric seems the surefire way here. We have a rather large insolation and that makes one non dependant on the public infrastructure for both mobility and energy in general.

In an ideal world Venezuela's 100% electric grid would be supplied by hidroelectric, solar and wind. Heck hidro would suffice if not serious drough. The revolution destroyed the operative damns and failed to build the aditional ones they promised.

Hell we even have some lithium and latex/rubber production potential, along with iron, aluminium, rare earths and basically up to radioactive materials.

By all means all this crap we are enduring is absolutely needeless.

[martinuzz]

Hydroelectric power is a terrible power source. Dams are a main contributor to loss of biodiversity and destruction of ecosystems.

[ChairmanPoo]

Theres still plenty of fertile soil, we could be using up ethanol or something like corn oil or whatever, and plenty of old tractors that could use alternative fuels to harvest and all, I should know, one of my works is selling spare tractor engine parts.

Yes, and you say this because of all the countries which are successfully running on biodiesel

Oh wait

And mind you: biodiesel can be used in unmodded engines. These hacks are not even that.

Alternative fuels were a bust. It's not cost effective. You lose crops into the scheme and don't get significant amounts of fuel out of it.

[LordBaal]

And despite it we already had it as our mayor power production and have a few half way (or less) built. Is better than burning coal anyway. And solar and wind can be used to refill the damn. Is far from perfect but in our case very feasible and practical.

One could say that any power source is terrible given the mining operations or whatever needed to make solar panels, dead birds by wind turbines...


Chair Im saying that because we have no fuels rigth now, any alternatives, even the less cost effective would be welcomed. Im not trying to say that biofuels could be better or not, nor do I care, just stating this is uterly unnecesary and plenty of alternatives could be used as emergency measures.

[ChairmanPoo]

And I tell you its not going to fucking work. It was already tried elsewhere. It just drives food prices up. Do you want to pay even more for food?. No matter how bad you think it is, thoughtless campaigns can make it even worse

[LordBaal]

And I'm talking about artesanal (make your own stuff to get by) levels, you can't expect anything large scale or from the state here.

I know people that could make something like that but wont because they would go to jail and also we dont have a motor park that could use bio diesel (besides tractors and some old trucks) or ethanol or ethanol blends... its just a thougth experiment.

Regardless those people could use recicled oils as fiesel and surely some migth be doing it to help in their farms but wont say so ever.

Dont know why you keep arguing with me. Did bio fuels hurt you someway?