Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool  (Read 1769 times)

DanielZKlein

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« on: July 01, 2009, 05:14:39 am »
I'm having real trouble finding a starting position that has these features:

Flux Stone Yes
Aquifer No
River Yes
Underground Pool Yes
Magma Pool Yes

Everything else is set to N/A. I've created a number of LARGE worlds and whenever I run a site search with these settings, it's the Magma Pool that ends up red (could not find I guess).

Now my question is, is this in some way connected to one of the other features? As in, is there ONE of these things I could turn off to get a much better chance of magma pools? Or are they just that rare? Is there something I can tweak in the world generation parameters (minimum volcanism maybe?) or in the worldgen.txt that would make magma pools more common?
Logged

assimilateur

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2009, 05:30:57 am »
I know very little about world generation, so I wouldn't know how to tweak your gen parameters towards that end, but one thing comes to mind that might help you out. Namely, unless you have a good reason of preferring a magma pool to a pipe, you might try searching for a pipe as well (though not at the same time).

EDIT:

I'm using custom world_gen parameters I found on this board some time ago. I don't even remember in which way they differ from the defaults, nor what they were supposed to achieve, but it does seem that they should help you out, since I've been able to gen a 6x6 site with the features you specified.

Paste the following into your world_gen.txt, preferably changing the name LARGE to something more recognizable:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The world seed was 1293565594, randomly generated.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2009, 06:02:12 am by assimilateur »
Logged

cerapa

  • Bay Watcher
  • It wont bite....unless you are the sun.
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2009, 10:14:13 am »
Im fairly certain that some features are more important according to the finder.

Try changing the pool into a river or dont take the regular river. It simply cannot find the configuration.
Logged

Tick, tick, tick the time goes by,
tick, tick, tick the clock blows up.

Starver

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2009, 11:00:37 am »
Quote from: cerapa on July 01, 2009, 10:14:13 am
Im fairly certain that some features are more important according to the finder.
The finder could also do with a "Next location of this spec" option, so that you can leave some options unselected but review the location for either/or choices.  (It runs through the entire gamut anyway, why leave one with the (presumably) first found match?)

Also allows other intangible features to be selected for post-search, e.g. canyon-ridden location vs open plain, for otherwise the same river/etc options, or so you don't have to restrict yourself to just hot maps one run, and re-run temperate, etc, in order to try to find a site (with other specs) that's any temperature but freezing.


Noting that some of the 3rd-party Embarkation Helper-type tools that exist probably cover all those bases, but if more important game features/overhauls weren't being concentrated on I'd consider requesting the Creator to poke the Finder a bit to improve its response.
Logged

smjjames

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2009, 11:26:07 am »
You can also go to the init and set all features (or just the ones you want) to show as always on the embark screen.

The same options (not sure if show caves option is in the init) are also available with advanced worldgen, but that requires a new worldgen while editing the init just requires a game restart.
Logged

aklyatne

  • Bay Watcher
  • Menaces with spikes of, well, spikes.
    • View Profile
    • Stumbleupon profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2009, 11:57:40 am »
From what I've seen, magma pools and rivers only show up together in forests with aquifiers.  The only problem?  Underground pools have about a 99% chance of not being there.  Try taking out the river, and switching the underground pool to an underground river.
Logged
Don't even bother with trying to sp-
You have struck Alunite!
-ell my username.  Just type Ak or something.

Derakon

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2009, 12:37:52 pm »
Underground pools and magma pools are both mountain-only features, and they both only take up a single tile. Trying to get both of them close together is a crapshoot. Moreover, magma pools only occur in igneous rock (IIRC; certainly this is true for magma pipes and I'd be surprised if it weren't for pools as well). Igneous rock contains no flux stone.

The upshot of this is, you're highly unlikely to find a site that has that combination of features using the default map settings. What you need to do is make maps that have very small mountain ranges (to push the mountain features closer together) and that rapidly alternate between igneous and sedementary rock. Here, try mine.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Logged
Jetblade - an open-source Metroid/Castlevania game with procedurally-generated levels

smjjames

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2009, 12:59:22 pm »
Upping the number of volcanoes will greatly increase your chances of having magma pipes and pools in non-mountain areas, which is what I use.
Logged

Fossaman

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2009, 04:29:48 pm »
Magma pools are not mountain only. But it is probably the underground pool that's throwing off the search.

The other one that's going to be giving you trouble is the flux stone; magma pipes and pools usually appear in volcanic rocks, which exclude flux, typically. The only places you'll find flux and magma in the same place are going to be the boundary regions of the volcanic area.
Logged
Quote from: ThreeToe
This story had a slide down a chute. Everybody likes chutes.

arc

  • Escaped Lunatic
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2009, 04:50:08 pm »
Note that Marble is flux and appears more frequently with magma than sedimentary layers. If you want world gen details, I would:
1. since you don't want an ocean, set minimum elevation to 100.
2. for the underground pool, you need a mountain, and you need it on the border of one. try setting elevation variance to 1600.
3. for the river, set river starts to max. (800).
4. Magma gets trickier:
Option 1: set min/max volcanism to 99, and variance to 0. Note this will cause no sedimentary layers anywhere, so no importing most stone
Option 2: keep min/max at 0/100, but ramp up variance to 1600. This might require more generations, but there is a higher chance of flux, and won't mess with your civ's access.
Edit: Tael is correct, you will get odd maps, and you will need to set any rejection params to 0.
Hope that helps
« Last Edit: July 02, 2009, 12:46:29 am by arc »
Logged

Kode527

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2009, 04:57:49 pm »
What I do if I want some water and magma:
Make new map with params.
Set weighted ranges of volcanism to prefer high, 80-100 volcanic areas(around 50, other ranges 1-10).
Set high minimum volcano number, I think 20 is enough for large map.
Set high river starts, something like 400 or so.
generate the world

Dealing with wighted ranges and mesh sizes rather than minimum volcanism etc. won't give you tons of rejected maps and most likely You'll find a magma pipe and a river in 3x3 embark zone.
Logged

Tael

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2009, 08:18:37 pm »
Tinkering with any of these settings also probably means you need to tinker with some of the (HIGH, LOW, MID), (elevation, volcanism, drainage, etc) initial requirements. Generally lowering them can eliminate any mass cancel you get -- though you might get some slightly less natural looking maps.

If you play around with the map painter, you can, assuming you don't mind spending a rather large quantity of time, figure out a way to produce dwarven civs in an area where there is rapidly fluctuating levels of volcanism -- specifically, you could go through and paint it out to go from 1 to 100, in a set fashion.
Then after generating, figure out which ones yeilded the layers you liked -- do this a couple times, with every thing always appearing in the embark screen, and you should also be able to figure out what the minimum volcanism for: Magma pool and Magma Pipes. Then, begin abusing that information by making a large plot of repeating features of your favorite layers, and magma.
As a note: Only one magma pipe will ever exist per 16x16 embark area squares. Likewise for pools.
Considering they only appear towards the upper end of the volcanism spectrum, in a regular world generation, this leaves a fairly small number of maps which a pool will appear next to say, flux.

My notes concerning underground pools and underground rivers, is that they will ONLY ever appear in a square which looks like a mountain on the overmap. (Embark, overmap, worldmap from left to right is how it appears in DF.)
Logged

dogstile

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2009, 11:41:43 pm »
here you go dude, gen this world, i has all the features, although your'll get a pipe and a river instead of pools respectively

totally stolen from the dwarf heaven thread

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Logged
Quote from: Wraithsight on July 14, 2009, 07:33:54 pm
my champion is now holding his artifact crossbow by his upper left leg and still shooting with is just fine despite having no hands.
Quote from: Jim Groovester on July 14, 2009, 07:35:00 pm
What? He's firing from the hip.

twwolfe

  • Bay Watcher
  • Likes ponies for their cuteness
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2009, 08:55:18 am »
Quote from: dogstile on July 01, 2009, 11:41:43 pm
here you go dude, gen this world, i has all the features, although your'll get a pipe and a river instead of pools respectively

totally stolen from the dwarf heaven thread

Spoiler (click to show/hide)



beat me to it, but yes, this site should have everything you need, tho I've heard the rock layers can vary.
Logged
Quote from: Cotes on March 11, 2011, 02:02:55 pm
There are dwarves that are nothing but useless sacrifices - Miners are not one of them.

LegacyCWAL

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Having trouble finding a starting position with a magma pool
« Reply #14 on: July 02, 2009, 11:21:24 am »
Another option is Dathaecomo.  Just ignore the stuff about a community game and grab the starting location.
Logged
Quote from: ilurker on April 18, 2009, 07:36:57 pm
HIDE THE WOMEN AND DROWN THE CHILDREN, THE BARON HAS ARRIVED.