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[Maximum Spin]

I'd prefer not to get into details because I've already decided it's safer to be a little cagey about this.

Suffice to say that A) I'm reasonably confident that I was effectively bussed with the player who was targeted by the action that hit me, B) you very likely seem to have targeted that player and the one I'm voting, and C) I think the one I'm voting is the more likely of the two to be scum. As of right this second I have exactly zero compunctions about setting up the domino-lynch if I'm wrong, but I know everyone including me is usually against that, so I understand if others want to question it.

The player whose action hit me should be able to confirm whether *I* was fused with the player I'm voting, though, since that action includes information sent back to the sender. If there's two of it, then I must have made a mistake in my interpretation. But right now I think what I think.

[Elephant Parade]

The domino lynch would be really bad here.

[Imp]

I think the Esteemed Hector13's strong support today of the Esteemed Secretdorf is quite concerning from someone who D3 said they found their play NAI and/or 'I quietly held the idea that one is a baddie'.  Bolding is mine.

Spoiler: D3 statements involving Esteemed Secretdorf (click to show/hide)

Eh bugger it in fact, quite willing to accept Esteemed Secretdorf at this point won’t hammer this early.

Esteemed BlackHeartKabal

I didn’t say Esteemed Secretdorf is confirmed town, I said Esteemed The Candian kitten inspected them as such, and was curious how their inspection interacts with Millers and Godfathers.

If it works as any normal inspect, and the result is given via death and resurrection or not, then it doesn’t mean anything about Esteemed Secretdorf because we know there are a bajillion alignment-masking abilities around. If it ignores alignment-masking abilities, or is claimed as such, we can draw conclusions from that.

hopefully we can determine Esteemed The Canadian kitten’s limitations so we can say Esteemed Secretdorf is town and work from there.

Huh, still alive.

Pfp
I investigated Secretdorf, my result shows them as town

Esteemed Imp, the above is important. Please stop the rampant paranoia, unless you can convince me Esteemed The Canadian kitten and Esteemed Secretdorf are working together, in addition to Esteemed Maximum Spin’s current claims.

This is more interesting to discuss than Esteemed Secretdorf.

I suspect I know why you chat like this, but if this is some sort of gambit you’ve outed yourself and Esteemed Jim Groovester as being in cahoots.

Welp, I’m inclined not to vote for Esteemed Secretdorf this day.

PPE: maybe, anyway. Esteemed The Canadian kitten, does your abilities say anything about how they interact with Millers/Godfathers/anything that may change inspection results?

Also, while Esteemed Imp still has the role wiping ability, Esteemed Secretdorf is not a problem. Equally so if he’s town, scum have to kill ‘im.

Hey, anyone think there's a way to possibly be immune to the wipe?

Spoiler: D2 statements involving Esteemed Secretdorf (click to show/hide)

If Esteemed Secretdorf does gain Esteemed sofanthiel’s votes, what then?  ... That kind of nonsense.

Scum don’t need a vote to win the game.

Though it does help them gain majority quickly.

Quicker. They don’t need their own votes to do that. Letting the town lead themselves off a cliff, or otherwise give them a helping hand in the process achieves the same thing.

Esteemed Imp: can you explain how Esteemed Secretdorf either missing or refusing to answer that particular question is alignment indicative?

I have quietly held the idea that Esteemed Secretdorf is a baddie, but other people I trust have been less bothered by it, and it’s a lot to do with the NAI vote hoarding.

I would probably prefer the lynch order to be him then Esteemed sofanthiel.

Really? I don’t get that from Esteemed Secretdorf, but then again I am also very wary of people who have undue influence on the execution.

What makes you think they’re town, Esteemed Maximum Spin?

Oh that’s right. I was going to offer my vote to Esteemed webadict if Esteemed Secretdorf happened to become more influential, I can do it this way too.

So… sure, I’m using my vote now, Esteemed Imp, but at your word it shall be amended!

Can you help me understand what you're doing and why, Esteemed hector13?  What do you see about Esteemed Secretdorf that causes you to actually even attempt to shut me down about speaking my concerns, and to repeatedly try to defend this person who isn't even here, and never clearly said what they were doing most nights?

We have a lot of unclaimed stuff going on.  Want to share why you think and speak so well today of this 'I have quietly held the idea that Esteemed Secretdorf is a baddie' person?

[Maximum Spin]

Could you please try not being so colourful, too?

[Imp]

And I calmly observe the day name.

"The Same Situation But Worse".

What is worse?  Worse for who?

It's the same situation but worse...?... for Esteemed CrystalizedMire - worse how?  No way home, since the way home already is dead at this time?

It's the same situation but worse...?... for the Mafia team, who previously had one dead member and now have two dead members?

It's the same situation but worse...?... for town, who faced a Esteemed Secretdorf with 3 votes yesterday, and 5 today?

We don't know why or how those '3' votes 'from esteemed sofanthiel' appeared.  There's nothing in his role to suggest why or how he might provide two votes if robbed.

So far, all we've seen is Esteemed EuchreJack's hat that if somehow attained, 'grave robbing'? might explain it.  I don't see much evidence to support that, so I think there's another explanation, I just don't know what it is.

I still suspect Esteemed CrystalizedMire of having caused the infested upon Esteemed Jim Groovester's gun though, when she was not necessarily roleblocked N3, and actions happened before the banishment, we were told, but kills would have happened after.

[Secretdorf]

Secretdorf if you tried to fucking steal the same votes I tried to steal

we are going to have a problem

What are the chances-

Yeah, I stole Knightwing's vote. It's temporary since he's not going to be lynched today. I thought he wouldn't mind it.

I remain calmly but notably concerned about the Esteemed Secretdorf.

I note that the worthy did not need to hammer for Esteemed sofanthiel to die, and that one hammered anyway, at nearly the last possible moment, so it seems unlikely to attempt to prevent any other vote shenanigans besides that one's own.

What's the purpose of having all these votes if I can't even use them? Anyway my voting did not have any mechanical purpose behind it. And I'm not going to hammer anybody. I don't know what makes you think I would. Look, I know you are concerned about my votes, and their implications if I were anti-town, but I've been inspected as town now, I didn't make the kills cuz I stole votes, and I stole votes so I could prove I didn't make the kills. So I think you should focus on people who're actually scum.

The 2 votes from sofanthiel might have something to do with 2 people banished?

I  don't completely understand the case on hector, but from what I do understand it's something about the restrictions allowing hector to controls kills. And Hector says that's what produces the kill immunity. It's confusing and since max is no longer voting for hector I'm going to assume hector's cleared of that accusation for now.

[hector13]

jfc where am I repeatedly defending someone? Esteemed The Canadian kitten said Esteemed Secretdorf was town, and I said I was cool with that, saving potential Miller stuff. That’s all there is to it.

It means of all potential things to explore, Esteemed Secretdorf is not high on the list, particularly in light of your own ability to wipe the only thing that currently causes me any great concern from that slot, namely the excessive votes.

To be frank, should Esteemed Secretdorf prove to be the best lynch, I have zero issue with it. If everybody decides to lynch him over someone I consider a better target, I have little issue with it.

The only reason I have repeatedly stated that position is because you have repeatedly asked me about it, which is proving particularly pestiferous. If what I’m saying isn’t alleviating anxiety, asking the same question about it isn’t going to elicit a different answer, though to be fair, there is no more to it than what I’ve already said about it. Again and again.

If you think I’m worthy of suspicion please, for the love of wee man, find a different thing to poke at, because I will get less polite if you decide to push this pointless line of questioning further.

[Imp]

Esteemed Secretdorf:

Yeah, I stole Knightwing's vote. It's temporary since he's not going to be lynched today. I thought he wouldn't mind it.

Anyway my voting did not have any mechanical purpose behind it.

The 2 votes from sofanthiel might have something to do with 2 people banished?

So, D3 you had a total of 3 votes.

D5 you have a total of 5 votes.

You're not talking about that.

Why not?

Do you know where both the two new votes come from?

[Imp]

EBWOP

So, D3 you had a total of 3 votes.

D5 D4 you have a total of 5 votes.

[Secretdorf]

Oh that was because 1 vote came from the condition(7 or less votes on lynched person) being fulfilled.

[Imp]

Yeah, I stole Knightwing's vote. It's temporary since he's not going to be lynched today. I thought he wouldn't mind it.

No, I'm unsure because I don't want to be mean to someone who doesn't deserve it. Playing without a vote must be really boring.

What changed?

[Secretdorf]

Yeah, I stole Knightwing's vote. It's temporary since he's not going to be lynched today. I thought he wouldn't mind it.

No, I'm unsure because I don't want to be mean to someone who doesn't deserve it. Playing without a vote must be really boring.

What changed?

IIRC knightwing voted only once D1 if at all. I thought he wouldn't miss it. Sorry Knightwing, if that's not the case.

[Imp]

HA I FUCKING KNEW IT

Webadict

It’s 100% Web. He doesn’t have a inspect at all.

Hrm.  Yeah, regardless of how well or carefully he used it, he clearly didn't care about having it.  I guess, when I try to see things from your perspective, and I am trying to see things as you appear them, I don't see any evidence he valued it at all, either.

Have no fear.  I won't treat you worse than you treat others.  I value this game.

[Lenglon]

So, I just had a thought regarding why there was no mafiakill...

To the mafia: If one of your members self-identifies and notifies us that Secretdorf is a SK with a vest, I'm prepared to lynch dorf today. Your representative will, of course, be lynched tomorrow, but if dorf is a nightkill-immune SK you need him lynched before he becomes the sole lynch-arbiter or you lose with the town in a hail of hammers as NQT put it at day start.

[Secretdorf]

Hrm.  Yeah, regardless of how well or carefully he used it, he clearly didn't care about having it.  I guess, when I try to see things from your perspective, and I am trying to see things as you appear them, I don't see any evidence he valued it at all, either.

Have no fear.  I won't treat you worse than you treat others.  I value this game.

Good to know.

So, I just had a thought regarding why there was no mafiakill...

To the mafia: If one of your members self-identifies and notifies us that Secretdorf is a SK with a vest, I'm prepared to lynch dorf today. Your representative will, of course, be lynched tomorrow, but if dorf is a nightkill-immune SK you need him lynched before he becomes the sole lynch-arbiter or you lose with the town in a hail of hammers as NQT put it at day start.

If someone does that, I agree to go down without putting up a fight with my vote train.

The absence of a nightkill is probably because the last mafia member(s) is wary of tracking and other actions or because they're doing it arsonist style(BHK maybe). I'm still waiting for BHK and knightwing to claim their actions.