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Author Topic: FBYOR 6 - Game Over - Last Laughs Of The Dead  (Read 88481 times)

Imp

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #240 on: December 15, 2023, 06:44:04 pm »

Egan_BW:
Hey so...
attendance is mandatory ... "You must state your Class to proceed."

You claim we can't not be there.  But what if we don't choose to proceed.

And what happens to you if we won't play that game with you?

I wonder if this has a lot to do with this.

Yes, and Gate of Dreams when?

---

I don't know anything about Egan_BW's whatever.  Yet.

As is, it looks fun, distracting, and I have no idea how participation or non-participation affects others or empowers you.

But as much as this vision of Egan_BW's has disturbed my dreams, I feel a story spin.  I recall the Sanctum Sanctorum, to Doctor Strange, concerned about the impending threat posed by Thanos.  There and then he used the Eye of Agamotto to explore over 14 million possible futures, searching for the one path to victory.  That Eye also grants an unstable edge in combat, allows travel and dispels disguises and illusions, and has been called "one of the most powerful mystic conduits on this physical plane."  Though Agamotto is also said to be aware of its every use and can view those uses again later.

Might this be how we can know who watches the watchers?

---
Crystalizedmire:
It seems like pirates has a convert role and are most likely cults:
This could be, but if so they really revealed a lot early.  Stuff that probably didn't help their actual wincons, if the people revealing it didn't either 1) have to and 2) were talking about themself and not trying to set up for other stuff.  So I hugely wonder about why and how we can find out.  Since in my dreams Pirates were red, I do think they are scum and must die, converters or any other kind of scum.

I do wonder if we know there is conversion or if we guess and run with guesses.  I also know I do not not not want to be converted myself.

I can't believe I genuinely thought that maximum spin was being genuine when he said that they believe that imp is mafia. Oh well, I guess claiming protector and miller is still a little suspicious
Max is known to make wild early D1 statements, including direct lies, as town or scum.  That said, it's very, very early in the game to believe anyone is scum, no?  Curious if you'll share your thoughts about this.  That said, it's no biggie, I'm just surprised.

EuchreJack:
Also: Who wants to be a pirate?

Might be a subtle way to say 'EuchreJack is pirate-ally, please connect with EuchreJack, allies'.

At the time EuchreJack mentioned it, was the first mention of pirates in play.

hector13:
I am operating under the assumption there are at least four members of the mafia, given there are usually two in a nine-player game.

What are your thoughts about if there may be more than one scum team, and if you think that could be, what do you think of the likely scum team numbers?

do you have reason to believe Esteemed EuchreJack is something we need to worry about?

No.  Part of my posts are my reads to that point of play.  I don't expect I can keep up with the whole game as a whole.  I'll take it by parts, measured (if that works for me) by what happens in between my various posts, with my posts full of what I see fit to mention for myself and others.  That also helps me notice what jumps out at me later in rereads, a reminder of my thinking at the time.

I answer no specifically to 'Do I have reason'.  I'm leery because I had Pirates mentioned in my DM and EuchreJack mentioned them first of us all.  Also how he discussed them and his talk of what happens when he dies and what he claims about that item.  It has my attention, I don't have facts about it beyond what I initially said.

I note that Max posted since I asked but didn't answer my question about what flavor Miller.

Lenglon:
Imp: it's just math.
Ahh, the longer explanation works for how I think, thank you. Previous note discardable.

What advantage do you see in participating in Egan_BW's apparent sidegame?

Elephant Parade:
They day-inspect one of the claimed millers, Webadict strips the miller's role, someone night-inspects the miller. A Mafia -> Town result means they're definitely town. But having thought about it a little more, it probably wouldn't be worth it, especially since the night inspect would still be vulnerable to framing and redirects.

Thank you.  My thoughts on that complex path match your second thoughts.  Also, there's possibly more ideal uses for Webadict's stated ability.  Why'd you call that 'funny' instead of useful or whatever?  And if we did have a day inspect, any other ideas how it might be better used, since you've thought some now?

In that link you also go to great effort to make sure people don't try to kill you. I'm uncertain on the benefits of that since if it causes such issue for your enemies, why not risk having them kill you and causing them those issues? Another may have even greater benefit to the town at large than you, why risk losing them and causing no problems for your enemies, when your hostile loss from the game could?

Imp: Why did you decide to roleclaim? Is it just to ask for protection and request for the scum to leave you alive?

As to that, yuck.  I mentioned
I have weirdness with words this game and need clarification from Fallacy before I post much.

Well, I should have waited for that clarification.  I thought I worked around it, I was absolutely blindsided.  I thought roles/abilties/all that are private.  Whoops, no.  Confirmation revealed that any then-existing scum got told some of my PM, word for word.  Since I didn't know that before I made that first post, I removed a lot of choices from myself.  Because I know what scum were told and it basically draws a treasure map just doesn't say who to kill, but sure does say kill that person if you can.

And I said enough in that first post from what the 'Well, I thought this was just my private info to know, word for word' that if I were scum and read my first post - well chances were huge that scum knew I was that person and nobody else knew anything about it.

I thought about this and picked the path I picked from the remaining choices I saw possible to do.  How else to try and learn who watches the watchers?

I should point out, I can recruit 3 pirates at end of Day 1, and no more.

EuchreJack   omg.  Okay, Pirates are scum.  They are red.  They need to die for town to win.  I'd vote you myself but maybe you're jester (I don't know if there are jester).

Why are you telling us this?

Webadict, if you're taking votes for that power use, I am considering nominating EuchreJack, mindful that this may be a bad idea.

We should, based on what I have been told, treat that as equivalent to EuchreJack offering to nominate folks into the mafia team - it's just the other scumteam, if that is what red means.  Based on the wording of my PM, it is also possible that there are scum teams that do not yet exist, or there may be more than 2.
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For every trouble under the sun, there is an answer, or there is none.
If there is one, then seek until you find it.
If there is none, then never ever mind it.

EuchreJack

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #241 on: December 15, 2023, 06:52:50 pm »

I should point out, I can recruit 3 pirates at end of Day 1, and no more.

EuchreJack   omg.  Okay, Pirates are scum.  They are red.  They need to die for town to win.  I'd vote you myself but maybe you're jester (I don't know if there are jester).

Why are you telling us this?

Webadict, if you're taking votes for that power use, I am considering nominating EuchreJack, mindful that this may be a bad idea.

We should, based on what I have been told, treat that as equivalent to EuchreJack offering to nominate folks into the mafia team - it's just the other scumteam, if that is what red means.  Based on the wording of my PM, it is also possible that there are scum teams that do not yet exist, or there may be more than 2.
Hm, no.
Imp

Only reason I'm not voting you is because you suddenly posted this after my vote on Toonyman, who also seems to be making wrong assumptions about pirates.

Scum team Imp & Toonyman?

EuchreJack

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #242 on: December 15, 2023, 06:57:01 pm »

Well, I'm not completely unkillable, but I'm not going to give away the situation in which I can be killed.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say Max is town. He's usually not this obtuse and scummy when he actually rolls Mafia.

It seems like pirates has a convert role and are most likely cults:
EuchreJack: under what circumstances would you use an ability that forced the mafia to kill you, while simultaneously making you impossible to watch or protect?

I would quite readily use that ability. A 18 player game is crazy.

Also: Who wants to be a pirate?

A fair bit of paranoia.  And posting in thread, as opposed to the super-secret scumchat, means probably town.

The existence of a pirate alignment seems nearly confirmed barring a ToonyMan/Imp scumteam seeing EJ's post and pulling a weird gambit. That doesn't seem very likely, but I also don't know why cult!EJ would openly recruit. I guess it could be a fake masonizer ploy?

EuchreJack: What does becoming a pirate entail?
Ditto. Probably also town unless scum with Crystalizedmire.

I need to go to work, and then there's a bunch of other things I need to go do so don't expect me for a little while. Don't grow the thread too much plz
Says the guy in the 18 player game  ::)

Maximum Spin

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #243 on: December 15, 2023, 06:59:03 pm »

I'd say you could recruit me, but it would be a bad idea.
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Elephant Parade

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #244 on: December 15, 2023, 06:59:16 pm »

EuchreJack, you really need to answer my question; it wasn't just aimless rolefishing. What, exactly, does being made a Pirate do besides give access to a group chat?

Elephant Parade:
They day-inspect one of the claimed millers, Webadict strips the miller's role, someone night-inspects the miller. A Mafia -> Town result means they're definitely town. But having thought about it a little more, it probably wouldn't be worth it, especially since the night inspect would still be vulnerable to framing and redirects.

Thank you.  My thoughts on that complex path match your second thoughts.  Also, there's possibly more ideal uses for Webadict's stated ability.  Why'd you call that 'funny' instead of useful or whatever?  And if we did have a day inspect, any other ideas how it might be better used, since you've thought some now?
It's ironic to use Millerhood to categorically prove that someone is town. It isn't the day inspect that's the problem; it's the combination of day inspect, night inspect, and total role removal. These questions are a little silly and I find you a little sus.
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Lenglon

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #245 on: December 15, 2023, 07:02:23 pm »

Hector13: The list is in the order I was able to think up appropriate questions for appropriate people. a number of times I thought of a person but not a question for them, so that person shifted down the list, or I thought of a question but the person for it was someone other than I'd intended, and so an appropriate person was moved up. For example Egan was pushed down repeatedly because I had trouble thinking of an appropriate question.

Jack: Please do not recruit Max or Toony. I would prefer not to explain why I am making this request until day 2, but will if it is insisted upon.

Imp and Jack: It appears that you two are on the brink of thunderdoming. Would you please each make your case for why / why not pirates are scum?
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EuchreJack

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #246 on: December 15, 2023, 07:09:31 pm »

I'd say you could recruit me, but it would be a bad idea.
Awh, and we did so well until evil Toonyman joined us.  :'(
Oh well, guess others get the chance.

EuchreJack, you really need to answer my question; it wasn't just aimless rolefishing. What, exactly, does being made a Pirate do besides give access to a group chat?
It changes your alignment inspection to Pirate.
As you can probably have guessed by my softclaim to Toony of "Millers shouldn't claim", my alignment inspect is also Pirate.

Funny thing about those two: I can't see anything that says Pirate is mafia.  For all I know, Pirate inspects as teal, brown, blue. In other words, my assumption was that it is a third-party inspection, not a mafia inspection.

Jack: Please do not recruit Max or Toony. I would prefer not to explain why I am making this request until day 2, but will if it is insisted upon.
Max said it would be a bad idea to recruit him, and that is good enough for me.
I was never going to recruit Toony. He's too tricky as scum to risk it, and he's talented enough as town to not need it. He also got way too many chats in one of the Kill Webadict Nows, so there is a bit of compassion in that as well.

Also: See my above post as my "opening salvo".

EuchreJack

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #247 on: December 15, 2023, 07:16:18 pm »

I should also add that my crewmates only inspect as Pirate while I live. After my death, their inspection as Pirate ends.
So it provides cover to mafia from being inspected as mafia as well as hindering a townie from being inspected as town.

Elephant Parade

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #248 on: December 15, 2023, 07:16:43 pm »

Thanks. Followup question: is the success of the action conditional on the alignment inspection conversion working?
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EuchreJack

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #249 on: December 15, 2023, 07:22:12 pm »

Thanks. Followup question: is the success of the action conditional on the alignment inspection conversion working?
They get added to piratechat and they inspect as pirate. From what I can tell, the alignment inspection is a result of joining the pirate chat.
I am unsure if anything prevents them from being invited to the chat.

EuchreJack

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #250 on: December 15, 2023, 07:23:40 pm »

I have to head out to a party. Should I vote Jim so he can daykill me? Nah.

Egan_BW

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #251 on: December 15, 2023, 07:24:45 pm »

Look, I don't want to break keyfabe too much, but I have no idea how to work this into RP, so: Pirates are red colored. I feel this implicates EuchreJack.
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BlackHeartKabal

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #252 on: December 15, 2023, 07:24:53 pm »

oh god the replies

BHK: You pulled a 180 on voting Jim awful fast there, what specifically changed your mind?

I thought that we were voting Jim because we actually thought he was scum, instead of, apparently, to enable a daykill of his pick.

snip
I'm not conflating actions with alignment. I understand full well that role and alignment are two very different things and alignments can have powers that seem odd or counterproductive.

It's odd, to me, that a scum role would have the ability to carry out reprisal against the one method that Town has of reliably eliminating scum in absolutely any mafia game - the vote. Which of the two is more likely - that scum has a role that punishes the town for voting, or that it's simply a town role that can daykill someone that voted for them?

I had the impression that Jim was seen as genuinely suspicious. Why, then, would I not question why exactly we're fingering someone that's very likely town, in my eyes, as scum?

But then I realized that, oh, we're not voting Jim because he's scum, we're voting to let him daykill and give him his pick of target. Right?

Now I don't even know what we're doing with Jim because nobody is on the same page. In terms of actual leads, there's no way that there's this many millers, at least one of them inspects non-town because they aren't actually town. But at the same time, I want to know what the hell is going on with Jim now.
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Elephant Parade

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #253 on: December 15, 2023, 07:28:26 pm »

Thanks. Followup question: is the success of the action conditional on the alignment inspection conversion working?
They get added to piratechat and they inspect as pirate. From what I can tell, the alignment inspection is a result of joining the pirate chat.
I am unsure if anything prevents them from being invited to the chat.
Thanks. I'll get back to you in a bit.
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Crystalizedmire

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Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« Reply #254 on: December 15, 2023, 07:29:37 pm »

EuchreJack, you really need to answer my question; it wasn't just aimless rolefishing. What, exactly, does being made a Pirate do besides give access to a group chat?
It changes your alignment inspection to Pirate.
As you can probably have guessed by my softclaim to Toony of "Millers shouldn't claim", my alignment inspect is also Pirate.

Funny thing about those two: I can't see anything that says Pirate is mafia.  For all I know, Pirate inspects as teal, brown, blue. In other words, my assumption was that it is a third-party inspection, not a mafia inspection.
Pretty sure they arrrrrrrr:

Let's talk about alignments. There will be a Town team, and there will probably be a Mafia team. I may or may not include Third Parties, based both on randomness and player count, and in an especially big setup I may or may not include a second scumteam with a name such as Werewolves or Gamers. Or in short, there will be a Town, and there will also be an anti-Town, which will probably be the Mafia.
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