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[EuchreJack]

I'm still voting NQT since it's my preferred vote. Idk who I'm supposed to Vig if not 4mask though. I'm going to need a viable second option if you want to keep him alive Jim.

If NQT flips town I'm pretty lost, 4mask would be the best choice but it still leaves me uncomfortable to some things.
If NQT flips mafia I'd shoot 4mask. This won't whiff.

If 4mask flips town then I would shoot Jack actually, if that's also a whiff then look into NQT.
If 4mask flips mafia I would shoot NQT and if that's a whiff we'd look at Jim and go from there.

+1 to what Max just said.

@Toonyman: Why does 4maskwolf being town mean that I'm mafia?
I'm actually leaning towards 4maskwolf being town, and I'm town, so I would like to know where this is coming from.

[EuchreJack]

I'M NOT PLANNING ON HOPPING ON THE WAGON BUT I AM CURIOUS TO SEE HOW THE VOTES STACK UP, ESPECIALLY IN REGARDS TO PLAYERS WHO VOTED HIM PREVIOUSLY AND PLAYERS WHO ARE DEFINITELY POSITIVELY GOING TO SHOOT 4MASKWOLF DURING NIGHT 2.

I'M LOOKING AT YOU EUCHREJACK AND RODEN

WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO

Hi ChickenJim
Meet ChickenJack
(not comfortable voting right now)

[EuchreJack]

I'll add another of those evil IF statements:

If NQT flips town, I'd shoot Toonyman

Toony's throwing shade on NQT yet votes 4maskwolf.  Toony seems to suspect NQT yet prefers to vote 4maskwolf.

[Maximum Spin]

If Toony is mafia, then from my perspective it's almost certainly with a miller claim, since I don't believe there are four alignment-hiding abilities. Of course others will have to take me on faith that I have a town inspect on him, but I don't know how anyone can think I am possibly not town here. Especially if you are one of the millers: IF YOU ARE A MILLER THERE IS DEFINITELY A COP, GENIUS.
Now, the other possibility is maybe I got redirected and don't know it. Since it would have to have been a mafia redirect (town OUGHT to have admitted it so that the problem could be cleared up), it wouldn't be so hard to look for. Unfortunately, nobody's actions strike me as especially confirmable last night.

I don't have a good feeling for whether there are third-parties but the same basic calculus applies to a third-party ToonyMan except that there are then TWO outstanding mafia at least one of whom is still either a miller claim or a redirector (or ToonyMan is the one who redirected me).

For some reason a few people seem not to be town-reading me here, but I am definitely willing to agree to lynch Roden if I get to hammer. Anyone who tried to snipe the hammer would definitely be mafia, but that probably only happens if Roden is town or mafia-but-not-lying-about-his-role.

On the other hand, I feel good about lynching Jim because he claims to be a miller but thinks it's possible that there's no cop. Plus, he suggests that my usefulness is running out which implies that he thinks/hopes I can't confirm him for real. "Sure, maybe we accidentally lynch the cop but it's not like we need a cop anymore, right?" just seems a bit too dumb for Jim to have thought up.

Don't get me wrong, I could lynch Jack too for sure. I'm uncommitted, or I would have voted instead of unvoted. But I think the above are solid points.

[Roden]

I'm sorry, why are you even considering lynching me or Jack when Jack is obvtown and I made it clear I didn't want to Vig you?

[EuchreJack]

I think Max is building to a case on Jim by considering all the claimed Millers as suspects.
It is a very Cop thing to do.

[Maximum Spin]

I'm sorry, why are you even considering lynching me or Jack when Jack is obvtown and I made it clear I didn't want to Vig you?

Solely because, if you are town, we don't actually lose any power doing so if town hammers, and it might draw out mafia to hammer for the power, if they're dumb enough.

I don't agree that Jack is obvtown and, while I appreciate that you don't want to vig me, that doesn't actually make me assume you're town, like some kind of reverse OMGUS.

Still, Jim looks worst of the three.

[ToonyMan]

We are not voting a miller today.

If 4mask is a whiff I feel like NQT will whiff just as easily. It's basically the same argument. If both are town then I believe the mafia have to be Jack/Max, but they're being pretty high brain about it.

One of the reasons I don't believe this is because 4mask has shown no real desire to push cases on D2, when this was something he did multiple times on D1. This lack of drive could be due to personal reasons, but also maybe because mafia have no options and there's no point. Something that NQT has tried to alleviate.

If I'm a godfather then half the players in this game give bad results to our cop which is pretty twisted.

@Jack:
Because town!4mask is the only one that could have seen the real you.

[ToonyMan]

I'll add another of those evil IF statements:

If NQT flips town, I'd shoot Toonyman

Toony's throwing shade on NQT yet votes 4maskwolf.  Toony seems to suspect NQT yet prefers to vote 4maskwolf.

I don't like either. If you think I care which one dies first you're sorely mistaken.

Shooting me means you think I'm godfather or mafia with Max or some crazy redirection occured, so you would have to believe one of those is true.

I strongly suspect Max really is a cop, because his playstyle has been that way since D1. His actual alignment is unclear, but I do not feel comfortable voting Max over NQT or 4mask today. Maybe that is the correct move, but I don't think it's reasonable from our current position.

[ToonyMan]

I think Max is building to a case on Jim by considering all the claimed Millers as suspects.
It is a very Cop thing to do.

?
?

[ToonyMan]

PRETTY PLEASE?

Hrrrrrmmmmmmmmmmm

No.

4mask needs to give reads or something man.

[Maximum Spin]

I strongly suspect Max really is a cop, because his playstyle has been that way since D1. His actual alignment is unclear

Okay, even if I'm a mafia cop - what, it could happen - the mafia know who they are and aren't, so IN WHAT UNIVERSE ARE THERE SUPPOSED TO BE THREE MILLERS WITH NOBODY WHO WILL EVER NOTICE?

So what, third-party cop in this game where there has never been any evidence of third-parties? Okay, granted, I've been feeling this whole time like there is probably at least one third party out there, but even if that's the case, uh... why would it matter? I mean grant me that I'm clearly not a mally or I would have kept my results to my damn self; so I still have the incentive to out mafia correctly; so in what situation would you want to kill your only begotten cop BEFORE finding the mafia? Fine, fine, I know the next clause of your sentence was that you wouldn't vote for me, but the fact that my townness is even being debated is insane to me and makes me very suspicious of the individuals doing the debating.

We are only down one on day 2, it shouldn't be this chaotic.

If I'm a godfather then half the players in this game give bad results to our cop which is pretty twisted.

Which is why I clearly stated that if you are then one or more of the millers are fake.


Webadict: If a player is redirected onto himself with a non-self-targetable action, does the action still proceed? In particular, if a player uses a protect action on a target which is swapped with the protecting player, does that player successfully protect himself?

[TricMagic]

I don't like assertions of the form "if X is town, the team is Y and Z" unless I made them, because it reads like setting up your next two mislynches. I like them even less when I am Y.

Look, ToonyMan is maybe a godfather, but I'm definitely not teamed with him. I wouldn't be distancing so hard to say "actually I'm not convinced my result was even right, maybe he's just a godfather" FROM THE START if I was, probably.

... you know, I think we have to lynch a miller today. Unvote.
If not, it will be impossible to figure out the true answer if we lynch town.

Looks like you're starting early. Better than last minute votechange, but not be much?
That said, you're a role-cop right?
/// Jim being a redirector does not feel good. But I like the idea of 4mask being alive as mafia even less, given whatever item he got is probably pretty strong. There is also the chance they are the mafia team and there was no kill N1. A double-vote item late-game would not be great in mafia hands.

[ToonyMan]

@Max:
There is one mafia at most among Jack/Jim/Roden, do you agree?

[Maximum Spin]

That said, you're a role-cop right?

[INCOHERENT HISSING SOUNDS]