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[4maskwolf]

CHRISTMAS!

Bah, bug and hum!

[NJW2000]

Just woke up. Reading through thread, so you'll get my commentary as I go. Don't have a great deal of time right now, so you might have to wait for my full thoughts.

First off, that's unfortunate about IonMatrix, sad that RL stuff stopped him playing.

4Mask lynched... well, that doesn't surprise me too much. Especially with the weird cop not-claim thingy, I wondered if that would draw the nightkill onto them.

GAH. Why would you say that?
Ahh I shouldn't have said anything now there's information out that shouldn't be out!

Why exactly shouldn't it be out?

Re-reading. Thoughts so far:
- I sound like an idiot.
- I act like an idiot.
- I'm inclined to peg Naturegirl as noobtown, for the time being-- especially after IonMatrix's lynch.
- NJW2000 is giving me bad vibes now, and I don't know why. I'm worried I'm just reacting to his pressure on me... I'll look into the matter, but I shouldn't try to lynch on it. Yet.

- No
- No. Don't be so hard on yourself.
- Why?
- Yes, one should generally try to lynch on more than "bad vibes".  Like mechanical information, if there is any. This really isn't making you look any more town to me. Somewhat the opposite, really.


Ok... looks like today will be about claims and mechanical analysis, so I'll let go of the read-based case on Superdorf for now in favour of trying to work out what happened during the night. Pretty sure someone is lying. Not going to claim until I've figured out if I can get or give town information that way.

[Superdorf]

GAH. Why would you say that?
Ahh I shouldn't have said anything now there's information out that shouldn't be out!

Why exactly shouldn't it be out?

That was... now I think of it, that was a knee-jerk reaction on my part. I wasn't thinking in massclaim terms yet, so a soft doctor-claim still looked dangerous to me 'cos it draws nightkills. Now we're considering a massclaim, I'm not so worried.

No. Don't be so hard on yourself.

...Fair enough. Apparently I self-deprecate when I'm panicky too?

Why?

After misinterpreting IonMatrix erracticisms poor D1, I'm reluctant to lynch somebody based on erractic posting alone... and come to that, Naturegirl's
...but that's not a proper case is it? I should do something about that.
Naturegirl: Pooka's right... two doctors in one game is a little strange. I would like details on the nature of your role, please.

Yes, one should generally try to lynch on more than "bad vibes".  Like mechanical information, if there is any. This really isn't making you look any more town to me. Somewhat the opposite, really.

I'm aware. As I said, I'm not gonna build a case on my random hunches.
I am gonna try and figure out where you stand, tho. Who would you say is most likely to be lying right now?

Pooka: I would very much like to know who you visited last night-- if anyone-- and why.

[NJW2000]

I am gonna try and figure out where you stand, tho. Who would you say is most likely to be lying right now?

I would say you are, Superdorf.

I don't believe you were roleblocked, Superdorf. I believe you performed the mafia kill.

...Pooka's the roleblocker?
Pooka? What gives?

I'm unwilling to claim immediately, as withholding information is very useful for catching people in a lie, and there are two scum to catch. But I will say that I know this:

Pooka is not a roleblocker.

So Pooka could not have roleblocked you, Superdorf.

Pooka, could you confirm this please?

I don't think Persus could have roleblocked you, unless he's in a scumteam with Pooka, which I doubt, seeing as Persus tracked Pooka. I didn't roleblock you. I don't think Naturegirl did either, though this might be wrong. So why did you claim to be roleblocked, Superdorf?

[Naturegirl1999]

Why?

After misinterpreting IonMatrix erracticisms poor D1, I'm reluctant to lynch somebody based on erractic posting alone... and come to that, Naturegirl's
...but that's not a proper case is it? I should do something about that.
Naturegirl: Pooka's right... two doctors in one game is a little strange. I would like details on the nature of your role, please

Oh, I see the confusion, Doctors aren’t the only protective roles. I am a body guard. Had you been targeted, I would have died in your stead.

[Superdorf]

Oh, I see the confusion, Doctors aren’t the only protective roles. I am a body guard. Had you been targeted, I would have died in your stead.

Ohh that makes more sense... yeah okay.
That's an awful lot of trust to put in somebody tho. Maybe don't do that next game?

I don't think Persus could have roleblocked you, unless he's in a scumteam with Pooka, which I doubt, seeing as Persus tracked Pooka. I didn't roleblock you. I don't think Naturegirl did either, though this might be wrong. So why did you claim to be roleblocked, Superdorf?

Because... I was.

I was told I was roleblocked, and I was told Naturegirl visited me. That's all the N1 information I've got. I'd be lying if I said otherwise.

[NJW2000]

I was told I was roleblocked, and I was told Naturegirl visited me. That's all the N1 information I've got. I'd be lying if I said otherwise.

We'll see about that. But I think I'll wait for Pooka to confirm what he can and can't do in the way of roleblocking first. I'm not in any particular hurry.

[Naturegirl1999]

I’m also interested in Pooka’s doings N1

[Pooka]

Pooka is not a roleblocker.

So Pooka could not have roleblocked you, Superdorf.

Pooka, could you confirm this please?

I'm a Town 2-Shot Roleblocker. I did roleblock Superdorf at night.
The reason: I read NJW's post last Day which basically summed up in saying "Superdorf doesn't seem involved in the game and more so in buddying up to me," so after Ion flipped Town and me still not buying into the scummy Naturegirl theory, I thought I'd try my luck. If a kill was blocked, I have reason to suspect you, and if a kill wasn't blocked, I also have reason to believe you didn't do any killing that night.

So far, we have the following actions:
- Pooka (Roleblocker) roleblocked Superdorf (Role Cop)
- Naturegirl (Bodyguard) protected Superdorf (Role Cop)
- Persus (Universal Backup - Tracker) tracked Pooka (Roleblocker)
- Somebody killed 4maskwolf. Very likely NJW.

Not going to claim until I've figured out if I can get or give town information that way.

I'd rather you claim now. Nobody's going to wait for you to "get or give information before claiming", you see. All of us claimed in some form or another, it's now your turn.

[Superdorf]

Bwaahahaha

NJW, you were right about one thing... withholding information does come in handy for catching liars. Why under the sun were you so certain Pooka didn't roleblock me last night?

[NJW2000]

Not going to claim until I've figured out if I can get or give town information that way.

I'd rather you claim now. Nobody's going to wait for you to "get or give information before claiming", you see. All of us claimed in some form or another, it's now your turn.

I will absolutely claim now. Because now I know who the second scum is. Rather surprisingly, it's you, Pooka.

Claim: I am a Non-Consecutive Night Follower.

I followed Pooka, because I hadn't learned enough about him d1. He is not a roleblocker of any sort. His ability, which I do believe he used on Superdorf, is Watch. He gets to see who visited his target.

The reason: I read NJW's post last Day which basically summed up in saying "Superdorf doesn't seem involved in the game and more so in buddying up to me," so after Ion flipped Town and me still not buying into the scummy Naturegirl theory, I thought I'd try my luck. If a kill was blocked, I have reason to suspect you, and if a kill wasn't blocked, I also have reason to believe you didn't do any killing that night.

Apparently the mafia became a little anxious when I called out a scum player, but were afraid to nightkill Super's main critic. In Superdorf, this manifested as a sudden "hunch" I was scum. Pooka meanwhile decided to visit his scumbuddy - and claim roleblocker into the bargain. Not a bad tactic to restore his reputation, really.

Also very worth noting in the above post that Pooka says "if a kill was blocked, I have reason to suspect you, and if a kill wasn't blocked, I also have reason to believe you didn't do any killing that night", as if talking to Superdorf, the guy he supposedly roleblocked, while replying to me. In such a rush you copy-pasted your excuse from a scumchat, eh? I mean, it's more than I need, but still, thanks for the scumslip.

Bwaahahaha

NJW, you were right about one thing... withholding information does come in handy for catching liars. Why under the sun were you so certain Pooka didn't roleblock me last night?

Bwaahahaha indeed.

I was very sure that Pooka didn't roleblock Superdorf, because I knew he did not roleblock anyone. I honestly expected him to be town and confirm this, and to get Naturegirl or Persus as the other mafioso. Instead, it turned out Pooka was the other mafioso, and prefers attacking me to outing his scumbuddy. Superdorf lying about being roleblocked does make more sense this way, I now realise, given that his claim and Pooka's would be mutually reinforcing.

I waited to claim so I'd have a better idea who the second mafioso was. I had some ideas about how Persus and Naturegirl would have reacted in that situation, though I didn't think Pooka would target his scumbuddy with a Watch ability. I was wrong about that. That waiting paid off, as it turned out.

What I was not wrong about was that superdorf was scum.

Here are the night's actions:

- Pooka (Watcher) watched Superdorf (?)
- Naturegirl (Bodyguard) protected Superdorf (?)
- Persus (Universal Backup - Tracker) tracked Pooka (Watcher)
- NJW (Follower) followed Pooka (Watcher)
- Someone (almost definitely Superdorf) killed 4maskwolf.

[Persus13]

Why are you so certain about the Mafia's motivations for their decisions despite not being Mafia?

Icytea: If a Follower followed someone, would they receive the exact action taken by their target, or a more general descriptor (investigation, protection, etc.) I'm looking at MafiaWiki and it implies the latter, but I'm unsure how you'd implement.

[Persus13]

Naturegirl: Who do you plan on voting today?

[Persus13]

Also Naturegirl, I need you to fullclaim your role.

[Pooka]

I will absolutely claim now. Because now I know who the second scum is. Rather surprisingly, it's you, Pooka.

Claim: I am a Non-Consecutive Night Follower.

I followed Pooka, because I hadn't learned enough about him d1. He is not a roleblocker of any sort. His ability, which I do believe he used on Superdorf, is Watch. He gets to see who visited his target.

This is very, VERY juicy. You are definitely the scum I am looking for.

Apparently the mafia became a little anxious when I called out a scum player, but were afraid to nightkill Super's main critic. In Superdorf, this manifested as a sudden "hunch" I was scum. Pooka meanwhile decided to visit his scumbuddy - and claim roleblocker into the bargain. Not a bad tactic to restore his reputation, really.

I wish I had that tactic on me as scum, but unsurprisingly it's the truth.

The hunch you mention? I had that hunch because you were buddying up to me. It had nothing to do with Superdorf. It also just so happened that this hunch was part of my very first and only read list I had so far, when I felt I had enough info to decide who scaled who. Also, I read the last 150 posts or so. If we go with what you're saying that Superdorf and I are scumbuddies, then what you said before my reads list was not enough to have me panic about you going after him. There's literally nothing worrying my scum self in the game to warrant this maneuver of yours.

Also very worth noting in the above post that Pooka says "if a kill was blocked, I have reason to suspect you, and if a kill wasn't blocked, I also have reason to believe you didn't do any killing that night", as if talking to Superdorf, the guy he supposedly roleblocked, while replying to me. In such a rush you copy-pasted your excuse from a scumchat, eh? I mean, it's more than I need, but still, thanks for the scumslip.

You're really trying to find ANYTHING to make me look like the scum. I replied to you because you made the allegation that I was not the roleblocker, so I said yes, I am the roleblocker. Then I proceeded to answer Superdorf's question when he gave me the Finger of Suspicion:

...Pooka's the roleblocker?
Pooka? What gives?

I didn't quote it because 1) I'm lazy and I was distracted by talking to someone at the time, and 2) I figured it would be obvious who I was answering. The "you"s is Superdorf, the guy who asked me what gives.

Bwaahahaha indeed.

I was very sure that Pooka didn't roleblock Superdorf, because I knew he did not roleblock anyone. I honestly expected him to be town and confirm this, and to get Naturegirl or Persus as the other mafioso. Instead, it turned out Pooka was the other mafioso, and prefers attacking me to outing his scumbuddy. Superdorf lying about being roleblocked does make more sense this way, I now realise, given that his claim and Pooka's would be mutually reinforcing.

If I were a mafioso, I'd have done what you said, disown the roleblocking and pretend to be something else. But why would I just claim that I'm a roleblocker of all things publicly? I must be either a mad man of a mafioso walking into literal suicide, or...I'm actually a town roleblocker, as luck would have it.

That waiting paid off, as it turned out.

In your favor, that is, scum.

Here are the night's actions:
- Pooka (Watcher) watched Superdorf (?)
- Naturegirl (Bodyguard) protected Superdorf (?)
- Persus (Universal Backup - Tracker) tracked Pooka (Watcher)
- NJW (Follower) followed Pooka (Watcher)
- Someone (almost definitely Superdorf) killed 4maskwolf.

Actually come to think of it, I like how you claim I watched Superdorf, but only after Persus came out saying that I did visit Superdorf. This way, you would have a leg for your theory to stand on, since someone else can confirm I visited the dude, and then you managed to spin it up into a mutual lying story as some form of desperation attack or something.

...nevermind the fact that if it's indeed a scummy tactic and we were both scum, then Superdorf and I are exposed. I was the one to say that today is very possibly LyLo, and I could have just sit back and let town argue and lynched another townie without exposing myself or my scumbuddy. AT THE VERY LEAST, I could have roped someone other than scummy Superdorf with me.