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Glorious Arstotzka

17 (16%)

Glorious Moskurg

13 (12.3%)

Ingloriously Didn't Play

76 (71.7%)

Total Members Voted: 106

[Parsely]

Yeahhh but for it's cost, the Z only carries a disappointing amount of aircraft, when some fleet carriers of WW2 carried more than twice as many planes.

[Kashyyk]

The Z will be accompanied by a group of Wasp Nests however. Thus the Z can focus on launching jets and Haasts, whilst the Wasp Nest launches all the planes it's currently launching.

[Parsely]

Maybe. We can't tell our generals where and how to deploy our carriers.

[10ebbor10]

Anyway, let's do some math.


Based on rules

Cheap, this means it can be issued to every soldier, or as often as your generals decide is tactically sensible. A resource deficit of up to 2 makes a design Expensive, meaning it can only be issued to officers, or 1 in 10 men. A resource deficit of 3-5 makes a design Very Expensive, available to only about 1 in 100 men. A resource deficit of 6-9 makes a design a National Effort, you can only field one at a time- so this is only worthwhile if it's something like an enormous battleship, a nuke, or mecha-godzilla.

While obviously we're not handing out a carrier to every soldier, I'm going to assume that the Ratio's are correct.

That means that we can deploy 1 Z carrier for every 100 Wasp Nests. Or more likely, if we can deploy 10 Wasp Nests 365/365, we can deploy 1 Z carrier for a month.

In effect, this means that :

- Total plane carry capacity increases by 2%   
- Max amount of torpedo dropped increases by 5% 
- Jets can account for max 3% of our naval airfleet.

[Taricus]

The problem with escorting carriers with carriers is that there's only so much airspace for the carriers to launch aircraft into.

[Kashyyk]

I suspect Sensei has a different ratio in mind when it comes to warships, but we'd have to ask him to be sure.

[Parsely]

The problem with escorting carriers with carriers is that there's only so much airspace for the carriers to launch aircraft into.

Excuse me if I'm being ignorant, but can't they just spread out? There's an awful lot of space on the ocean.

[NUKE9.13]

Anyway, let's do some math.

This is assuming all that matters is quantity. If that were true, the Wasp's Nest would be beating the Santos easily, since even though it carries half the planes, the WN is 10x more common.
The quality of the ship matters as well. And the Z is way better than the Santos. It can scramble planes at a moments notice, gaining precious minutes that, despite being only a fraction of total engagement time, matter quite a bit. And the quality of planes it launches is also superior.

The problem with escorting carriers with carriers is that there's only so much airspace for the carriers to launch aircraft into.

Lolwut. I might be wrong, but given that airspace is three-dimensional, I'm pretty sure we could carpet the sea in carriers and still be able to launch planes from all of them.

[evictedSaint]

I suspect Sensei has a different ratio in mind when it comes to warships, but we'd have to ask him to be sure.

This.  I'm pretty sure a Cheap Tank doesn't mean we have 1:1 tanks to soldiers, so it's silly to assume ships behave by the same ratio.  It's much more a rule of thumb than a hard number.

Setting up our economy is something that's best done earlier on than later, and we actually have reason to do it now.

[10ebbor10]

Analysis based on turn reports


Turn 1 : Massive Cannalan Advantage

- No naval vessels + Ineffective Torpedo = Slaughter

Turn 2 : Major Naval Advantage (Forenia +)

- More planes results in air superiority
- Bombers overwhelm air defense
- Archer Destroyers do not have the strength to resist Cannalan firepower, but do have range

Turn 3 : Major Naval Advantage (No change)
- Carrier has arrived (Expensive)
- Weather prevents effective use

Turn 4 : Major Naval Advantage (No change)
- Cannalan's attempt to deploy more planes
- Sabotage hampers the airforce

Turn 5 : Naval advantage (Forenia +)
- Carrier and planes not expensive
- Improved Dolfin Torpedo

Turn 6 : Cannalan Major advantage (Forenia-)
- Cannalan Improved radar
- Cannalan AA cruiser expense credit

Turn 7 : Cannalan Naval advantage (Forenia+)
- Haast introduced
- Ship detecting radar introduced
- Winter Fog gives bonus to radar

Turn 8 Cannalan Major advantage (Forenia-)
- Santos carrier introduced
- Forenian air superiority disrupted

Turn 9  Cannalan Major advantage (Stagnant)
-Nothing happened


-Jet not deployed at Sea

[10ebbor10]

This.  I'm pretty sure a Cheap Tank doesn't mean we have 1:1 tanks to soldiers, so it's silly to assume ships behave by the same ratio.  It's much more a rule of thumb than a hard number.

I meant the ratio between the different expense levels. Ie, increasing or decreasing by x10 each time. I literally said that.


Anyway :

Based on Santos Introduction

While its aircraft capacity is a lot greater, it's also Expensive, so it's roughly a wash.

So, based on this, decreasing an expense level means twice the amount of ships. That means that 25% of our fleet will be new Z-class carriers.

- Total plane carry capacity increases by 50%   
- Max amount of torpedo dropped increases by 125% 
- Jets can account for max 50% of our naval airfleet.
- 40% of planes can be rapidly deployed

That'll leave a bigger mark.

[Taricus]

with escorting carriers with carriers is that there's only so much airspace for the carriers to launch aircraft into.

Lolwut. I might be wrong, but given that airspace is three-dimensional, I'm pretty sure we could carpet the sea in carriers and still be able to launch planes from all of them.
[/quote]

Airspace is three dimensional. But you've only got a certain amount of it where you can launch aircraft into and if you launch too fast there is a risk of collision. What having cheap carriers means is that we have more carrier task forces, not larger ones (Which is an advantage). We still need gun equipped ships to escort the carriers.

[10ebbor10]

Anyway, I think we should try to get proper naval radars up and running soon. Should only be a revision, but it's pretty powerfull, allowing night attacks and great use of the superior range of ships (rocket propelled shells FTW).

[Taricus]

Technically we've already got them. It's just they need an entire ship.

[10ebbor10]

Which is why I'm saying that they should be easy to revise. We have most of the tech.