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[Devastator]

Okay, so, whilst I don't think Wings of Brazen Flight are the way to go, if we do do them... why bother attaching it to a horse? Isn't the horse just dead weight once you're in the air?

Because it's more awesome that way.  And so you don't have the wind-propelling things attached to the guy trying to do the throwing.

..and dead weight isn't useless.  The way that is described, you could keep flying if the horse was dead.  Which means that it'll be much harder to kill the flying guy with an arrow, should that happen.

[NUKE9.13]

The raiders using back roads make sense, and presumably we'll be carrying on with such raids?

Nah, not without full control of the plains.

Okay, so, whilst I don't think Wings of Brazen Flight are the way to go, if we do do them... why bother attaching it to a horse? Isn't the horse just dead weight once you're in the air?

Because it's more awesome that way.  And so you don't have the wind-propelling things attached to the guy trying to do the throwing.

Yes, but... an entire horse. That does nothing except hang there, terrified. At the very least make it a wooden horse. Or a pair of skis.

[Taricus]

If we're going for skis we may as well go for elephants as well

[Devastator]

Yes, but... an entire horse. That does nothing except hang there, terrified. At the very least make it a wooden horse. Or a pair of skis.

Horses are cheap, and would require a minimum of design/revisions.  Besides, it's not like you're going to vote for it anyway.

[NUKE9.13]

Horses are cheap, and would require a minimum of design/revisions. 

You know what's cheaper than a horse? A length of wood. Also, pretty easy to design. You know what's expensive? An enchantment powerful enough to lift a person and an entire horse. Horses are heavy.
I mean, I still don't see why it can't just be attached to a harness worn by the paratrooper.

Besides, it's not like you're going to vote for it anyway.

I can still make suggestions to improve it, in case it does get the majority of votes.

[Devastator]

Horses are cheap, and would require a minimum of design/revisions. 

You know what's cheaper than a horse? A length of wood. Also, pretty easy to design. You know what's expensive? An enchantment powerful enough to lift a person and an entire horse. Horses are heavy.
I mean, I still don't see why it can't just be attached to a harness worn by the paratrooper.

Besides, it's not like you're going to vote for it anyway.

I can still make suggestions to improve it, in case it does get the majority of votes.

Game-wise, nothing is cheaper than cheap, so a length of wood may well be more valuable than a horse.

I find it very difficult to judge practicality in a world where rifled cannon are a thing predating the invention of a metal screw.  Or a standardized screw.  Maybe more ridiculous stuff works better?

Really, though, if you must vote for paratroopers, write it up next turn and I'll jump on it.

[Happerry]

Personally, as we're the faction from the desert, I'd think Flying Carpets would be our first go to thing for flight capable troops.

[NUKE9.13]

Personally, as we're the faction from the desert, I'd think Flying Carpets would be our first go to thing for flight capable troops.

Hmm, good point. If we insist on making a 'mount' for our flying troops, a carpet would be a thematically appropriate choice.
Although, there is also something to be said for originality.

[Kashyyk]

Brazen Flight (4) Egan_BW, Devastator, AoshimaMichio, Aigre Excaliber
Enchanted Steel (1) Detoxicated
Desert Winds: (7) NUKE9.13, Taricus, Happery, S34N1C, Sosoku234, Crazyabe, Kashyyk

My vote disappeared.

Another suggestion (for another turn):
Healing Hands: Our first foray into healing magic,  this spell pushes the target's natural recovery and immune system into overdrive, sealing wounds, fighting infection and fixing bones at many times the natural rate. This has the obvious benefit of reducing casualties after a battle,  but it also improves morale, as each soldier knows that an unlucky injury won't leave them in agonising pain for weeks or months, they'll be more willing to put themselves in harms way.

[Devastator]

Brazen Flight (4) Egan_BW, Devastator, AoshimaMichio, Aigre Excaliber
Enchanted Steel (1) Detoxicated
Desert Winds: (7) NUKE9.13, Taricus, Happery, S34N1C, Sosoku234, Crazyabe, Kashyyk

My vote disappeared.

Damn, sorry man.

I think the main reason I'm against Desert Winds is because it's a self-limiting design, it can't get us any more bonus than the penalty inflicted on us.  It can theoretically get a bonus, but that would only come after overcoming the sum of penalties inflicted on us.. we can't get a +1 with it until all of the -1s have been removed.  It doesn't remove the -1s and give us a +1 in a different area, which would be strictly superior.

[NUKE9.13]

Well, yes, but it removes -1s on every (land) front, in both skirmish and battle phases. That's a +6 change, if it works. (+2 if it's a national effort)

[Happerry]

Also if we combine it with something else that makes heat later on, both should be effective?

Speaking of later on, after we make the Desert Mirage spell and get some experience messing with air refraction, I'd like to create an Air Lens spell for long ranged vision that uses refraction to basically make a telescope, that way we can do extra extreme long ranged artillery and still shoot with actual aiming.

...And then after that, we can invent a giant magnifying glass spell that does a similar thing to make an area get more sunlight, letting us add even more heat to areas in a way that can combo with the desert winds. Assuming we want to heat things up even more at least.

[Madman198237]

They've got rifled guns now? What crap is THIS? AND they got ones? We rolled ones and couldn't even make a PERIOD-APPROPRIATE bodkin arrow. Please, just make them revise it this turn if they want it to work. Those guns shouldn't be capable of firing straight, their rifling and bores must be a tremendous mess. Please don't stretch this battle by letting them get away with ones. At LEAST make it such a horrendous job to load that it's not so overkill. They don't need bonuses to range at a 1. They should have issues with it.

So I want to know, eS: What's Arstotzka's luck been like with rolls? Have they been on a bad streak or what? Knowing what it is to get a bad streak, I could agree with SOME leniency if they've been getting crap on their designs for decades, but not fully-functioning far outside of time-period accurate and rifled artillery.

Here's the thing: They do NOT have the technology. It took 400 years of development of cannons to get them to shoot STRAIGHT. Let ALONE be rifled. Cannons couldn't be bored straight for the longest time. Then they could. But you can't just rifle a gun like that. You have to have a screw or drill capable of cutting iron, and you have to make sure that the guns are perfectly still and thick enough to take the removal of some metal. So, please, oh please, nerf their rifled guns. We rolled decently and out ballistae started out by shattering every once in a while. They roll perfect crap and can shoot without blowing the barrels out or missing completely?

For us, however.
Their cold is killing us. Even though it's somewhat unreasonable (The deserts get to below freezing in most places at night. There's nothing to hold the heat. Ours guys should be easily capable of wrapping up in their blankets.) to have us freezing to death in camp. The only place that should happen is on watch, and even that should not be an issue with more watch changes.

So, we need to counter their weather magic. Can we turn our storm magics into something capable of changing the temperature the way they do? We just need to temporarily heat the place to desert-like temperatures. Oh, and we're going to need to fix the jungle after this darn war....But first. The counter-tower idea is interesting. But we don't need to. We can summon storms right now, let's just summon heat AND storms. Spend a design to make a new Storm Strike capable of changing temperatures and climate, perhaps. Why waste our time developing stonemasonry and magic when we could just be developing magic?

Even if it is strictly attached to staves, say, we'll just produce enough of them to compensate. But for now, definitely expense credit the ships. We NEED to win the sea war. If we can amplify our raiding by raiding from the sea, we'll be set. We'll be capable of denying them food, troops (If the men are dead before signing up...), materiel, everything.

[Taricus]

Doesn't sound like they have rifled guns, just lucky hits really. I mean it was bound to happen sometime

[Madman198237]

Spoiler: You probably don't want to read this (click to show/hide)

Rifling?  They get rifling for a pair of ones?  Rifling that works and doesn't even nerf rate of fire?  Rifling that was successful nerfs rate of fire and adds cost.  Rifling that fails should get nothing.  For two ones on revision we got period-reasonable bodkin arrows that did essentially nothing, and they get a range category and more accuracy on their cannons.  I'm not even sure 1800s era rifling could work with the low pressure of steam.. I think it needed the explosive force to expand the wrapping into the grooves.

That's not even complaining about Steam Engines without riveting or welding to make pressure vessels..

Read the spoiler.

I won't spy on them. I haven't, and I won't. It ruins the game somewhat. But I will use other peoples' spying in this context, and that was ludicrous. Absolutely ludicrous. Allowing all that crap "because of magic." is very much not good enough, eS. At least, not in my mind. They just developed a 19th century weapon with late 19th century accuracy.....1000 years early? 900 years? I don't remember our exact date. But still. Without the technological know-how. And they rolled really, really bad. We got good rolls that left us burning men to death, exploding our ballistae, all that, yet "because of magic" they're getting good stuff for rolling a 1. Please, just get rid of that. I know, you don't like to go back and revise, but you did for the (Admittedly awesomely overpowered) flame projectiles, you can do it for their ridiculous cannons.