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[LordBaal]

The thing with socialism is the way is promoted. What if I tell you this revolver is a really good hair drier. People keep dying form using it but it's their fault because the don't know how to use it, or hasn't been implemented the rigth way. The fact people claim it's a hair dryer is moot, its a fucking revolver.

[Frumple]

Socialism is... working pretty well most places it's implemented, though. Much of europe, various developed nations that have cut other system excesses with socialist controls and means of mitigation, etc. It's not much of a revolver, if you're going with that comparison.

[JoshuaFH]

I think dictatorships just have a bad habit of trying to name themselves something else to get the thinnest veneer of legitimacy. I.e. The Democratic Republic of Congo and the like, and that a lot of dictators like to call themselves President despite not even resembling one. Pretending to be a democracy and/or capitalist country just plain doesn't work if any anyone is looking at you at all, but something like Socialist or Communist, where most people don't even have a vague image of what one is supposed to even look like when it's 'functioning' correctly, is an easier disguise to pull off.

[Kagus]

Like ski masks.

Ski masks are not made for robbing and killing people, they're made to keep your face warm. But people like wearing ski masks when they go robbing and killing people, so that's the image we have associated with them now.

They do work for keeping your face warm, but that's usually of secondary importance to whether or not you're currently killing someone.

[EnigmaticHat]

I agree with LordBaal that I don't think a fascist ruler would do worse than Maduro... not only has he fucked things up pretty badly, we likely won't know the extent of what he did to suppress people until after he's out of power.

Edit: although yeah socialism as I would define it is pretty common worldwide

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I don't think a fascist ruler would do worse than Maduro

what the fuck

[SalmonGod]

The thing with socialism is the way is promoted. What if I tell you this revolver is a really good hair drier. People keep dying form using it but it's their fault because the don't know how to use it, or hasn't been implemented the rigth way. The fact people claim it's a hair dryer is moot, its a fucking revolver.

I understand and am sorry for what you're going through there, but don't let it blind you.  Capitalism kills shitloads of people, too.  In the USA, we have tens of thousands tortured and enslaved in our privatized prison industry, tens of thousands die every year from our privatized healthcare system, food industry lobbies cause misery and death by the millions, and war is literally a for-profit industry.  Nevermind that the race to consume everything in the name of competition and profit is going to literally drive the human race to extinction.

It's pained me to read about your struggles to care for your family in that situation.  I have kids too.  My oldest is Type 1 diabetic.  I expect that he will die as a young adult, unless the perversing of our healthcare system by profit motives is addressed, or we don't become rich, or manage to leave the country.  Even disregarding that, we live paycheck to paycheck like most.  One misfortune away from losing our home and our lives spiraling out of control.  Debt stresses my wife so much that she sincerely considers killing herself.  Even though we both have decent paying jobs and our collective work hours often surpass 100 per week.  Both our kids suffer mental health problems from our inability to parent them properly as a result.  This in the supposedly most powerful, rich, and prosperous country in the world, which gets attributed to capitalism.

The stuff you're experiencing right now isn't because of socialism.  It's because your country is de-stabilized.  When non-socialist countries de-stabilize, the same things happen.  I don't have enough detailed knowledge to comment on whether/how socialism may have led to Venezuela's de-stabilization, but to claim that anything that's happening is unique to socialism or can be cured by capitalism is reactionary and has more historical evidence stacked up against it than there is evidence for any claim about socialism.

[Doomblade187]

I don't think a fascist ruler would do worse than Maduro

what the fuck

Maduro's pretty shitty, mate.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I don't think a fascist ruler would do worse than Maduro

what the fuck

Maduro's pretty shitty, mate.

Does the state department have dental?

Glad to see we've reached the fascist apologia stage here on Bay 12

[Kagus]

I mean, theoretically speaking, it should be technically possible to have a benevolent fascist regime... Just, y'know, slightly less likely than having a benevolent dictatorship.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Benevolent genocidal murderers, the newest theory from GD. It should be illegal to know this little of history.

[Doomblade187]

I don't think a fascist ruler would do worse than Maduro

what the fuck

Maduro's pretty shitty, mate.

Does the state department have dental?

Glad to see we've reached the fascist apologia stage here on Bay 12

Nah, we're trying to say that Maduro's basically a fascist/is as bad as a fascist. Because he's bad. Not because fascists are good.

[McTraveller]

For the record - most European nations are not socialist - they do not have public ownership of means of production. Most European "socialist" nations are technically "social democracies" - they are generally capitalist with heavily regulated private ownership and significant wealth redistribution programs - they don't have collective ownership in the sense that Venezuela nationalized industries.

[Magistrum]

The thing with socialism is the way is promoted. What if I tell you this revolver is a really good hair drier. People keep dying form using it but it's their fault because the don't know how to use it, or hasn't been implemented the right way. The fact people claim it's a hair dryer is moot, its a fucking revolver.

I would like to remind you that we got the same shit in Brazil from people who said they were saving us from socialism. Don't let yourself be fooled Baal, bad men will perform bad deeds under any banner.

[MrRoboto75]

I'm pretty sure not every hair dryer has a slot for 38 special.