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[LoSboccacc]

And the whole point of bringing up the crime rate among blacks is to make a racist point. When economics is taken into account, it's found that poverty is the big predictor of violent crime, not race:

http://egov.ufsc.br/portal/sites/default/files/anexos/33027-41458-1-PB.pdf
http://sf.oxfordjournals.org/content/75/2/619

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

edit:
and the pdf yourself linked says basically the same:

"The percent Black population variable was found to
have a strong effect in the White-on-Black, White-onWhite,
and Black-on-White violent crime rate models (p312)"

edit 2:
oh and it gets better:
"The results of this analysis showed clearly that the
effects of economic inequality on rates of violent crime
were consistent with the work of Blau and his
associates."

so yes if you account for non-violent crime (burglaries et al) and look very hard at it, a narrow subset of crime (black on black) is correlated with poverty. good source there. otherwise the point stands strong for violent crime.

[Reelya]

It seems weird that more black people cause white on white crime - from your quote. That suggests there's another factor in those neighborhoods. Whites in those areas are also committing more crimes against people of ALL races, including themselves.

You know, that one chart you listed is from nationalvanguard.org which is a white supremicist website. D'ya think they might have deliberately cherry picked the specific stats they're showing? I mean, they've got pro-Dylann Roof articles, telling future Dylann Roof's how to fight against black people more effectively. And they've got articles attacking Neil Degrasse Tyson as a "mulatto". Fuck them and please check your sources in future.

[LoSboccacc]

It seems weird that more black people cause white on white crime - from your quote. That suggests there's another factor in those neighborhoods. Whites in those areas are also committing more crimes against people of ALL races.

You know, that one chart you listed is from nationalvanguard.org which is a white supremicist website. D'ya think they might have deliberately cherry picked the specific stats they're showing? I mean, they've got pro-Dylann Roof articles, telling future Dylann Roof's how to fight against black people more effectively. And they've got articles attacking Neil Degrasse Tyson as a "mulatto". Fuck them and please check your sources in future.

1) the quote is in the paper YOU linked.

2) you're free to provide more data. so far, the last paper YOU linked supported the same claim.

[Reelya]

Yes, but you haven't explained the quote. It says the opposite of what you think it says. White people's level of criminality is strongly predicted by being in poor black neighborhoods. Clearly, that's not anything to do with "being white". So it's also hard to claim that merely "being black" is the root cause of a black kid in the same neighborhood having a higher criminality.

To explain that away in your version of events, you'd have to dismiss higher white-on-white / white-on-black crime in the ghetto, as being merely victims of circumstance, while claiming black-on-white and black-on-black crime proves that they're naturally criminal. Which is a clear double standard.

Your data source was printed on a NEO-Nazi site and cites data from a study done by an overtly racist non profit organization rather than any sort of reputable academic publication. How is that at all on par with academic citations?
http://www.amren.com/the-color-of-crime/

[LoSboccacc]

Yes, but you haven't explained the quote. It says the opposite of what you think it says. White people's level of criminality is strongly predicted by being in poor black neighborhoods.

I don't know, why don't you try and explain it since it's in the paper *you* linked? Sound's pretty clear:

"The percent Black population variable was found to have a strong effect in the White-on-Black, White-onWhite, and Black-on-White violent crime rate models"

but now you want me to debunk the paper you linked so I can argue with myself? I don't understand. Both sources have the same claim, I'm waiting you to provide a different one instead of twisting a clear sentence that I've not wrote but originally came linked from you. Do you trust your own linked paper data or not, and if not why did you link it in the first place?

[Karnewarrior]

And they've got articles attacking Neil Degrasse Tyson as a "mulatto".

So is it a scientific fact yet that half-breeds are always attractive? Because it sure as hell seems like it is; I swear you could get the most hawkishly deformed white old crone and the most hideously ugly black guy ever and make them have a baby and it'd be beautiful.

[LoSboccacc]

And they've got articles attacking Neil Degrasse Tyson as a "mulatto".

So is it a scientific fact yet that half-breeds are always attractive? Because it sure as hell seems like it is; I swear you could get the most hawkishly deformed white old crone and the most hideously ugly black guy ever and make them have a baby and it'd be beautiful.

it seems they truly are perceived as so, even if studies are very few http://psych.cf.ac.uk/home2/lewis/44%20Lewis%20Mixed%20Race%20(Perception%202010).pdf (but psychological studies have a lower standard than those based on numbers, so there's that)

[Reelya]

I don't know, why don't you try and explain it since it's in the paper *you* linked? Sound's pretty clear:

"The percent Black population variable was found to have a strong effect in the White-on-Black, White-onWhite, and Black-on-White violent crime rate models"

I already explained it

A "variable" having a strong effect on another variable proves correlation not causation. So what we can say from that data is that violent crime overall - for all races is correlated with being in an area with more black people.

Black people have much more systemic poverty and disadvantage, so naturally anything that is caused by poverty will be correlated with the proportion of black people there. That doesn't prove that "being black" is the cause. And the higher white-on-white violent crime in those areas backs that up - are they more violent because they're white, or because of the environment they find themselves in? And if white people are excused for higher violent crime, because of the environment, then naturally the same factors would have to be accepted as affecting black people's behavior.

[DJ]

But didn't we just have graphs that show that correlation between crime and poverty is weak? Though I think that this needs to take into account population density as well, I reckon that urban areas are more prone to violent crime than rural ones, and I'm guessing that most of the poor blacks are in inner cities while poor whites are in trailer parks out in the boondocks.

[Reelya]

Those graphs came from a dubious source - a study done by a far-right anti-immigrant group with no academic connections.
http://www.amren.com/ is who produced the data, if you follow what's actually stated on the posted graphs, that's what you find.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Renaissance_(magazine)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Taylor

I mean, the study was actually done by a neo-nazi organization as far as I can tell, not just cited. The guy is friends with senior members of the KKK, and his organization generated the data used in those graphs. "We have graphs" proves nothing if those graphs were made with junk data. Actually, the fact that someone went looking for data and the first thing they find to support their case is homemade data from a KKK affiliate might suggest there's some problem getting proper data that agrees with you.

[LoSboccacc]

eh, again, the data you yourself sourced had the same conclusion. but eh I guess attacking who plotted the data is more relevant to the discussion. so I cobbled together this gif from better sources, make of it what you will.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Reelya]

Well no, what you highlighted showed that white people in those same areas are also more violent to other white people. In fact, everyone was more violent in the ghetto to everyone else, regardless of race. That's what the quote you pulled out shows.

[LoSboccacc]

Well no, what you highlighted showed that white people in those same areas are also more violent to other white people. In fact, everyone was more violent in the ghetto to everyone else, regardless of race. That's what the quote you pulled out shows.

yep, every quote/data around points toward "multicultural places having more crime"

[Reelya]

If whites are committing more violent crimes against other whites, how can you say that's another races fault? It kinda seems two-faced to blame other races for what whites do to each other, then blame other races themselves for their own crime rate.

[LoSboccacc]

If whites are committing more violent crimes against other whites, how can you say that's another races fault? It kinda seems two-faced to blame other races for what whites do to each other, then blame other races themselves for their own crime rate.

here's the thing I'm not stating it. data does. reason for it is to be looked in there, and I have no clue. but there's no going around it.