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[Cheeetar]

echo chamber or not (not that I would have made the accusation myself)

Meanwhile...

I mean christ, I almost spit my tea out at the bit where you started talking about an echo chamber. Have you even read the last fifty pages?

[Frumple]

... y'know, when you put it that way, the trump support makes more sense >_>

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Gentlemen, please. This is all a big misunderstanding. We all know that CTR first and foremost stands for Crash Team Racing.

[SalmonGod]

Bay12 is definitely left-leaning, but I think the only thing we truly echo chamber on is LGBTQ and feminist topics.  You'll get punted right out for being on the wrong side of that one.  Any other topic, you can get a fair say in, so long as you actually have something of substance to say.  You'll likely find your fiercer opponents, but you'll find that absolutely anywhere.  That anyone is present who bothers to have a strong, outspoken opinion against yours does not make an echo-chamber.

On the topic of Trump, specifically, the problem is there's just no substance there.  The only three angles of support I've seen for him are:
1.  Hardcore right-wingers who don't really even care who's running for them.  They'd vote for the devil before ever voting for any Democrat or liberal party.
2.  Bigoted culture warriors who don't care how incompetent he is or ugly his character - they're just enjoying the rallying cry.
3.  Those who are disgusted by both, but more so by Hillary for whatever reasons.

If you have another one, I'd like to hear it.

[Sheb]

SG: I'd add "people for whom getting the conservative on the supreme court trump single other issue". I've been discussing with a fervent Catholic who agrees that Trump sucks balls, but he's willing to hold is nose in order to get conservative justices on the Court that would be anti-abortion.

[SalmonGod]

SG: I'd had "people for whom getting the conservative on the supreme court go above every single other issue". I've been discussing with a fervent Catholics who agree that Trump sucks balls, but he's willing to hold is nose in order to get conservative justice on the Court that would be anti-abortion.

Yeah, this makes sense.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

SG: I'd had "people for whom getting the conservative on the supreme court go above every single other issue". I've been discussing with a fervent Catholics who agree that Trump sucks balls, but he's willing to hold is nose in order to get conservative justice on the Court that would be anti-abortion.

Yeah, this makes sense.

There's also "the active desire to ruin the US government aka watch the world burn", which actually was my motivation for a while, but Trump is just too slimy even for that. Clinton's gonna kill us all, but at least she can basically operate.

[Frumple]

... yeah, the problem for trump is that the trump people are already trumping. What these things are trying to do are draw in the folks that are undecided (or, in the case of trump, draw back the conservatives his latest shit has been running off), and they're notably more sensitive to stuff like those lowest standards. Trump needed a lot of stuff he didn't provide to win those folks over, at least so far as the debate goes. Had some sound bites that will play well with some of his core, but they're already voting for him and on everything else he didn't exactly do well. Better than the first debate, maybe, but that's not exactly a high bar to pass.

Though damn. Noticed it meandering around elsewhere, though I've no clue who the vogel guy is.

Looking for precedent for Trump's promise to put Hillary in jail if he wins? Yanukovych (a past @PaulManafort client) did it to Tymoshenko.

[Karnewarrior]

SG: I'd had "people for whom getting the conservative on the supreme court go above every single other issue". I've been discussing with a fervent Catholics who agree that Trump sucks balls, but he's willing to hold is nose in order to get conservative justice on the Court that would be anti-abortion.

Yeah, this makes sense.

There's also "the active desire to ruin the US government aka watch the world burn", which actually was my motivation for a while, but Trump is just too slimy even for that. Clinton's gonna kill us all, but at least she can basically operate.

I'd feel a lot safer with my last few months in the military being under Clinton command than Trump, even though I suspect (through inference from American History, which is about as objective as one can get on a subject as throny and fluid as politics) that both of them will end up getting us into major wars if elected.

The major difference is that I believe Hillary has a better capability to fight a major war, whereas Trump does not. Hillary, for all her crazed faces, hawkish bloodlust, and robotic, possibly luciferian demeanor, has a cool and collected head on her shoulders and bothers to think through "What do I do if I lose?", whereas Trump appears to lack basically any understanding of any phrase that would imply his own loss, or is cock-blocked by his own F/SN!Gilgamesh-sized ego.

Remember, Trump said that he would be able to make Mexico pay for that ridiculous wall. Mexico, who is under literally no obligation whatsoever to actually do that. That would be like if Quagmire told Peter Griffin that Peter would be paying for Quagmire's Chlamydia Treatment, because Peter was the one who drove the car that took him to the whorehouse he caught it at. Except instead of getting a Family Guy Judge, who might actually make that case happen, they instead had Judge Dredd, and prostitution was highly illegal.

As much as the Oompaloompa is far more entertaining than T-1000, he doesn't seem to have a basic grasp of how politics actually works. He knows memetics, and he knows business, but those two things are very, very different from Politics and Diplomacy.

[Reelya]

I could shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose any voters

Apparently shooting people is ok, but talking about groping pussies is not. Well, actually I buy that for the President. A president not prepared to shoot a bunch of people might be hampered in his duties, whereas too much pussy-groping could sidetrack things.

[Frumple]

... no?

And karne, it's becoming increasingly questionable that the guy actually knows business, ha... and it didn't start out on the strongest grounds to begin with.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

In fairness, Trump said he could shoot someone without losing voters, but he wanted to grope women.

[Karnewarrior]

... no?

And karne, it's becoming increasingly questionable that the guy actually knows business, ha... and it didn't start out on the strongest grounds to begin with.

I heard he managed to make a small loan of a million dollars into one of the biggest name-brands of all time, so...

[Frumple]

More like an inheritance at least ten times that (and I'm pretty sure that's my memory significantly lowballing it), and still needed his father's connections and repeated bailing out over the years :V

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Let us not forget that one of Trump's claims to fame until this year was putting a bank's investment in him so far in the hole they had to give him a seat on the board to survive when he threatened to default.