Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Frumple]

The 30k-ish noted was a set of (purely personal, according to clinton or her staff or somethin') emails that was ordered deleted in 2014, well before the subpoena. Whatever staffer that was supposed to do it apparently stuck them somewhere and then stuck their finger up their bum for some months, before noticing (while the investigation was ongoing) they hadn't done what they'd been told to do, and, well, did it. Cue the nonsense in question. That's the gist of it, as near as I've noticed, though it's certainly late enough and my head hurting enough I could be forgetting some stuff that's not just mostly pointless details.

Iirc that 538 thing I linked a few pages back had a blurb on the subject, if you want some more specifics.

As for the law broken or crime committed, well. There isn't one. Not that it's stopping certain elements from claiming there was.

[Sergarr]

So why the hell is this still a thing?

Because Republicans have not managed to find any real dirt on Hillary, and thus have resorted to, literally, pushing forced memes, hoping that it will just stick regardless of any factual and legal evidence. Sadly enough, they were right, and it worked. Thankfully, it only worked on their supporters, and those are less than a half of all Americans; Thank God for that, or else USA would be already under their evil rule.

[Loud Whispers]

Bay12 is definitely left-leaning, but I think the only thing we truly echo chamber on is LGBTQ and feminist topics.  You'll get punted right out for being on the wrong side of that one.

Tbh I've had more polarized discussions on fishing than lugbut or feminism topics on bay12, this is a pretty nice forum

On the topic of Trump, specifically, the problem is there's just no substance there.  The only three angles of support I've seen for him are:
If you have another one, I'd like to hear it.

• Making matter and antimatter touch

[martinuzz]

I think that if Trump wins the elections, Sweden will form a Coalition of the Willing Feminists and invade the US to free opressed women.

[Max™]

I thought this thread, once we figured out the right lengths of rope to tie mainiac and RedKing to their posts so they can't maul each other, was, well, lemme think.

• We need to create some sort of system to take warfare out of the hands of governments!
  
• Perhaps some sort of neutral site which operates an army for hire.
• Though we'd need to handle the possibility of a nuclear power getting angry at them.
  
• We need to build a Metal Gear!
• That happened at least one more time.
  
• We all underwent intense past-life-regression therapy, got in touch with ourselves, and mostly forgot about it all.
• Every so often someone would try to interrupt the nonsense and shitposting by trying to seriously discuss the reasoning behind the most recent absurdity to come out of this election season.
  
• I pop in giggling now and then, seriously sharing links to stories with headlines the likes of which Larry Niven would declare too campy and lacking a plausible connection to reality.
• Someone suggests that there is a good chance this election could go badly no matter what.
  
• Someone else says we might need to prepare for the worst and start putting into place programs to archive everything about everyone off of the internet and various forms of media, for safe keeping.
• All of us have reasons to be leery about taking part in it so we would include blind spots hiding blacklists hiding encrypted drives full of noise where there should be info about ourselves.
  
• For the hell of it I suggest we should find some way to work that metal gear idea into it all.
• Trump says something amazingly dumb or offensive or flat out false.
  
• Everyone pauses to see how he reacts when he realizes he has a chance to fix his error.
• Everyone ceases to be surprised when he doubles down every fucking time.

[Dorsidwarf]

you forgot

• Florida man/woman bounds into our lives once again
• Coloring in maps

[Max™]

Kuwabara, kuwabara...

[Reelya]

We need to create some sort of system to take warfare out of the hands of governments!

EDIT Uh, I read that as welfare. Shouldn't stay up so late.

Perhaps some sort of neutral site which operates an army for hire.

So it's a business? Who hires and pays them? What do they do if they don't get paid? And is there competition, e.g. one state might hire one army, another state hires a different army? Also, then what would stop the armies conflicting with each other, they'd be business rivals after all, so it would pay to discredit each other. And if it's a "neutral" single provider, then I think it would become politicized or corrupt in just about no time. Perhaps worse than now, because they would technically be a black-box company not beholden to elected oversight. We have mercs already, and it's not pretty.

The thing with industries run by government: it makes sense to do so for things for which competition isn't viable. But especially for things where competition is harmful. e.g. operating a highway between two cities. There's only really a need for one highway, so privatizing that one highway is dumb (a legalized monopoly will just maximize their own profits at the expense of everyone else's commerce), and allowing rival highway operators to compete is dumb too: drivers would be paying to maintain two roads instead of one. Army's especially. There's not much good to come out of rival army's competing for the same dollars.

[sluissa]

It's a metal gear reference, Reelya. Not to be taken seriously unless we find out about some rogue AI who secretly control the world. The la li lu le lo.

[BFEL]

On the topic of Trump, specifically, the problem is there's just no substance there.  The only three angles of support I've seen for him are:
1.  Hardcore right-wingers who don't really even care who's running for them.  They'd vote for the devil before ever voting for any Democrat or liberal party.
2.  Bigoted culture warriors who don't care how incompetent he is or ugly his character - they're just enjoying the rallying cry.
3.  Those who are disgusted by both, but more so by Hillary for whatever reasons.

If you have another one, I'd like to hear it.

Related to 3, the reason I'm more adverse to Hillary is that I see Trump as the "evil you know"
I mean, it seems pretty clear that Trump fully intends to try the crazy shit he spouts off about, but Hillary doesn't have that.
I have zero confidence she actually believes anything she says, so from my perspective she could want literally anything.

So if Trump is Hitler, Hillary is Cthulu. And while I don't want either of those things, I at least know what Hitler wants, and how to fight that.

[Reelya]

I think maybe you've basically ignored what she has to say. Hillary has the most extensive background in government of any presidential candidate of all time.

She's been a been a lawyer and public defender, she's been First Lady (of both a state, and the nation), a Senator and secretary of state. This is her second shot running for President, so we have the track record of everything she said and did in not one, but two presidential campaigns. We have a detailed track record of what positions she's taken on just about every possible topic. You can go and compare what she said during this election, to what she said during the last election, to what positions she took as Secretary of State and as a Senator. Basically we know more about Hillary Clinton than just about anyone else on the planet.

To say she's some unknown "Cthulu" like alien who is a complete unknown compared to Trump of all people, a guy with zero track record in government, and who doesn't want you to know what's on his tax returns, is frankly crazy.

[Antioch]

Yeah we have literally zero indication what Trump will actually do in office. Mostly because everything he says is complete not achievable bullshit.

I also feel it is really going to depend on how his relation with the Republican party will be once in office, a relation that is shaky at best.

[Frumple]

... well, complete bullshit with swaths of it being outright and blatant lies. Some of which change from day to day.

Shit, a good chunk of the reason there's zero chance I'm voting trump is because there's fuckall genuine indication of what he would do in office. You can make guesses based on previous actions (which ends up with very little good things to say), but the guy makes not the least attempt to cleave to any sort of consistency or integrity.

On the other hand, belief in it or not (though I'd say you have to be pretty willfully blind to say you have no idea what she's do or what she believes), clinton has one of the more consistent political histories we've seen and at least makes a token effort (mind, it's more than token, but whatev') at matching her actions to her words. Unfathomable horror from the deep she ain't.

It's not like there's not stuff to criticize her on, but that's line of thought is just not one of them.

[Folly]

Okay, I have to ask because it comes up a lot from the right: there's a lot of accusations that Clinton deleted some 30000-odd emails after that whole crap started popping up. Is that substantiated by anything or no? If yes, then why the hell did the FBI not take that into consideration in that big 'ol shpeel they published on the thing? Actually, on thinking about it, I think they did mention a bunch of deleted emails, which they managed to recover one way or another. So why the hell is this still a thing?

Basically, the FBI noticed that Hilary had been illegally using a private email server so they demanded that she turn over the server to them immediately so they could analyze it to determine if any confidential files had been compromised. Hilary basically refused, and did nothing for several months, while making no comment to the press or anyone else. Then one day she finally speaks up to say they she is fully cooperating with the FBI and turning over her email servers. Oh, except for the 30,000ish emails that were deleted and the hard drives scrubbed so that the data would be unrecoverable, and also several hard drives that somehow got physically destroyed with a hammer, all of which occurred after the FBI made their demands. But yeah, she's fully cooperating.

So, the FBI launch an investigation, which concludes with the head of the FBI making a nice little speech to the press. During this speech he explains that what Hilary did was technically a violation of the law, and that anybody else who had done the same things would have been convicted and punished to the full extent of the law. Also, if they find anyone else doing the same things in the present or the future, those people definitely will also be convicted and punished. However, in this particular case, he was unable to imagine how Hilary could possibly have had illicit motives when she was knowingly committing those extremely illegal actions and putting national security at risk, therefore he is recommending not to press charges against her. And just like that the whole thing was swept under the rug.

So why is this still a thing? Because even someone who's blind could see that Crooked Hilary clearly bribed or blackmailed someone to make this whole thing go away. There is absolutely no rational explanation for the FBI to come to the conclusion that they did.

[Sergarr]

Trump is not "the evil we know". He doesn't keep his narrative straight, he is constantly shifting it to suit whatever current needs he have. Remember, he at one moment actually said that he is not going to deport all illegal immigrants, i.e. he tried to back down on his #1 core issue. That's a thing that actually happened.

Of course, then he went right back to deportation business because he saw the backlash from his base, but it's a very characteristic thing. Trump is a flip-flopper. For fuck's sake, he was a Democrat not that long ago! And then he was insisting that Obama was born in Kenya! And then he just a few days ago says that Hillary was the one who started "birtherism"!