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Author Topic: The friendly and polite Europe related terrible jokes thread  (Read 1006651 times)

Sergarr

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1635 on: April 07, 2016, 11:55:36 am »

He's talking about Switzerland, right?
Switzerland is actually, historically speaking, quite undemocratic, relatively to both Europe and USA (which is #1 democracy and the best country in the world, which is obvious given that the computing device you're currently watching this message on was almost certainly made through utilization of American technology/know-how and with help of American financial organizations). They've only started allowing women to vote in 1971, after all, and only finished that process in 1990, only 26 years ago.
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smjjames

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1636 on: April 07, 2016, 12:40:46 pm »

He's talking about Switzerland, right?
Switzerland is actually, historically speaking, quite undemocratic, relatively to both Europe and USA (which is #1 democracy and the best country in the world, which is obvious given that the computing device you're currently watching this message on was almost certainly made through utilization of American technology/know-how and with help of American financial organizations). They've only started allowing women to vote in 1971, after all, and only finished that process in 1990, only 26 years ago.

And we (as in both Russia and the US) established Womens Suffrage almost a hundred years ago 1917 (according to wiki, 1918 from this) and 1920 respectively.
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Kot

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1637 on: April 07, 2016, 01:02:00 pm »

« Last Edit: April 07, 2016, 01:07:21 pm by Kot »
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Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1638 on: April 07, 2016, 01:10:49 pm »

1) Democratic People Republic of Korea is a role model of democracy.
2) Russia is much closer to this ideal than pathetic Switzerland.
3) Russia is more democratic than Switzerland
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Sinistar

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1639 on: April 07, 2016, 01:18:46 pm »

Referendums might be the face of direct democracy, but that doesn't mean they make democracy as whole magically better or even "perfect". Despite this and that writing about how democracy should look, democracy doesn't really have a complete, comprehensive book of rules to follow and as such, obviously, is not immune to being misused, either by people inside or outside of the system. There is a reason why even "democratic" countries of today differ between each other, both regarding laws and ethical practices.

So all this talk about how democracy is good only when it does YOU good doesn't really help with making the problems of the system go away. So if we talk about what should be changed, personally I'd make voting compulsive, for starters. The most obvious and immediate objection to this would be by some freedom-of-everything supporters, telling you it's not all right to force people to be involved in democratic process as this tramples on their free will. But to that I can only answer that if there are rules about crime and punishment to follow, and said rules are there to ensure stable and fair society (that is, at least in theory), so should there be rules of every resident to get him or herself involved into ensuring society stays democratic. If it should be every person's right and duty to fight against unjust laws, why not go further?

But this, of course, still doesn't solve all problems. If only. There's the simple problem of sometimes, there are referendum propositions or maybe politicians to choose from that majority simply do not agree BUT they are not given the third or whatever option. What should you do in a system, which offers 2 choices but you are not satisfied with either BUT you also HAVE to vote? You cast in the "undecided" vote, usually. Which is a problem because null vote has zero power. So that's the problem. In order to further improve on the democratic process, we ought to give null votes equal power than all other votes. If everyone votes on elections, but only 50% of people vote for any candidate/option, while the rest vote disfavorably of all options - in case of parliamentary elections (that is, people vote parties that in turn take hold of power, for all those who are less familiar with this practice (like I'd guess our compatriots from USA)) that would basically mean vote of no confidence to all parties. Which in turn would mean that everyone would have to take few steps back and ask themselves what are they doing wrong when flat 50% of the country is opposed to them/proposed laws or whatever. Which in turn might make democratic process a lot more interesting.



BUT OF COURSE even this all doesn't mean democracy would always work. I mean, what to do in a case when 50 or more % are against law that not only you but many international communities deem as just? What to do when people totally legally elect a guy with funny mustache, bad fashion sense and questionable ethics? Making democratic system more fair or just mobilizing people to become more avtive in politics doesn't necessarily mean people will also become more SMART, yeah?

Well, that's just some ideas I had.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2016, 01:21:24 pm by Sinistar »
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Kot

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1640 on: April 07, 2016, 01:21:55 pm »

elect a guy with funny mustache, bad fashion sense and questionable ethics
Oy, don't insult him. His fashion sense was glorious.
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Sergarr

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1641 on: April 07, 2016, 01:32:01 pm »

He's talking about Switzerland, right?
Switzerland is actually, historically speaking, quite undemocratic, relatively to both Europe and USA (which is #1 democracy and the best country in the world, which is obvious given that the computing device you're currently watching this message on was almost certainly made through utilization of American technology/know-how and with help of American financial organizations). They've only started allowing women to vote in 1971, after all, and only finished that process in 1990, only 26 years ago.

And we (as in both Russia and the US) established Womens Suffrage almost a hundred years ago 1917 (according to wiki, 1918 from this) and 1920 respectively.
That's a bad example, lol. USSR has declared to be many things, and on a lot of these, it delivered the exact opposite. It certainly wasn't a democracy, that's for sure. Even implicating it as such will provoke some highly negative (for the quality of discussion) reactions, as you can see in this thread.

As for democracy, technically speaking, it's a typical application of "lots of bad classifiers combined together make a better classifier" methodology. So the more people vote, the better it gets - so always vote, when you can, even if you think it's stupid.
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Sinistar

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1642 on: April 07, 2016, 01:38:54 pm »

elect a guy with funny mustache, bad fashion sense and questionable ethics
Oy, don't insult him. His fashion sense was glorious.
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1643 on: April 07, 2016, 01:50:39 pm »

elect a guy with funny mustache, bad fashion sense and questionable ethics
Oy, don't insult him. His fashion sense was glorious.
Click here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBlQjYyB78k
and then click on Spoiler below
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: April 07, 2016, 01:59:53 pm by ChairmanPoo »
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sprinkled chariot

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1644 on: April 07, 2016, 02:14:55 pm »

1) Democratic People Republic of Korea is a role model of democracy.
2) Russia is much closer to this ideal than pathetic Switzerland.
3) Russia is more democratic than Switzerland

1 good person is trusted secrets
2 sleeping person is not trusted secrets
3 those, who sleep are bad persons
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smjjames

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1645 on: April 07, 2016, 02:15:57 pm »

He's talking about Switzerland, right?
Switzerland is actually, historically speaking, quite undemocratic, relatively to both Europe and USA (which is #1 democracy and the best country in the world, which is obvious given that the computing device you're currently watching this message on was almost certainly made through utilization of American technology/know-how and with help of American financial organizations). They've only started allowing women to vote in 1971, after all, and only finished that process in 1990, only 26 years ago.

And we (as in both Russia and the US) established Womens Suffrage almost a hundred years ago 1917 (according to wiki, 1918 from this) and 1920 respectively.
That's a bad example, lol. USSR has declared to be many things, and on a lot of these, it delivered the exact opposite. It certainly wasn't a democracy, that's for sure. Even implicating it as such will provoke some highly negative (for the quality of discussion) reactions, as you can see in this thread.

As for democracy, technically speaking, it's a typical application of "lots of bad classifiers combined together make a better classifier" methodology. So the more people vote, the better it gets - so always vote, when you can, even if you think it's stupid.

I knew it was during the revolution, but I didn't know whether that came from the Duma or something before the Monarchy got fully toppled or it was the Soviet government that did it.
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Kot

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1646 on: April 07, 2016, 02:30:38 pm »

It's not really that hard to connect both dots. IIRC it did happen before Monarchy got completly toppled but it was result of earlier revolution.
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Sinistar

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1647 on: April 07, 2016, 03:08:50 pm »

elect a guy with funny mustache, bad fashion sense and questionable ethics
Oy, don't insult him. His fashion sense was glorious.
Click here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBlQjYyB78k
and then click on Spoiler below
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This is... strangely mesmerizing.

I've got nothing more to add.
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Shadowlord

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1648 on: April 07, 2016, 03:48:56 pm »

> we need compulsory voting
1. Elections cost money. Serve more people, more cost. More ballots, more ability to accommodate more people at a time, more machines, more poll monitors, etc.
2. You have to work*, or you're out of state, out of the country, or sick, in the hospital, or don't have any way to get to your assigned voting site because you got no car and no money for public transport etc. Now you're a criminal for not voting.
3. Or you go vote in primaries but don't know shit about the choices. Someone will tell you who to vote for so you don't have to think about it though. Then in the general you vote party line like now.

Basically I think if someone's not voting they either find it difficult to get to the polls, or it takes too much time, or they don't think it accomplishes anything (say they're a Democrat in a heavily Republican state), and making voting compulsory wouldn't change any of that - it would just criminalize not voting.

Mind you, I've never experienced a non-us voting system. Maybe you're speculating about this for some place where there aren't poor people with limited access to voting, or where it doesn't break down to picking between two sometimes meaningful choices, or sometimes no choices (people running unopposed).
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scriver

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Re: The friendly and polite EU-related news thread
« Reply #1649 on: April 07, 2016, 03:57:50 pm »

My idea of choice is still to give ever silent or blank vote a place in the parliament-equivalent as well. If the parties can't bring enough support behind them to even create a combined majority, then they do not have mandate to rule.
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