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Author Topic: Hearts of Iron IV  (Read 103451 times)

forsaken1111

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #705 on: March 27, 2019, 08:19:05 am »


Naval units are... honestly, don't go out of your way to get them unless you have a specific purpose in mind.
Naval units exist to deny enemy supply routes, stop naval invasions, and protect your own naval invasions. In Man the Guns they can also actively support naval invasions with their guns.
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Persus13

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #706 on: March 27, 2019, 08:35:47 am »


Naval units are... honestly, don't go out of your way to get them unless you have a specific purpose in mind.
Naval units exist to deny enemy supply routes, stop naval invasions, and protect your own naval invasions. In Man the Guns they can also actively support naval invasions with their guns.
I think they could do that before Man the Guns came out too. But now there's a dedicated button for that instead of manually directing your ships to the coast.
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forsaken1111

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #707 on: March 27, 2019, 02:29:47 pm »

If they could I wasn't aware of that ability.
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Persus13

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #708 on: March 27, 2019, 02:43:05 pm »

If they could I wasn't aware of that ability.
I wouldn't be surprised by that. I don't recall ever seeing it advertised as a thing you could do, I just would notice that coastal battles or naval invasions would get bonuses from naval bombardments from ships offshore.
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Tack

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #709 on: March 27, 2019, 10:08:41 pm »

Yeah if you hold them in any square nearby a coast, they can give a bonus (~30%) to any land battles or invasions happening along that coast.
Also VERY handy if you need to breakthrough an enemy line and you're trying desperately to stack up advantages.
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Persus13

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #710 on: March 31, 2019, 07:34:05 am »

I've been having a lot of fun over the past couple of days with Old World Blues. Its a total conversion mod that turns the game into Fallout. Basically the Fallout version of the After the End mod for CKII. Its set between Fallout 2 and New Vegas, but only has the North American West Coast. So Caesar's Legion and the NCR are in the game, but not anything from Fallout 3 or 4 (although there's plans to include Chicago and Fallout: Tactics eventually).

Gameplay wise the main changes are to tech and focus trees. A lot of the familiar nations have unique focus trees, with generic ones for raiders, tribals, and settler nations. Tech has a lot of weapons and power armor that are recognizable from the games, and what you can get is somewhat dependent on how advanced you've progressed.

There's a lot of factions on the edges that are mostly made up. I've been playing recently as the Washington Brotherhood, whose leader is mentioned somewhere in the canon, but that's the only bit that is. Playing them and fighting your neighbors, who are Canadian pirates, Troll Warrens, and religious fanatics are is pretty fun. My main advantage has been using Power Armor divisions are really good, but they're expensive and eat up a lot of supply.

« Last Edit: March 31, 2019, 11:27:37 am by Persus13 »
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EuchreJack

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #711 on: March 31, 2019, 01:33:48 pm »

I like how Old World Blues is a completely different game from a division design standpoint, as you know, they didn't have Power Armor in WW2.

I'm glad to hear that its still working, I thought the latest update might have broken it.

USEC_OFFICER

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #712 on: March 31, 2019, 02:57:50 pm »

The latest update did break it. The OWB team just did a really good job cranking out a new version to fix the compatibility issues.
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Shooer

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #713 on: March 31, 2019, 07:26:27 pm »

OWB is a fantastic mod.  It turns HoI4 into more of a story telling game.  I've played with the Enclave sub mod that really fleshes their game play out.  Into several fairly different styles/goal sets.
That and I plan to do a Washington brotherhood game soon.  I must know what is in Alaska.
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USEC_OFFICER

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #714 on: March 31, 2019, 07:39:24 pm »

Prepare to be disappointed then. I was when I finally got far enough in their tree to find out.
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ZeroGravitas

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #715 on: March 31, 2019, 08:18:20 pm »

OWB is a fantastic mod.  It turns HoI4 into more of a story telling game.  I've played with the Enclave sub mod that really fleshes their game play out.  Into several fairly different styles/goal sets.
That and I plan to do a Washington brotherhood game soon.  I must know what is in Alaska.

i had a lot of fun in owb as mr house! at some point it all kind of petered out though - maybe it wasn't done yet
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EuchreJack

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #716 on: April 01, 2019, 02:34:21 pm »

OWB is a fantastic mod.  It turns HoI4 into more of a story telling game.  I've played with the Enclave sub mod that really fleshes their game play out.  Into several fairly different styles/goal sets.
That and I plan to do a Washington brotherhood game soon.  I must know what is in Alaska.

i had a lot of fun in owb as mr house! at some point it all kind of petered out though - maybe it wasn't done yet

Well, Hearts of Iron is just like that, mod or no mod.  With HOI 4, the game is set up so that when the focus trees are done, they're done.

lemon10

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #717 on: April 02, 2019, 08:43:45 am »

Yeah, France at that point in time has a super weak government. Capitulation happens after losing... maybe a third of your cities? Normally it should be much harder.
The good news is that the French-italian border is not terrible to hold either. I'd start producing mountaineers and shoving them in there, as that's mainly what Italy will be fielding against you down there. Tanks and mountains do not mix.
Ah, super special pro-tip (now that I'm replaying it in order to figure out what goes where), the Italian and Extended Manginot policies add 2 to the fort level of the forts in an area- and the construction time of forts increases exponentially with how high you get them - so I'd personally avoid taking those until you've already gotten those forts up as high as you dare. I went 5 on each, but also I'm getting my teeth kicked in so who knows.

Edit: Also a lot of manual shuffling of units on the line will need to be done.
Edit 2: Also it never hurts to set a fallback line, rather than a front line. It's a little more rigid.
Edit 3: I've cut the mountaineers back to a 20-wide unit (extra-tip, multiples of 20 is best for combat width) and put another 24 troopers on that border and wow is that a messed up zone. Can definitely understand the Italy troubles.
That being said the low manpower means I've had to basically make a unit of 50-50 infantry and artillery with one anti-tank slapped on.


That's not to say it isn't possible to win as France post-capitulation (after all, the french did), but for it to be a relatively interesting game you'd want to offload a lot of your civilian construction to Algeria and SE asia.
Running a french game now (that started before the new version) and having a pretty good time.
I buffed up the extended line pretty big and put a lot of effort into it, but never ended up using it because I managed to stall them in belgium with a great deal of effort and microing.
In the end they ran out of supplies cause of their constant attacks, at which point I proceeded to murder their faces in at basically sprinting speed across germany.

The fight would have been *much* harder if Germany had use their planes properly. Instead of sticking their planes in to get air superiority in the fight against me that killed millions of their troops, they stuck their 1000+ planes in the english channel for 95% of the war, thus allowing me easy and nearly free air superiority instead of hemorrhaging planes fighting them off and getting my troops bombed to the stone age.


Currently I'm in the middle of betraying the allies (using the console to allow me to justify a war against them, because otherwise I would have been locked out) and just managed to invade Britain.

Important notes:
Jesus I hate the battle line system. It constantly screws up *anything* you try to do and prevents you from say, moving some of your units back so that they don't get punched in the face so they can recover or moving an extra unit to a weak spot in the line. Also it sometimes does fun stuff like empty a space in the maginot line and allow them to steal one of your 10/10 forts that you have no chance in hell of getting back. It's fine when its a easy battle and you can just let it run, but damn can it screw you over even if it should be a gimme.

Italy was godamn spooky. Luckily they entered the war a month before Germany started attacking me, which gave me time to realize what an actual threat they were and properly fortify my southern border. I pumped my southern forts up to 4 (with the buff), but as I realized within the first month I should have pumped them up to 5, and one or two of them up to 6.
They just threw themselves at my mountain forts and even though I had a full 24 strong army on the border they almost broke through a couple of times. They took horrendous losses attacking every single mountain province with a dozen divisions for a straight year of course, but if they had attacked say, a month after Germany they might have just busted on through my unprepared southern border coolaid man style.

England was basically useless. They somehow managed to lose 2 million men despite never actually fighting on the front. I figure that they just sent like a hundred divisions on suicide sea invasions but I'm honestly unsure how they lost so many.

If they could I wasn't aware of that ability.
Yeah, the game has a significant amount of really damn obscure things and facts that while typically fairly minor add up in pretty major ways.
For instance pressing P brings up a list of all your fleets.
Or that if you mouse over the attack amount it breaks down every positive and negative that has an effect on your attack value.
Or that if your stability/war support is below 50% in a war you have a significant chance of getting events that are really horrible and can drain hundreds of your PP.
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Tack

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #718 on: April 02, 2019, 08:57:12 am »

Glad my speel “helped”?
But yeah had similar issues with Italy. For a while there I was using the “no retreat” warplan literally as often as I got the command points to do so, because I just couldn’t catch a break long enough to entrench on the three big fronts.

Of course, this lasted right up until I made the same realisation as you- the fronts system is stupidly flawed, and just created a crapton of one-region-wide fallback positions. Suddenly I could have six divisions in the places they were always attacking, and two divisions in the places they were never attacking. Then I started getting downtime, then they started entrenching, and from there it was an upwards spiral and didn’t need any micro at all.


Can’t remember the last time I had an enemy country run out of supply though. Do you just stare at the brown bars until they start failing to replenish?
« Last Edit: April 02, 2019, 11:42:32 am by Tack »
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lemon10

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Re: Hearts of Iron IV
« Reply #719 on: April 02, 2019, 10:25:25 am »

Glad my speed “helped”?
But yeah had similar issues with Italy. For a while there I was using the “no retreat” warplan literally as often as I got the command points to do so, because I just couldn’t catch a break long enough to entrench on the three big fronts.

Of course, this lasted right up until I made the same realisation as you- the fronts system is stupidly flawed, and just created a crapton of one-region-wide fallback positions. Suddenly I could have six divisions in the places they were always attacking, and two divisions in the places they were never attacking. Then I started getting downtime, then they started entrenching, and from there it was an upwards spiral and didn’t need any micro at all.
The advice did actually help quite a bit against the Italians. Otherwise I probably wouldn't have build up those forts and would have had a really nasty time.
If I had went into that battle with 2 forts along the border I probably would have needed at least another dozen divisions (or to be playing intelligently from the beginning) to defend the border.

I also feel like the front system is fairly uniquely bad for this war as well.
Notably:
Your troops far exceed the front size, which means that you have like 1/2 your army doing nothing but sitting there being locked out of fighting or organizing.
The terrain is flat and the provinces are small, so moving back or forth to reinforce is fairly quick and doesn't have a bunch of attrition. (You have some in the south, but not the weeks of constant attrition you experience in South America or Asia).
And finally you aren't attacking in any meaningful way and the enemy is pounding you over and over, so your troops aren't reorganizing behind the protection of your attacking troops.
Can’t remember the last time I had an enemy country run out of supply though. Do you just stare at the brown bars until they start failing to replenish?
The war was going pretty difficultly with a bunch of micro for like a year (although they never broke through Belgium or luxenbourg) with them just constantly fight me in every single non-maginot line tile of the border.
I typically had air superiority (cause they threw all their planes into the ocean) and thanks to the help of the Belgians was managing to hold the line pretty evenly without really gaining or losing any ground for around a year.

Note that my situation was steadily improving for multiple reasons.
1) I was steadily progressing from a pure 9 infantry template to a standard 7/2 template with anti-tank, artillery and engineer support as my artillery production ramped up.
2) I switched out from "have your units randomly wander around and have 15 divisions pinned and not recovering by a single enemy attacking them for a day at a time" into manually controlling all of them and pulling some back to recover. This happened in waves (a army at a time over about a year) as I got disgusted by how badly the AI was handling things.
3) I was gaining a bunch more troops as my blitz in africa winded up and I brought dozens of divisions north into both my european fronts.
and as it turns out 4) They were running out of infantry equipment and some other stuff (notably tanks, as all my troops started off the war with the anti-tank support attachment which made all their tanks tank massively more casualties).


So my situation was just steadily getting better over time as their war machine ran down. I was keeping a pretty steady eye on the loss numbers between me and the enemy because its pretty motivating to see that the Italians are losing 5 times as many troops as you and the Germans over twice as many as you. And then suddenly their loss number just skyrocketed. Over the course of a few months (just after I went from 8/1->7/2) they suddenly lost a million more men and stopped their constant theater wide attacks, and I was able to push back and take a few provinces.
After they stopped attacking I began using plans and armies again. Not because plans are good, because I suck at them, but because I had a 77% plan bonus, which equates to a 77% attack bonus which is massive and has an effect that cannot be understated (provided your enemy is willing to not attack you for a month to let your troops get up to strength). Over the course of about six months I did two major 77% strength+attack bonus attack, which just bashed through their line and let me take like 10 provinces.
So when I was preparing the third one I noticed the text where it says if you should attack or not it said "inferior enemy" which was odd, because the french aren't really superior to the germans at all. A bit of digging showed that a bunch of their divisions were low on strength even when they hadn't fought me recently which was odd.

I figured that the only real possibility was that they were low on equipment given they still had manpower left, so I swapped tags to confirm and yup, they were majorly low on infantry equipment.
I then realized that if they were that low on infantry equipment that their infantry was at like 1/2 strength (which I could tell by just looking at them after I swapped back) any losses would hurt them much more then it hurt me, so I hyper agressively just pushed them to the other side of germany before anything could change. I took a bunch of losses doing it (as much as the entire war proceeding it) but I was too lazy to micro, and I wanted to push things as fast as possible so that Russia couldn't get involved and grab land.

Note that I was really darn surprised when it happened. I was honestly expecting that I would need to wait for Russia to get involved to split their attention so that I could just push across and kill them. Before it I had managed to take like 3 provinces in like a year, and then another dozen provinces (aka, the rest of Belgium) over the next six months. I figured that I might say, take another few dozen out of the literally hundreds that Germany controlled. But then they collapsed and I managed to grab the whole thing instead.
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And with a mighty leap, the evil Conservative flies through the window, escaping our heroes once again!
Because the solution to not being able to control your dakka is MOAR DAKKA.

That's it. We've finally crossed over and become the nation of Da Orky Boyz.
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