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Yes!

1 (14.3%)

NO!

4 (57.1%)

Use the Sage vs. Sodom civilizations, but with beastfolk (dirty humanthings must die!)

1 (14.3%)

Merge a less silly version of Sage vs. Sodom with this mod

1 (14.3%)

Merge a more silly version of Sage vs. Sodom with this mod

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 7

[EuchreJack]

I tried embarking with blind cave ogres as my civ but I can't appoint any nobles : it says that there are no reasonable candidates.
I also tried to embark with sperm whale as my civ and I couldn't bring seeds or drinks with the first 7.

I'll have to look at the Blind Cave Ogres, that isn't right.

Sperm Whales are Carnivores: They have to learn to use booze and plants from The Player.  So are all the rest of the Aquatics and several other civilizations, some rightly and some wrongly.  It was a cheap fix for when I was having trouble getting civilizations to generate, which needs more scrutiny.  But I'm probably going to keep the Sperm Whales as Carnivores, despite the added difficulty of them usually starting near saltwater.

[EuchreJack]

SLOW_LEARNER
Shorthand for [CAN_LEARN] + [SKILL_LEARN_RATES:50].Verify Used for ogres and giants. Applicable to player races. Prevents a player from recruiting nobility, even basic ones.

So the Slow Learner trait is bad.  As a temporary fix, just apply the Meanderer Remove patch as that will remove the [Slow Learner] tag from all the Ogres.

I already have an update scheduled, so I'll rush it with this fix.

[EuchreJack]

Fixed Ogres.  Also new civ for small temperate forest beastfolk, and new civ for aquatic/wetlands beastfolk with a fun pirate theme!

New poll: Should the Evil (babysnatcher) beastfolk be playable?  They're the exact same as the old non-evil beastfolk except they trade with Ogres instead of fighting with them.  Mainly I'm trying to be lazy by cutting in half the number of civs I need to differentiate by size.

[Catfishboss]

I think its good if there are evil beast folk because we already get a truckload of caravans every season. It adds to the fun too! As long as we can still play all of them folks.

[EuchreJack]

I think its good if there are evil beast folk because we already get a truckload of caravans every season. It adds to the fun too! As long as we can still play all of them folks.

Oh, the evil folk would still be around, the question is whether to have both evil and non-evil as playable.  I've got a few minor ideas for dividing up the evil variants by size, but nothing as solid as with the non-evil folk.

[EuchreJack]

Thanks for the votes on the evil beastfolk.  Please post comments if anyone has any further ideas.

New Issue:
When I coded beastfolk, I did so with ethics that lacked a lot of overall authority over beastfolk.  Assault, theft, and vandalism were not punishable offenses.  I however failed to understand that these ethics changes would prevent punishment under the Justice System.

So the new poll is about whether Dwarven Justice should apply to Beastfolk.  Feel free to post comments if anyone has any ideas on this issue.

Note: If somebody dies, then Justice should probably apply.  Even the most savage of beastfolk acknowledge that death of entity members needs to be punished.  But how much, that is still an open question.

Also, the newer, more civilized beastfolk (the smaller, non-evil ones that need Law, Order, and a Central Government to protect themselves) already have most of the Justice system enabled.  There are still a few variants: The Pirates don't care so much, and the Forest Hippies are too "evolved" to punish strictly, if I recall.

EDIT: For those curious, this link will lead to new raws that will add Justice to tropical beastfolk.  It is temporary: Tropical beastfolk need to be divided by size, and with your help I need to decide exactly what forms of Dwarven Justice should apply.

Current thoughts -> Justice makes the game harder, so it should be included.  Lots of "Punish Serious", so you need to build jails and stuff rather than just clean up the corpses.

[TheCoolSideofthePIllow]

This is perfect. I was sitting here about to tweak my animal people to be all human sized, and then I see this on the first page of mods doing a lot more.

[EuchreJack]

This is perfect. I was sitting here about to tweak my animal people to be all human sized, and then I see this on the first page of mods doing a lot more.

I'm glad to have filled a niche.  It all started with Bountiful Beastfolk BETA which honestly contributed a lot to the animal people.  I just finished off the civilizations.  The only animal person that I've added is the Hippo person, primarily because there weren't enough large swamp beastfolk.  Which makes me just realize that Alligator Persons are not a thing, and need to be.

...Although, Hamsterfolk and other small animal people are not human sized.  But as you can see from what I've done, they don't need to be.

[TheCoolSideofthePIllow]

My only regret about that is that scale doesn't mean anything outside of combat in the game right now. It would be cool if my hamster people could keep ogres and dragons out by just having entrances too small for them to fit.

[EuchreJack]

My only regret about that is that scale doesn't mean anything outside of combat in the game right now. It would be cool if my hamster people could keep ogres and dragons out by just having entrances too small for them to fit.

Actually, I believe that traps can be triggered by size.  So you can create pressure plates that hamsters can dance on without effect, but that will trigger horrible disfiguring traps and cave-ins for the humans and larger beastfolk.

[TheCoolSideofthePIllow]

This didn't alter any professions did it? Because I started as a Blind Cave Ogre adventurer just now and the civ leader I spawned next to's profession is "whore."

If this mod didn't do that, then Blind Cave Ogres have quite an interesting government style.

[EuchreJack]

This didn't alter any professions did it? Because I started as a Blind Cave Ogre adventurer just now and the civ leader I spawned next to's profession is "whore."

If this mod didn't do that, then Blind Cave Ogres have quite an interesting government style.

Blind Cave Ogres are honest: They call politicians how they see them.
(But seriously, it made no sense that Ogres would elect their leaders [mayor], but then I figured their prostitutes would exert similar influence and responsibilities, and "Popularity" is certainly one word to describe their positions of authority...)

One Internet Cookie to TheCoolSideofthePIllow for being the first the delve into the government system of Ogres!

EDIT: For fun, try playing Blind Cave Ogres in Fortress Mode.  You'll see a few other minor cosmetic differences between Mayors and Whores...
Hint: The first difference is that you only need 25 citizens for a Whore to be "elected".  I'll leave the rest for you to discover!

[EuchreJack]

And with the new version, time to find out what I need to fix so this mod is compatible.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

In the meantime, Anamnesis has updated.  As I've indicated, that game is the main inspiration for this mod, so check it out.  I'm particularly fond of the new Descendants feature.

[baldamundo]

Probably a noob question, but is there a way of safely installing a graphics pack with this mod? I tried installing Phoebus over the top, but it wanted to replace a bunch of files that sounded super mod-relevant. Really keen to try this mod, but unfortunately not hardcore enough for ASCII!

[EuchreJack]

Probably a noob question, but is there a way of safely installing a graphics pack with this mod? I tried installing Phoebus over the top, but it wanted to replace a bunch of files that sounded super mod-relevant. Really keen to try this mod, but unfortunately not hardcore enough for ASCII!

Thank you for your interest.  However, this mod hasn't been updated to the newest version, so that would probably be the main restraint.

As for a graphics pack, it would probably be ok, as most beastfolk already exist in some form.  This mod mostly just gives those beastfolk a civilization.  The equipment mod may vary somewhat, but I just ported that from the original weapon&armor mod creator.