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[Ross Vernal]

I had to be clear on that, since I gave you bad math earlier and needed to correct it.

Yeah, the weaponry listed on the ship description, plus the missile load to go with it. It's technically Missile 0 and Energy 0, actually.

I'd be very interested to see how someone would try to fit the entire mass of a Fighter inside 37% of the space of an actual Fighter. That'd be... something.

I will be glad to help anyone with creation and if other players are willing to help, I'm going to offer them extra money rolls. Same for anyone who wants to refine the numbers or rules - if you make the game better or easier, then you deserve rewards for it.

I think that you are fine with that.


IMPORTANT EDIT: If the price rebalance goes through, you will receive equivalent credit for what you originally wanted to buy.

I don't think it's fair to give you guys one set of numbers, to make choices, and then be forced to adjust everything because I made a mistake with numbers. I am not going to punish you for my errors.

[Ozarck]

I'll help out however I can, now that I'm getting the hang of some stuff.

Who all is interested but needs help?

I know Kevak and Cheesecake are still holding out for a larger ship. Any takers?

[Rolepgeek]

Couple of questions Ross.

First, Octav Range bonus also applies to their sensors, right? It would make sense considering they were up against the Red Star Empire.

Second, do missile modules and energy and sensors all have to overwrite the base score of the ship in order to work, or do they add on?

Third, do base weapons/sensors take up space?

Fourth, would Knight Captain bonuses actually be able to be +20% to Marines and a flat bonus of -5% to defenses?

Fifth, do all Marine purchases double as hospital/cryo, or do they have to replace Marines?

Sixth, is boarding during combat going to be possible? (I'm mostly thinking Red Star Assault Bombers or Corvettes or the like with plenty of fighter escorts)

Looks good, by the way, Ozarck, though you'll need to check with your co-captain.

I'm willing to crunch numbers on ships for anyone who needs it, by the way.

[Ross Vernal]

I had not thought of that, but it does make sense.

Override. Well, sensors add, and in cases where base is replaced by something worse, adds. Otherwise, replace.

Yes, they do, although it's not showing in the free cubage. The increase in size represents how much bigger the weapons are.

Short answer yes, longer answer is yes because of in character reasons in regards to ownership.

Replace on a 1 to 1 basis. Marine Country is all of the stuff that can be reasonably and necessarily aboard. Gym, sick bays, offices, barracks, commissary, powered armor vault, drop shuttles, etc.  Hospital is representative of all of the space for a planetary quality sized hospital facilities that exceed standard military sickbay, additional microcompensators, etc. For cryo, it's also inclusive of prep and revival facilities beyond military minimum, the appropriate fluids and equipment, etc. For the sake of simplicity, I'm just going to say that it's just about equivalent in space and mass that it's even exchange.

You can call it Prison Space if you like, too.

In the late stages, probably. Once a ship loses most of its fighting capacity, what little damage it can do won't be enough to stop an oncoming enemy with higher HP and overtake. It's certainly a feat in piloting and needle threading, though, and mildly risky considering that the victims might not be quite as disarmed as you think they are. (It'd be a pointless gesture given the ability of the other ship to reduce it to its component atoms in response, but it can happen.) After the combat? Absolutely, if you hope to salvage anything.

Btw: Wing Captain means that when there is an established wing, Captain bonus applies to wing. Individual pilots apply XO bonus.

[Rolepgeek]

Also I wanted to make a Supercarrier or Sentient Megadreadnought(before I realized Space wan't being doubled...) for fun.

Question also, Ross: what type of bonuses do you think a Sentient Ship as the Captain would get? And can they have XOs/crew?

And for everyone else: are ya still playing, and if so, do ya need help pumping out numbers for the ship?

And Ross, can we assume the cost rebalance is in use? And is EW even useful in tiny amounts?

Edit: I realized that if missiles are gonna be 30 base, maybe energy should be 15 base to match after all, as otherwise it gets more expensive than missiles fairly quickly, which is kinda silly. Also kinda silly is the fact that Missiles/Energy 1 take up quite a bit of extra space compared to nothing and yet add almost nothing. Similar thing with Sensors. I'm probably misunderstandong something is all, though.

[Ross Vernal]

Uhm, I imagine that the specific flavor would be "Specialized programming" in the area.

Yes. It's entirely possible for a Sentient ship AI to have a child/update. Metaphorically speaking, at least...

I did not hear objections, so yes. For the sake of simplicity, we'll say that you can still afford what y'all were looking at and please don't make me do that math. If you purchased bigger guns, enjoy your free money.

From base to 1 is twice the damage and gives an increase of 5% to range and accuracy.

As far as energy, think about the requirement. You are trying to get something that originally has the power to punch through the shielding of a ship 100% of the time at 1 light second at a sustained rate of 10 dps all the way up to one that will allow you to deal eight times the damage at twice the range at L14. That suggests a serious increase in power usage, capacity, efficiency, etc. 

[Rolepgeek]

Well it was that and Energy was half the cost of missiles before. It's still not going to be cheap, but it would make Huge Energy 14 cost 69 instead of 92. Which wasn't actually what I'd been hoping for, so maybe not, nevermind...probably shouldn't be cheaper than Missile 10 after all. Not a big deal, really, in the end.

I'm gonna design the Exemplary Standard with the new costs, though, I think.

[Ozarck]

Spoiler: Vipers' Nest MkII (click to show/hide)

Origin: Rift Conglomerate
Captain: Cog Ozarckus (Veteran squadron Commander +20% Squadron coordination and speed, +5% fire rate)
            (Reputation: 3 a Career military officer and an honorable man, but not in the spotlight and    not overly famous. political and personal concerns led him to pursue the mercenary path, though he seeks to act honorably in all his dealings. Has a family in Rift Space.

Wing Commander: (High Tyrel - bonuses pending. Also I'm assuming your origin matches mine for now. change as you like. Also, Can the Wing Commander get the 15% in lieu of an XO, since Wing Commanders have a particular position on a Carrier? I hesitate to make him XO just for the bonus)

Ship Type	...	Parasite Carrier	Corvette	Corvette	Fighters
Ship Name		Vipers' Nest	tbd	tbd	NA
HP		220	64	64	8
Space(used)		110(57.33)	19.8(15.3)	19.8(15.3)	11
Hyper Band		Eta	Zeta	Zeta	alpha
LY/D		5.822/7.06	4.916/5.9	4.916/5.9	0.08/0.1
Fighters		10+2	2+1	2+1
Missiles		30 mk.0	10 mk.0	10 mk.0	15
max fire/round		5	45	45	15
Energy		30 mk.0	10 mk.0	10 mk.0	15
Sensors		3	4	4	2
EW/ECW			4.5	4.5
components		Repair lab
		Molylab
		Supply 4	Supply 4	Supply 4
logistics		4	1	1

Spoiler: costs (click to show/hide)

Parasite carrier 112
corvettes (x2)   32
labs (x2)         100
sensors(x2)       12
EW/ECW (x2)     40
Supply 4 (x3)     15
total               311 (309.5 - I don't know which costs changed.)
leaves us 10.5 bc for logistics -1.75 months worth

Boy. That may be the last time I try to insert a table into a post. oooooouuuuuuuuch.

Those bonuses are for ships acting under Cog's command to work together as a unit more efectively. Primarily thiis would apply to the Carrier and Escort Corvettes, rather than the Fighter wings, but some bonus there would be fine with me also.

[Kashyyk]

Alright, I'm lost with working out what my end numbers are but here's what I've got at the moment.

Origin: Galactic League
Captain: R. L. Carlin (Wolfpack Leader - Bonus to leading a group of medium/small ships (not including fighters etc.))

Spoiler: GLS Centurion (click to show/hide)

Class: Light Cruiser
HP: 140
space(used): 30(19.55)
missile/hit/countermissile: base + 1x Antimissile 10
energy/hit/sidewall: base + 1x Sidewall 1
sensors: 2
ew/ecw: 1x Level 8
marine:
cost 110.5 bc

Spoiler: GLS Legionnaire & GLS Spartan (click to show/hide)

Class: Destroyer
HP: 100
space(used): 25(3.45)
missile/hit/countermissile: base + 1x Antimissile 10
energy/hit/sidewall: base
sensors: 2
ew/ecw: default (0?)
marine:
cost 47.35 bc

[Ross Vernal]

Oz: Corvette sensors would be 4, EW 4.5. After the Grand Rebalance, your cost changes to 309.5, with adjustments for cost in EW and supply. I'll say that you could upgrade one of the labs to a Medium sized and have exactly 6 left over, if you choose.

Kash: New cost is 102.5 for the Centurion. It'd be 22% countermissile and 18% sidewall numbers, with an EW rating of 4.  The Legionnaire and Spartan increase to 59.5 and have the same countermissile capacity as the Centurion with 15% sidewalls. Each holds 500 Marines. (If this is more than your budget allows, then we'll stretch it so it does.)

[Ross Vernal]

Terran Command Battlecruiser
HP: 384
Captain:
Exec:
Missile: 36
Countermissile: 28.00%
Energy: 30
Sidewall: 20%
Sensors: 19
EW/ECW: 0
Marine: 500
Accel: 572
Cost: 135.8
Size: 43.5/68 +0/3.5

Components:

4* Huge Sensor II  Size: 29 Cost : 12
1*Huge Antimissile I Size: 14.5 Cost : 15

Let's do the Rebalance act to the Battlecommand. 147.6, which is definitely within the leeway value for the cost.

[Ozarck]

I'll edit it. I was using the large size numbers for the labs. I only saw the one cost for labs: 50 bc. so that is for small, and for medium its 55.5?

[Ross Vernal]

Larges are 60 cost after the Rebalance. I thought you were doing Small, so add 20 to the cost and also add 20 to the amount of money you have to spend. That's about as far as I'll goodwill the numbers, though.

[Rolepgeek]

Spoiler: Rebalanced CoM Cruiser (click to show/hide)

Herald-Class Supercruiser Exemplary Standard (153bc)
Capt: Coalition Knight-Captain Markus Heaks (+20% Marines, +5% Defense)
HP: 528
Missile/Hit/Countermissile: 60/70/-30.4%
Energy/Hit/Sidewall: 66/99/-27.1%
Sensors: 80/160lm
EW/ECW: 0
Marine: 1200 Marines
Accel: 468g / Zeta Hyper
Supply/Range: 1 year, 6 Months
Cost: 336.5bc
Space/(used): 80/(70.5)
2x Huge Antimissile 6 - 51bc - 14.5 space
Huge Sidewall 9 - 29bc - 5.8 space
Huge Missile 5 - 56bc - 14 space
Supplies 4 - 5bc - 11.7 space
2x Huge Sensor 2 - 6bc - 14.5 space
Huge Energy 6 - 36.5bc - 9.945 space

Designed to combat vessels even larger than itself, Herald-class Supercruisers, like all Coalition ships, are built to last, with defenses in particular exceeding most vessels their size, though this is not uncommon in the Royal Navies in any case. The Exemplary Standard, passed down to one Markus Heaks by his father, Duran Heaks, was recently refitted with a more advanced sidewall and additional supplies. Shortly after, however, Knight-Captain Markus appeared to go rogue during a successionary coup that resulted in the death of his great-uncle and cousin, as well as Queen Harrian to whom he had first pledged his fealty. Witnesses reports that during the fighting, however brief, he fought with courage, honor, and intelligence, but was unable to make a significant difference, in the end. Refusing to owe loyalty to her unchosen successor, the newly crowned Queen Breariel, he instead gathered those of his men who agreed with his sentiment and left Coalition space. Other lords and ladies appeared to do likewise, though Sir Markus was the only one to do so with a ship of such a class. Such practice is not uncommon within the Coalition as a response to the violent overthrow of one's liege-lord or Monarch, but such events are themselves becoming increasingly common...

Oh, and questions. Does Coalition defensive bonus apply to base defenses? And if first level Missiles double your base damage and increase to hit, is it actually additive then or what? Since a Corvette with Size 1 nevermind figured it out I'm a derp.

What's the point in having more than 20 missile tubes if you can only fire 20 a round, by the way, beyond redundancy? Fire Rate?

Also I noticed I think you accidentally made Sidewalls 8 and 9 the same price. Or on purpose. Not sure. Sidewalls 8 also has a lower % for Medium than base size.

Also how's the ship look, do ya think? I played with the numbers to get it to fit within budget. Didn't actually have to do much, really; the cheaper Sidewall made up for most of the other costs, and the missiles actually went down slightly in price. Drop the EW(kinda useless anyway), date the Sensors and Antimissiles(still about as effective as the Sidewall) a bit to fit with the rest, and it's good to go.

[Ross Vernal]

This is gonna be ugly.

Sidewalls 1   9   10.35   11.7   13.05      -2% energy to-hit   -3.00%   -4.00%   -5.00%   10   11   12.1   13.31
Sidewalls 2   8   9.2   10.4   11.6      -2% energy to-hit   -3.00%   -4.00%   -5.00%   11   12.1   13.31   14.641
Sidewalls 3   6   6.9   7.8   8.7      -2% energy to-hit   -3.00%   -4.00%   -5.00%   12   13.2   14.52   15.972
Sidewalls 4   4   4.6   5.2   5.8      -2% energy to-hit   -3.00%   -4.00%   -5.00%   13   14.3   15.73   17.303
Sidewalls 5   6   6.9   7.8   8.7      -4% energy to-hit   5.00%   4.00%   3.00%   14   15.4   16.94   18.634
Sidewalls 6   5   5.75   6.5   7.25      -4% energy to-hit   5.00%   4.00%   3.00%   15   16.5   18.15   19.965
Sidewalls 7   4   4.6   5.2   5.8      -4% energy to-hit   5.00%   4.00%   3.00%   16   17.6   19.36   21.296
Sidewalls 8   3   3.45   3.9   4.35      -6% energy to-hit   7.00%   8.00%   9.00%   17   18.7   20.57   22.627
Sidewalls 9   4   4.6   5.2   5.8      -8% energy to-hit   -9.00%   -10.00%   -11.00%   18   19.8   21.78   23.958
Sidewalls 10   5   5.75   6.5   7.25      -10% energy to-hit   -11.00%   -12.00%   -13.00%   19   20.9   22.99   25.289
Sidewalls 11   4   4.6   5.2   5.8      -10% energy to-hit   -11.00%   -12.00%   -13.00%   20   22   24.2   26.62



Put in more missiles if you want to fire more missiles. You have 10 tubes and the cycle time means you can fire twice in a minute. If you add in additional weaponry, then you're adding more tubes to shoot from.

I'll look at numbers and upload new figures after dinner and a bit of reading Black Company.