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Any D&D/D20

Shadowrun

World of Darkness

Palladium

Other (feel free to post about it)

[Loud Whispers]

-snip- wolfwere

The only thing I would add is, is there any pattern to the people killed? Does the wolfwere do anything in its human form that it couldn't do as a wolf? E.g. is the wolf figuring out which humans are responsible for urban development, and is trying to reverse the spread of human settlements on wolf territory by redirecting them to bear territory?

-snip-
Presenting: The Wood Elf Drunken Master

That is a pretty robust monk idea, I wouldn't even say it's a gimmick because of how solid it would be in many many situations. Another fun one would be taking Kensei and walking around with a fake wooden sword whilst RP'ing as a pacifist. By investing just 1 ki point you can then use it as if it were a regular magic sword. Then you can start rambling about the philosophy of the ultimate swordsmen killing with a blade of grass e.t.c.

[Rolan7]

Please tell me you could pull that off with a boat oar

[Grim Portent]

-snip- wolfwere

The only thing I would add is, is there any pattern to the people killed? Does the wolfwere do anything in its human form that it couldn't do as a wolf? E.g. is the wolf figuring out which humans are responsible for urban development, and is trying to reverse the spread of human settlements on wolf territory by redirecting them to bear territory?

My thought is that the wolfwere would use it's human form to target those that it can't hunt as a wolf. It's smart enough to know that if stories about a wolf that cannot die get around people will try silver, and it can't easily approach country estates, mayorial manors or village centers while a wolf. Opening locked doors is also tricky with paws.

As a man it can approach a community under the guise of needing shelter for the night, murder gate guards and steal their keys so it can slip into a guarded property or walled village. Actual targets of such killings would be rather opportunistic I think, unlike a werewolf it has no emotional connections to the people in the area, though killing the leaders of the communities is an obvious choice for an alpha predator with a sadistic streak to make, as is terror tactics designed to scare the surviving prey.

So targets for human killings; watchmen and sentries, local officials, the residents of noble estates including staff, especially staff if the noble is not currently in residence at that property. It is not quite smart enough, or just doesn't care, that killing nobles who aren't strictly local will draw lots of attention, and it hates people who hunt in it's forests anyway, which is what the landed gentry are likely to be in the area to do. While it is basically impossible to kill without preparation, it won't necessarily kill everyone in a given household in one night, but will generally kill almost everyone over the course of one full moon and then move on to a new household for the next one.

Wolf attacks on isolated people or small groups probably cluster towards the next intended target, forming a recognisable if somewhat confusing pattern.


BTW, does anyone else find Bearded Devils look really goofy in all their art?

[heydude6]

The motivation still seems a little unclear or uncompelling. Maybe it just really likes the taste of human flesh. Maybe the human form engages in cannibalism? That sounds interesting to me.

[Rolan7]

The motivation still seems a little unclear or uncompelling. Maybe it just really likes the taste of human flesh. Maybe the human form engages in cannibalism? That sounds interesting to me.

I think I like how alien the motivation is.  The underlying question is:  What would a wolf do if it could occasionally infiltrate human society?

World of Darkness werewolves are (by default) forest protectors, environmentalists, and I like how this isn't that.  This is an animal "[using] its human form to target those that it can't hunt as a wolf".  It targets threats, "watchmen and sentries", and past that - seems inclined to terrorize the populace.  That's a natural (sic) extension of canine social dynamics, establishing dominance and eliminating threats.

It hates people who hunt in its forests.  Why?  Because they aren't letting it eat first from their kills.

BTW, does anyone else find Bearded Devils look really goofy in all their art?

I am fond of chain devils too.  Both are a little goofy if you don't have a character on the line.

[Loud Whispers]

Please tell me you could pull that off with a boat oar

I'd hope so, that'd be terribly oarsome

So targets for human killings; watchmen and sentries, local officials, the residents of noble estates including staff, especially staff if the noble is not currently in residence at that property. It is not quite smart enough, or just doesn't care, that killing nobles who aren't strictly local will draw lots of attention, and it hates people who hunt in it's forests anyway, which is what the landed gentry are likely to be in the area to do. While it is basically impossible to kill without preparation, it won't necessarily kill everyone in a given household in one night, but will generally kill almost everyone over the course of one full moon and then move on to a new household for the next one.

Everyone is arguing over who assassinated the Crown Prince. Some people think it's the King's daughter, or the secondborn son. Others think it is the rival Kingdom, or the King's first captain. Actually it's the dreaded wolfwere, who remembers the Crown Prince stole his hunt one time

BTW, does anyone else find Bearded Devils look really goofy in all their art?

Mostly, but not goofy enough. I love me goofy, scary devils with heads for groins

I think I like how alien the motivation is.  The underlying question is:  What would a wolf do if it could occasionally infiltrate human society?

Eat apples and learn about economics apparently

[Grim Portent]

The motivation still seems a little unclear or uncompelling. Maybe it just really likes the taste of human flesh. Maybe the human form engages in cannibalism? That sounds interesting to me.

Fundamentally it's a reverse werewolf, where a normal werewolf engages in mindless animalistic slaughter because it represents the worst part of wolves, the wolfwere turns into a sociopathic serial killer because it represents the worst parts of humanity. It's fundamental motivations for killing are largely based on opportunism or percieved slights, and because it enjoys it rather than any reasonable anti-human sentiments like caring about the forests or opposing the spread of civilisation.

If anything it's a nicer person as a wolf than as a man because it isn't under the influence of the lunar curse, but it's still a rather insane wolf compared to the normal ones because it is still altered by it's cursed state.

[Kagus]

Random thought: A medusa infected with vampirism would be the ultimate foe, as you wouldn't be able to look at them directly and wouldn't be able to see them in mirrors.

[Loud Whispers]

Random thought: A medusa infected with vampirism would be the ultimate foe, as you wouldn't be able to look at them directly and wouldn't be able to see them in mirrors.

Until you've got a delta green squadron with camera lens visors or a blind swordsman who fights without seeing

[King Zultan]

I thought vampires couldn't show up on cameras ether.

[Kagus]

I thought vampires couldn't show up on cameras either.

Presumably just SLR cameras and the like due to the mirror, digital should probably work just fine.

[Kagus]

Nystul's/Arcanist's Magic Aura is poorly worded and either barely works at all or is potentially catastrophic in its uses.

Spoiler: Text of the spell (click to show/hide)

2nd-level illusion

Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a small square of silk)
Duration: 24 hours

You place an illusion on a creature or an object you touch so that divination spells reveal false information about it. The target can be a willing creature or an object that isn’t being carried or worn by another creature.

When you cast the spell, choose one or both of the following effects. The effect lasts for the duration. If you cast this spell on the same creature or object every day for 30 days, placing the same effect on it each time, the illusion lasts until it is dispelled.

False Aura: You change the way the target appears to spells and magical effects, such as Detect Magic, that detect magical auras. You can make a nonmagical object appear magical, a magical object appear nonmagical, or change the object’s magical aura so that it appears to belong to a specific school of magic that you choose. When you use this effect on an object, you can make the false magic apparent to any creature that handles the item.

Mask: You change the way the target appears to spells and magical effects that detect creature types, such as a paladin’s Divine Sense or the trigger of a symbol spell. You choose a creature type and other spells and magical effects treat the target as if it were a creature of that type or of that alignment.

Spell Lists: Wizard

False Magic. As "magical auras" aren't a particularly well-defined term, this seems to pretty much just relate to Detect Magic and letting mundane people see things as being magical (which may or may not be a bit of a shock to them, if it's unclear whether or not normal folks can usually tell if some things are magical or not). While curious, I'm mostly going to be ignoring this aspect of the spell, as I don't feel like doing the usual scam of selling bargain luckstones to people.


Mask. ...okay, so, right away the description of this effect contradicts the very first line of the spell's text. The examples given, Divine Sense and Symbol, are not Divination spells. So that means either it doesn't actually work, or we're dealing with some very bizarre "specific vs. general" ruling wherein the overall spell's description is the general rule (divination spells reveal false information), and this particular effect's description is the specific rule that overrides the general.

But even if we take that second reasoning, we're met with another conundrum. The beginning of the description says "You change the way the target appears to spells and magical effects that detect creature types", which we can interpret as any sort of "Detect (X)" ability. Okay, fine, that's cool. And it's even backed up by the first example being the Paladin's Divine Sense ability, which is definitely a kind of detect (X).

...but the second example given is "the trigger of a Symbol spell", which is not a detect (X) ability, and simply "detects" creature types by having them be described in the text of the spell.

Spoiler: Trigger section of the Symbol spell (click to show/hide)

When you cast this spell, you inscribe a harmful glyph either on a surface (such as a section of floor, a wall, or a table) or within an object that can be closed to conceal the glyph (such as a book, a scroll, or a treasure chest). If you choose a surface, the glyph can cover an area of the surface no larger than 10 feet in diameter. If you choose an object, that object must remain in its place; if the object is moved more than 10 feet from where you cast this spell, the glyph is broken, and the spell ends without being triggered.

The glyph is nearly invisible, requiring an Intelligence (Investigation) check against your spell save DC to find it.

You decide what triggers the glyph when you cast the spell. For glyphs inscribed on a surface, the most typical triggers include touching or stepping on the glyph, removing another object covering it, approaching within a certain distance of it, or manipulating the object that holds it. For glyphs inscribed within an object, the most common triggers are opening the object, approaching within a certain distance of it, or seeing or reading the glyph.

You can further refine the trigger so the spell is activated only under certain circumstances or according to a creature's physical characteristics (such as height or weight), or physical kind (for example, the ward could be set to affect hags or shapechangers). You can also specify creatures that don't trigger the glyph, such as those who say a certain password.

This is... Mildly problematic, given that it means any fiend or undead who has access to someone who can cast this spell can, over the course of a month, become permanently immune to any Symbol or presumably also Magic Circle spells that target that type of creature. It becomes even more problematic since the term "magical effects" gets included, meaning we need to have that discussion all over again to decide if a Paladin's smite is considered magical, or an Oathbreaker's aura that grants +CHA to damage rolls for nearby friendly "fiends" and "undead".

...it becomes catastrophically problematic when you realize that spell targeting is described in a spell's body text. One could argue that "target" and "detect" are distinct classes in the descriptive language, with one being active and the other passive, but... The wording in some spell texts makes this a little blurry, and it basically just comes down to "common sense" fiat.

But if not, and we take the wording "You choose a creature type and other spells and magical effects treat the target as if it were a creature of that type or of that alignment." at face value... Well gee. "Humanoid" is a creature type, and a buttload of spells target "humanoid" specifically. Change your type and never be affected by those spells again.

And this just gets increasingly stupid when you realize that the targeting text doesn't seem to distinguish between "creature" and "object", and the Mask effect specifically makes the target appear as a given creature type ("or alignment", but the effect text doesn't actually say anything about letting you change its perceived alignment. Which is weird). Think there's a magical trap somewhere? This rock is now a "humanoid", toss it into an area to see if it triggers on humanoids entering its zone.

...or we can crank the stupidity up even more, by virtue of the fact that there are no size restrictions given for a target object; only that it "isn't being carried or worn by another creature". Touch a really big rock. It's now a "beast". Awaken it or do whatever the hell else you'd like to do with a spell that specifically targets a beast/creature.

Interestingly, this can also let you do your very own Weekend at Bernie's cosplay by making a corpse (which is officially an object) be treated like a creature.


Do I think the spell should be run like that? God no, that's horrifying. But it makes it clear that this is one of those spells that really did not get many whacks with the sanity stick when it was written.



As an aside, Symbol: Death has the potential to deal 1,000d10 damage if you can get it to trigger in a way that the target(s) can't get out of the 60' radius sphere within 10 minutes. Save for half, of course.

[Grim Portent]

Dumb thought.

Fantasy settings often have giant invertebrates, spiders and centipedes and ants and so on.

Does this mean that there are also giant version of the animals that eat them?

Specifically, does this mean a giant threadsnake could exist?



Imagine it, a giant, toothless blind serpent with no teeth that just wants to chow down on giant ant eggs and larva. It pays no heed to anything else, other than being scared of light, it just wants to slither around like a giant derpmonster eating giant bug eggs.

[Kagus]

Specifically, does this mean a giant threadsnake could exist?

While I'm sure something like that could definitely find a niche in the ecosystem, I feel like predation by adventuring parties for the creation of huge novelty hats might drive the species to extinction... Which is why we're left with those beasts that develop more pointy means of defending themselves; such as the purple worms.


Something completely different that I'd never really even considered before... RAW, aside from some implied rules and special cases (blindsight, devil sight etc.), creatures affected by vision-blocking fields such as fog cloud, darkness, and wall of sand can attack each other normally. Without advantage or disadvantage.

This is because the attack rules state that you can attack a "creature, object or location" within the attack's range, but has no condition that you need to actually be able to see the given creature, object, or location. Indeed, there are even specific rules about attacking an opponent you can't see, which specifies that you have disadvantage on the attack roll made to attack such a target.

...but, then if you can't see an opponent that is making an attack roll against you, the opponent has advantage on the attack roll. Since advantage and disadvantage cancel each other out, two creatures that can't see each other will make normal attack rolls against one another, exactly the same rolls as if they could see each other normally.

I mentioned "implied rules", and that comes in the section for "Unseen Attackers and Targets":

When you attack a target that you can't see, you have disadvantage on the roll. This is true whether you're guessing the target's location or you're targeting a creature you can hear but not see. If the target isn't in the location you targeted, you automatically miss, but the DM typically just says that the attack missed, not whether you guessed the target's location correctly.

Emphasis mine.

So, the common sense interpretation is of course that you can't see an "unseen" opponent, and therefore can't know that it's there in order to target it with an attack (unless you "hear" it, which... again, isn't well-defined), so you have to guess at where they are and just try attacking where you think they might be. ...but, strictly speaking, this isn't actually outlined anywhere. I'm guessing this is another one of those things that got written while the AC was out.


In conclusion: The DMG index lists "Climax" right above "Climb onto a bigger creature", and I find that entertaining.

[Grim Portent]

The Blind vs Blind thing is what makes Devil's Sight Warlocks with Darkness a strong combo. Casting Darkness has basically no downsides in combat for anyone but ranged characters, and a DS warlock gets advantage to hit and disadvantage to be hit.

It's actually rather trivial to build a whole party that can fight while blind, and therefore use lots of blinding area spells. The Warlock has Devil's Sight, which lets them see through just Darkness, and Fighter's have Blind Fighting for 10 feet of Blindsight which lets them see through any vision obscuring effect. Both can be taken by basically anyone for the trivial price of a 2 level dip in Warlock, a 1 level dip in Fighter, or a feat. So by level 4 a party can all be able to benefit from the effects of magical darkness with no penalties, and some of them may also be able to fight unimpeded by fog clouds, sandstorms and other similar spells/effects.