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[hector13]

Oh God Jack I love you; some content!

hector13, why do you so dislike the idea of us looking at D1?  Furthermore, why even ask UXLZ for his thoughts on D1 if you're so convinced it's worthless?  Do you like asking people to do things you think are worthless for some reason?

I don't dislike the idea of us looking at D1, I just don't think there's much value there. This is my opinion, and I'm glad it's not shared by at least one other person.

This is why I asked UXLZ, a fresh player to the game, what they thought because they would hopefully have seen something I overlooked. I would've asked you the same thing, had my brain not been scrambled from so much insomnia.

hector13: This is wrong.  It is hard to overemphasize how wrong it is.  We had a sizable wagon on a townie.  One which almost certainly had scum on it.  One which people gave reasons for.  One which can be examined, can be analyzed, and such.  There is information there.  And you're not so inexperienced that this set of statements makes sense from you.

I appreciate that you think that of me, but the only information that seems to be there is the conversation I had with roo and the reasons people gave for voting them.

Having been involved in the conversation, I'm not sure I can analyse it, but if people have questions about it that's a good thing. Fire away, peeps.

I don't think there's much value in D1 because pretty much every player voted for roo, and the two players who didn't replaced out, so it could be that they would've voted for roo, too. Some of the players are new, so don't quite know what's scummy and anti-town, or that there's a difference between the two, so that might not be so useful either. I may be wrong in that view, though.

Ggamer, for example, said that roo's behaviour was suspicious, but didn't say why, and Cryxis didn't give a reason either, though you've already pointed that out to them.

Spoiler: things on roo (click to show/hide)

Does that mean you were scared other people would actually vote for you? Based on zero evidence?
someone should be insulted.

Not especially. I want to know why you're encouraging other people to vote for me with zero evidence. That's scummy.

What do you think roo was implying about the nature of his vote in that quote?

I don't like the feel of this question, but that's probably more of a pedantic thing... I don't know what he implied, but I'll tell you what I inferred.

I inferred from the first and second questions that they thought my reaction is scummy, because I felt the need to defend myself. This generally happens when someone votes me though, irrespective of it being an RVS or "real" vote. Every vote, however well-justified, is a step closer to a lynch.

The third question I inferred that they thought I was insulting the rest of the town by worrying that others would join them in voting for me, based on their non-reasons for voting me. Doesn't mean it can't happen.

And everyone I was not sure sure. I was just going with my gut and trying to get reactions. tho those reactions were Lolwut ones.

And how about this quote, from a post I know you read?  Is there a reason you completely ignored this line about reaction testing?

I don't really know what to say to things like that, I think that's the first time someone has tested me in such a way.

"Nice reaction test, you've just turned the entire town against you"?

I thought it was them trying to back out of behaviour that a number of people were seeing as scummy.

Everyone: I would love to see your thoughts on D1 and the roowagon votes.

Like I say, 6 of the 8 players that could voted for roo, and the other two replaced out. That's part of the reason why I didn't think we can gain much from looking at it, at least beyond the reasons that people said they voted for roo.

Peradon, hector13, ggamer, and cryxis: What led you to believe that roo's behaviour was specifically scum behaviour?  Do you think scum would act so disruptively D1?

To answer your second question first, it now does seem unlikely. However, counter-question: do you think it's wise to keep that disruptive influence in the game? Roo's opinion, based on what happened, would have been a devalued currency after that, so even if they hadn't been lynched, I'm not sure what they could've added to the game that anyone would take seriously.

Roo's behaviour was anti-town, at best. They were encouraging people to vote for me sans evidence, which is what I initially thought was scummy about it. I don't mind votes on me, so long as I can address the reason behind it. None was given (other than buddying; read my response to Perry for what I think about that) despite people asking for it, and despite their assertions we were out of RVS, kept moving their vote around without much behind it, so I kept my vote on them.

Hector13: I dont like the way you were trying to buddy up to me. It felt a lot like the last BM we played. You pretty much said that I coulde be trusted because I'm active. This seems like a stupid excuse to me, thus the vote.

Why do people keep doing that? Words in my mouth and everything.

I don't like it when people are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say you could be trusted because you were active, I said I was trusting you, for the time being, because you were the only other active player at that point. Scum don't have any reason to keep the game moving by posting, so I was quite happy to read you as town while I was waiting for everyone else to get involved.

The questions I was asking you were utter shite, mostly because I was tired (I went to bed about an hour after my last post, and then woke up 3 hours later. Yay!) and I was trying to get more information in the game because, like I said before, I didn't think D1 would garner much intelligence. That doesn't work well when your brain is running on fumes, apparently.

I don't think suspected buddying is enough to vote for someone to be lynched, and you're also voting for me despite saying two other players are scummier than me, so if it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're quite as towny anymore, Peradon

[Peradon]

Why do people keep doing that? Words in my mouth and everything.

I don't like it when people are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say you could be trusted because you were active, I said I was trusting you, for the time being, because you were the only other active player at that point. Scum don't have any reason to keep the game moving by posting, so I was quite happy to read you as town while I was waiting for everyone else to get involved.

How is that putting words in your mouth? I dont like the fact that you were not trying to scumhunt me at all, mainly because I was active. The fact that I am active, and was present to answer questions should have spurred you to scumhunt me. Instead, you resign to ask questions to the lurkers, who dont answer questions very much.

I don't think suspected buddying is enough to vote for someone to be lynched, and you're also voting for me despite saying two other players are scummier than me, so if it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're quite as towny anymore, Peradon

First off, where did I say that there were other people more scummy than you? I'm fairly certain I didnt. I think I know who you are talking about, mainly Nerjin and ggamer. But I find buddying to be a much bigger scumtell than Lurking.

Plus, that was an OMGUS if I ever saw one.

[UXLZ]

Note: Went to post this and forum maintenance. Guess I'll get around to it tomorrow morning.

Getting introductions out of the way, I'm UXLZ and I am replacing in for Melanthius. I'm not officially an IC, but I'll be trying to give advice regardless. (Take anything I say with a grain of salt however, because I don't have the 'this is definitely true' IC text. An important thing to do in Mafia is have a healthy suspicion of what other people say unless it's confirm-able via cross referencing.)
Before I start, noting that newbies tend to have their opinion massively swayed by relatively minor things... Try not to become certain that someone is scum due to a single post (or town for that matter.) You need to look at a sizable chunk of content and take everything into account.
Fairly long post written in a weird order, so I might repeat myself from time to time. Sorry about that.

Okay then, let's get into stuff... Do note that I'm mostly (not entirely) ignoring D1, so if there's something important there, my apologies if I missed it. It is an incredibly messy day.

@Jack:

Because I watched D1 as six players, including one of the ICs, lynched an incredibly obvious (at least to me) townie.

Is this in your IC voice or your normal voice? If it's IC then I'm obligated to trust that you're telling the truth, but claiming that someone was obviously town after they've flipped is mostly empty air.

By this point, the idea that roo should be lynched even if town was getting pretty strong, but at least those voting him leaned towards him being scum.  Not so with Nerjin, who takes no position on roo's townhood or scumhood, and just votes for him because he's damaging town.  Not a good vote at all.  Uncaring about the alignment of the lynched, and absolutely positionless.  Troubling.

That's a pretty bad sign if even the IC is throwing his vote onto someone without any reason aside from 'hurting town.' Now, admittedly at the point where he voted for Roo it was fairly likely he was going to be lynched, but it seems quite bandwagony. Nerjin's an IC so I can't really see why he'd vote for someone so lazily. (Newbies can be excused though perhaps only once, because they don't really know any better.)
Cryxis' and ggamer's votes are pretty abysmal, but as they're new I'll gloss over it. Do note you two that I won't be forgiving if you do something similar again; once can be put down to ignorance, twice is too often to be unintentional.

Everyone: I would love to see your thoughts on D1 and the roowagon votes.

I can barely even get started on D1 it's so messy... My eyes just sort of glaze over. If you think it's necessary I can look at it more closely, but my main guess is that most of the info I'll glean will be 'everyone is new and has no clue what they're doing.'

My thoughts on the Roo votes, summarized, are this:

Peradon: As you said, reasonable, I can't see anything wrong with it.
Hector: Like Peradon's, reasonable.
Gamer: Reasons are starting to slip at this point on the wagon. I'd like him to point out where Roo was getting overdefensive.
OScienceG: I dislike the 'convince us you're of benefit to the Town'  reasoning because even useless players, if town, still stop scum from winning just by their existence. However, at this point he's flipped so it's mostly pointless to look into it further.
Nerjin and Cryxis: Mentioned above. I'm highly suspicious of Nerjin at this point (especially considering his inactivity) and he's probably my strongest 'instant' scum read, but I'll have to do more reading to really know for sure.
PPE: Reading more, it seems he's swamped with stuff IRL. I still dislike that he chose to vote for Roo regardless, but I guess that's somewhat of an explanation...?
Regardless, he said he should have more time tomorrow... I hope he doesn't fail to deliver.
Cryxis' vote is pretty incredibly bad but as a newbie I guess it gets a pass.

it'd be a pretty dumb play for scum to be that disruptive

Some people try to take refuge in audacity (it never works.) I disagree with Jack saying that lynching Roo was terrible (though I'll admit the only players I've seen act quite so ridiculous have been town), it was (in my opinion) the correct choice at the time. Mislynching is never a good thing, though, so it's bad but only in hindsight. (Lynching people just because you think they're hurting the town even if you don't think they're actually scum is also a bad thing.)

vote Hector because he seems to be constantly accusing me of being scum and he is tipping my suspicion.

I'll let the OMGUS slip for now since you're new, but if you're going to continue voting for Hector I want to see some better reasons than 'he's suspecting me.'

Bit of advice: Asking a lot of questions is a good thing.  We want lots of questions.

Well... Sensible questions. RVS is over so the questions should probably be game-related, about things that caught your attention and so on.

I didnt think about the lynch in those terms, but I guess you have a point. Right now, the most scummy would be ggamer and Nerjin. ggamer because he didnt give a good reason for voting

Why ggamer and not Cryxis? Cryxis' vote had an even worse reason. I hope you haven't discounted him as scum purely due to your trick question, since I simply cannot imagine anyone ever falling for that anyway.

Hector13: I dont like the way you were trying to buddy up to me. It felt a lot like the last BM we played. You pretty much said that I coulde be trusted because I'm active. This seems like a stupid excuse to me, thus the vote.

Active players do tend to be town more often, but if he's townreading you based on that... It's not a very good idea.

More importantly however, you say that he's buddying you, but where? If you're going to vote for someone, offer some evidence. It adds a lot more weight. Interpretations of buddying is also something purely subjective, so I wouldn't build a case entirely on that, though that's your prerogative.

[hector13]

Why do people keep doing that? Words in my mouth and everything.

I don't like it when people are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say you could be trusted because you were active, I said I was trusting you, for the time being, because you were the only other active player at that point. Scum don't have any reason to keep the game moving by posting, so I was quite happy to read you as town while I was waiting for everyone else to get involved.

How is that putting words in your mouth? I dont like the fact that you were not trying to scumhunt me at all, mainly because I was active. The fact that I am active, and was present to answer questions should have spurred you to scumhunt me. Instead, you resign to ask questions to the lurkers, who dont answer questions very much.

Because you said I said you could pretty much be trusted, which I categorically did not.

I said at that moment in time that because you were being active and trying to get other people involved that I felt (as in, my gut-read was) you were town, but you then seemed to think that that was a solid read that wasn't going to change.

What about our interaction suggests to you that I wasn't trying to scumhunt you? If you read the responses from 178-190, I at first responded to your questions from 177, and then I was the one asking you questions about what you thought about the game and why you gave the responses you did. You answered and didn't ask me anything in return, so if anyone wasn't scumhunting, it was you, sunshine.

You start thinking I was buddying you in 190, which confused me at the time - not a nice thing to happen when your brain is in La-La Land - which is part of the reason why I gave a slightly bizarre response, and then didn't answer your question at first because I wanted to know why you thought I was buddying you. You then pointed out what response you felt was buddying (as in, one out of all the responses between 178 and 186) and say I'm dodging the question! Am I not allowed to ask you to clarify your position?

I don't think suspected buddying is enough to vote for someone to be lynched, and you're also voting for me despite saying two other players are scummier than me, so if it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're quite as towny anymore, Peradon

First off, where did I say that there were other people more scummy than you? I'm fairly certain I didnt. I think I know who you are talking about, mainly Nerjin and ggamer. But I find buddying to be a much bigger scumtell than Lurking.

Plus, that was an OMGUS if I ever saw one.

And I call bullshit on that.

I'm calling you out on your reason for voting, I don't think buddying is a big scumtell, because being friendly isn't exclusive to scum.

You said in this post that you think the most scummy (as in, more scummy than everyone else) players were Nerjin and ggamer, so don't talk shite about not saying anyone was scummier than me.

You said I wasn't scumhunting you when I was, you just freaked out over potential buddying, and then said it felt like what I was doing in the previous BM game. I don't really know what I should feel on that, because you're using something I did (poorly) in another game to say I'm scum in this one... which strikes me, personally, as quite stupid.

You then accuse me of giving you an OMGUS (oh my god you suck, for the new players. bad thing to do, generally a scum-tell) for calling you out on your reasons for voting me.

So, in all, fuck you Peradon. You look like you're trying to invent a case from the tiniest things, and making up nonsense to back it up. Town have no reason to do this.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

Ya I think this will be the only game of mafia I ever play

[Peradon]

I didnt think about the lynch in those terms, but I guess you have a point. Right now, the most scummy would be ggamer and Nerjin. ggamer because he didnt give a good reason for voting

Why ggamer and not Cryxis? Cryxis' vote had an even worse reason. I hope you haven't discounted him as scum purely due to your trick question, since I simply cannot imagine anyone ever falling for that anyway.

The reason I chose ggamer over Cryxis is because ggamer seems to be able to express his thoughts a little better than Cryxis, and Cryxis' vote reeked with noobiness, wheras ggamer didnt reek as much.

Hector13: I dont like the way you were trying to buddy up to me. It felt a lot like the last BM we played. You pretty much said that I coulde be trusted because I'm active. This seems like a stupid excuse to me, thus the vote.

More importantly however, you say that he's buddying you, but where? If you're going to vote for someone, offer some evidence. It adds a lot more weight. Interpretations of buddying is also something purely subjective, so I wouldn't build a case entirely on that, though that's your prerogative.

Yeah, I quoted it a couple pages back:

So... should we be looking at less-active players as most viable scum-spects?

It was this post that struck me as slight buddying. It looks like you either assumed that I'm town, or that you know I'm town. I may be overreacting, but it struck me as odd that you would say it that way.

Also, you just dodged my question again. What did your response have to do with buddying?

Through my scumhunting of him, I found out that he was not scumhunting me based on the fact that I was active, which, like I said earlier, I find suspect. I would think that town dont know who to trust, and should thus keep open their net to everyone at all times. Scum, on the other hand, know exactly who is town, and thus can judge other people.

PPE:

Why do people keep doing that? Words in my mouth and everything.

I don't like it when people are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say you could be trusted because you were active, I said I was trusting you, for the time being, because you were the only other active player at that point. Scum don't have any reason to keep the game moving by posting, so I was quite happy to read you as town while I was waiting for everyone else to get involved.

How is that putting words in your mouth? I dont like the fact that you were not trying to scumhunt me at all, mainly because I was active. The fact that I am active, and was present to answer questions should have spurred you to scumhunt me. Instead, you resign to ask questions to the lurkers, who dont answer questions very much.

Because you said I said you could pretty much be trusted, which I categorically did not.

I said at that moment in time that because you were being active and trying to get other people involved that I felt (as in, my gut-read was) you were town, but you then seemed to think that that was a solid read that wasn't going to change.

I never said that I thought it was a solid read, I said that you werent open to the idea that I may be scum at the time, due to the fact that I was active. This is my point: Town should be open to the idea that anyone else can be scum. You admitted that I was a town read(at that moment...) because I was active. That is what I find scummy and furthers the idea of you buddying.

What about our interaction suggests to you that I wasn't trying to scumhunt you? If you read the responses from 178-190, I at first responded to your questions from 177, and then I was the one asking you questions about what you thought about the game and why you gave the responses you did. You answered and didn't ask me anything in return, so if anyone wasn't scumhunting, it was you, sunshine.

You are right, you were slightly scumhunting me. But my point was that you were giving me a "temporary"(In quotes because that makes no sense) town read based on activity. Scum can be active too.

You start thinking I was buddying you in 190, which confused me at the time - not a nice thing to happen when your brain is in La-La Land - which is part of the reason why I gave a slightly bizarre response, and then didn't answer your question at first because I wanted to know why you thought I was buddying you. You then pointed out what response you felt was buddying (as in, one out of all the responses between 178 and 186) and say I'm dodging the question! Am I not allowed to ask you to clarify your position?

Well I should actually ask you why my questions seemed like buddying to you, actually. That's more sensible.

You could have very well answered the question without clarification on my motives. It looks like an attempt to not answer the question.

I don't think suspected buddying is enough to vote for someone to be lynched, and you're also voting for me despite saying two other players are scummier than me, so if it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're quite as towny anymore, Peradon

First off, where did I say that there were other people more scummy than you? I'm fairly certain I didnt. I think I know who you are talking about, mainly Nerjin and ggamer. But I find buddying to be a much bigger scumtell than Lurking.

Plus, that was an OMGUS if I ever saw one.

And I call bullshit on that.

I'm calling you out on your reason for voting, I don't think buddying is a big scumtell, because being friendly isn't exclusive to scum.

You said in this post that you think the most scummy (as in, more scummy than everyone else) players were Nerjin and ggamer, so don't talk shite about not saying anyone was scummier than me.

If you actually read the context of that post, and the question I was answering, you would find that it was in relation to D1, not an overall scum-read list.

You said I wasn't scumhunting you when I was, you just freaked out over potential buddying, and then said it felt like what I was doing in the previous BM game. I don't really know what I should feel on that, because you're using something I did (poorly) in another game to say I'm scum in this one... which strikes me, personally, as quite stupid.

I'm not using it as proof. You asked why I thought it was buddying, and I answered. You were buddying me in the other game, and I see similarities between that, and now.

You then accuse me of giving you an OMGUS (oh my god you suck, for the new players. bad thing to do, generally a scum-tell) for calling you out on your reasons for voting me.

You say it was for calling me out on my reasons for voting. How did you call me out on anything? You state what you think is a larger scumtell, and that its not buddying. That is all. Its your opinion. Then you say this:

so if it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're quite as towny anymore, Peradon

That is an OMGUS. You are responding directly to my vote with an FoS.

So, in all, fuck you Peradon. You look like you're trying to invent a case from the tiniest things, and making up nonsense to back it up. Town have no reason to do this.

I am not inventing a case. I saw buddying, and acted on it with a vote. Now you come out with an OMGUS, and that rang quite a few alarms. So, no, I'm not inventing a case.

Ya I think this will be the only game of mafia I ever play

That is a shame. It is a really fun game when you get into it.

[UXLZ]

It may be too stressful for Cryxis... Or time constraints get in the way.

Whyyyy do people react so hard to small things?

'He voted me, therefore he's scum!'
'He said he wasn't scum, therefore he's not scum!'

Blaaaaargh.

I'll post more when I get home.

[hector13]

Fuckin' walls of text Perry. Thank you.

I'm not using it as proof. You asked why I thought it was buddying, and I answered. You were buddying me in the other game, and I see similarities between that, and now.

Hector13: I dont like the way you were trying to buddy up to me. It felt a lot like the last BM we played. You pretty much said that I coulde be trusted because I'm active. This seems like a stupid excuse to me, thus the vote.

I don't see how you're not using the other game as proof. You say it feels like the other game, so you're using the other game as a foundation for your thoughts on this game, instead of thinking about this game on its own merits. My buddying attempt in the other game, as scum, was a failure because everyone jumped on it. Why would I, if I were scum, try it again, to the same player, in pretty much the very next game? Do you really think I'm that stupid?

Those were the only reasons you gave in your vote text for me: buddying and an erroneous assumption that I refused to consider you as scum. Every read I make (and probably everyone makes) is temporary, because it's subject to change from new information. It would be stupid for me to think my initial read on someone was ironclad.

That is an OMGUS. You are responding directly to my vote with an FoS

I FoS'd you because I wanted you to know how seriously I don't think buddying is scummy (and you're basing it off my play in the other game, where it didn't work...) and that you made an erroneous assumption that I wasn't going to consider you as scum. How can you possibly know what I'm thinking?

You asked me two questions (reply 196, 198) about my read on you, and apparently that's enough for you to divine the entire nature of my thoughts on you and your role, and label me scum. I asked you five questions (replies 178,180,182,184,186) - which I will admit deteriorated in the quality of answers they would get as they went on because of fatigue and lack of imagination - but that's not enough for me to get a tentative read on you? Double Standards, perhaps?

I never said that I thought it was a solid read, I said that you werent open to the idea that I may be scum at the time, due to the fact that I was active. This is my point: Town should be open to the idea that anyone else can be scum. You admitted that I was a town read(at that moment...) because I was active. That is what I find scummy and furthers the idea of you buddying

Can you tell me the difference between what you think is a solid read and not considering the possibility that the read may be wrong?

In what way was I not considering you as scum by saying "for the moment I think you're town"? How would it be different from putting you at or near the top of a reads list? Is that buddying too? You were the only person I could get a read on at that point because you were the only one actually posting. Is it wrong (or buddying) for me to think that you might be town because of that?

I agree that people should consider that everyone could be scum, but not that everyone actually is scum, because then you start getting paranoid over everything. You need to consider that people could be town as well.

You could have very well answered the question without clarification on my motives. It looks like an attempt to not answer the question.

I could've answered your question, but you likely wouldn't have understood the response because your question didn't make sense to me. I didn't know what I was doing that had to do with buddying, so I couldn't respond until I knew why you thought I was buddying. Do you expect people to be able to properly answer a question they don't understand?

If you actually read the context of that post, and the question I was answering, you would find that it was in relation to D1, not an overall scum-read list.

I didnt think about the lynch in those terms, but I guess you have a point. Right now, the most scummy would be ggamer and Nerjin. ggamer because he didnt give a good reason for voting, basically saying he's suspicous. I mentioned this earlier, very briefly. Nerjin, basically for what you said.

Would you care to explain why you said, at that moment, why you thought two people were scummier than me and then voted me shortly thereafter?

I am not inventing a case. I saw buddying, and acted on it with a vote. Now you come out with an OMGUS, and that rang quite a few alarms. So, no, I'm not inventing a case.

I think you're inventing a case on me because the basis of your vote stems from my behaviour in another game, not this one. You made an erroneous assumption about the solidity of my read on you. You claim my FoS was an OMGUS, when you assume I'm only doing it because you voted for me, instead of encouraging you to consider why you're voting for me.

Why do you think buddying is a scum-tell? Or is it just me because I did it in the other game?

Do you understand what I mean about you making assumptions about my read on you, and why I think you have double standards over your read on me? Does that change anything for you? If not, why?

I ask too many rhetorical questions *sigh* The two questions above this one I would like answers to, and the green highlighted ones. Don't skip over everything else though, it does have a lot to do with why I'm voting for you just now.

[ggamer]

i'll post later tonight, i've got a pre-cal midterm to work on

[Nerjin]

Well looks like my job has been taken over by other players. Excellent as life seems to hate me being in a position to teach. Anyways I promised reads and here’s what I have. Obviously I won’t be including the dead.
Before I get into anything more concrete:

Peradon – Hits Roo with a vote first because Roo chose to play like an insane puppy on meth. His reasoning Day 1 was pretty spot on so I can’t fault him for that.
Hector – Voted Roo about 9 hours later with the, correct, assumption that he couldn’t defend himself from Roo’s accusations because Roo didn’t say what it was about Hector that tipped off his scumdar.
GGgamer – Voted Roo next. Stated that he was suspicios but didn’t mention why at first. He later elaborates that he did so because he views Roo as either scum or a town who is just throwing up a smokescreen for scum.
Nerjin – This handsome devil voted Roo because, in its entirety, Roo simply was harmful to town. Apparently some people view that as a negative thing but I view it as eliminating another day’s worth of us all arguing with Roo while he does nothng useful.

Cyrixis voted Roo but only stated that he didn’t really have anything to say and was watching for ‘suspicious peeps’ which is… Probably something I should have talked to him about but puts up a pretty big flag in general. Interestingly his vote came in at the last minute…

Melanthius never did or said anything of note. Which is, itself, noteworthy I suppose.

So based on JUST Day 1 stuff I would say my list looks something like this [removing Roo and Origami as they died]

Town
Nerjin [I cheated and looked at his Role PM. He’s town.]
Hector [For good reasoning and overall excellent activity]
Peradon [Same as above. Probably tied]
GGgamer  [Reasoning was good. Activity less so.]
Deathsword [I honestly forgot he existed as this is a Pre-post edit. He said a few basic things but didn’t really interact with the game much.]
Melanthius [Activity was atrocious. Stated nothing useful]
Cyrix [Voted Roo at the last minute, possibly as an attempt to say “But I voted with everyone else” when people called him on his lack of activity on Day 2, and he also stated he wanted to play VERY passively.]
Scum

As for Day 2 there were some replacements. Namely Melanthius and Deathsword were replaced by UXLZ and Jack AT respectively.

Now let’s stop the wrap-up and start the… Un…wrap up? I dunno. I’m starting now regardless.

First off, any questions to me will be answered here. Even if I already answered them in my previous post these will, hopefully, be a bit more useful.

Spoiler: Questions to Nerjin (click to show/hide)

Nerjin:Why have you been so lurky?

I wake up at roughly 7:30 every day. Go to College from 9-3ish. I have 4 forum games currently running [which are also suffering from this by the way], it is midterm week, and this past week I have either had work or no access to a computer. It’s unfortunate but I’m starting to think there is a deity. And that deity hates the idea of me playing Mafia because any time I try to get into the game EVERYTHING gets busy.

Nerjin: Come on, post! Say something! Who do you suspect the most? Why?

At the time of this writing it is currently Cyrix due to what I stated above. Unfortunately I haven’t read all of day 2 as I write this so that will likely change as I read more about your and Hector’s current interactions.

Nerjin, that was quite the vote D1.  You jumped on a big bandwagon without even having an explicit position on roo's alignment.  Was that really the best you could do?

Again: Probably not. I still stand by that it was a good vote at the time. He was acting incredibly suspicious and Very anti-town. Obviously he was town but that doesn’t mean that he was  a pro-town player.

Spoiler: Hector (click to show/hide)

Deathsword you were the only one not voting for roo, why was that?

Not voting someone isn’t indicative of much on Day 1 I’m afraid. Especially considering what we’ve since learned about our exIC.

Why do you think Origami was targeted?

This line of questioning will only lead to WIFoM which doesn't really help anyone and only sets up false solutions. Most people do this in rookie games though. You learn to not to look too deep into "What if"s.

Spoiler: Peradon (click to show/hide)

Hector: I just read over the past page or so. Your interaction with me seems a bit like buddying. I have my eye on you...

As Hector pointed out: He was the only person talking to you. I fail to see how that is buddying in the slightest. It’s being active. He only has you to talk to so he talks.

So... should we be looking at less-active players as most viable scum-spects?

It was this post that struck me as slight buddying. It looks like you either assumed that I'm town, or that you know I'm town. I may be overreacting, but it struck me as odd that you would say it that way.

Also, you just dodged my question again. What did your response have to do with buddying?

For context: You had just said that scum might have killed OSG because he was active. This implies that less active players might be the scum. It had nothing to do with you in any aspect. Here’s a question for you: What exactly has he done that seems like buddying?

Hector13: I dont like the way you were trying to buddy up to me. It felt a lot like the last BM we played. You pretty much said that I coulde be trusted because I'm active. This seems like a stupid excuse to me, thus the vote.

You're being awfully antagonistic over something you can't prove. How is he buddying you? Between the two posts I’ve quoted he hasn’t said much, if anything, to you.

Spoiler: Jack (click to show/hide)

I don't get strong reads normally, and I was getting a very strong town read on roo.  He was disruptive, arrogant, and pretty incomprehensible, yes, but his actions made pretty much no sense for scum.  He was quite obviously used to playing elsewhere (clear signs of experience, plus significantly different playstyle from the local one), and was quite clearly trying to push everyone out of RVS as soon as possible.  It was a poor plan done quite poorly, but that's basically what he did.  And then he floundered under pressure.  Not answering questions didn't help at all, too.

So… What in all that made him seem Town?

Spoiler: Cyrix (click to show/hide)

So you think roo is scum because everyone else thinks roo is scum?

I will not answer [this] question as he has no proof that I am targeting anyone nor will I justify such a question.

I vote Hector because he seems to be constantly accusing me of being scum and he is tipping my suspicion.

You are asking no questions and only jumped on the bandwagon at the last second. It really seem, to me, that you did so in order to say “No! I voted like everyone else! Look. See? So what if it killed a townie! Everyone else did it.” Which doesn’t work. Explain your Roo vote.

Oh, and OMGuS doesn’t make you seem town. Pro-tip.

Cyrix until he actually explains why he voted Roo.

Unfortunately that’s all I have time for right now… I’ll do more as I can.

[Peradon]

Hector: I'm going to wait and see what other people say about the buddying thing before responding to your post. I may have overreacted a little, so I want to see if other people see the buddying...

Nerjin: It was reply 186. Plus, his "temporary" assumption that I'm town felt like buddying.

[hector13]

I'm stuck between thinking that's fine and you not being able to form your own opinions... hm.

I'm upset I can't condense my wall of text thoughts down to Nerjin's three bloody sentences though

[UXLZ]

Nerjin – This handsome devil voted Roo because, in its entirety, Roo simply was harmful to town. Apparently some people view that as a negative thing but I view it as eliminating another day’s worth of us all arguing with Roo while he does nothng useful.

Mmm... It's more that I don't think lynching someone if you think they're town is a good idea. Roo was easily acting scummily enough at the time that I would have agreed with the lynch had I been there, but I just think it's bad in hindsight where we know he's town. (That is, him being lynched was correct, him being town is unfortunate. If I knew for 100% certain he was town I wouldn't lynch him.)

So… What in all that made him seem Town?

That's why I wanted to clarify if  he was saying that as an IC or not. If he was doing so as an IC we're obligated to trust him, but otherwise...

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

I VOTED ROO BECAUSE IT WAS RANDOM VOTING, EVERYONE ELSE VOTED ON THEM AND I VOTED LAST MINUTE BECAUSE OF TIME RESTRAINTS

[Nerjin]

It was no longer random voting. everyone else had a reason. You voting them specifically because everyone else was voting them is NOT a good reason.