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Author Topic: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art  (Read 230108 times)

Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #345 on: June 22, 2016, 12:36:13 pm »

Legs are heavier, so 100 contact perc gives more force than 100 contact perc on an arm. It's not huge, I usually mod them so kicks have more velocity with slower recover, better prepare though since they're longer, you can hit with a kick before you can with a punch.

Just from looking at the vanilla values, I totally forgot there were scratch attacks, I removed those and all the "slaps with the flat" attacks due to being stupid.

scratching seems better if you have claws though. Plus even humans are more likely to draw blood when scratching than when punching, which has its uses.
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Max™

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #346 on: June 22, 2016, 01:40:03 pm »

Yeah, but the way the game picks edged attacks more than blunt even if listed as secondary priority just bugs me, I left it for animals and animal people.

Speaking of which, animal people have kisat dur options which others don't.

I mostly use vanilla kicks for flavor, since punching someone in the head while grappling their leg is silly.

Having the attacks more distinct though, I use kicks when I specifically want to crush/knock someone away, I use punches for quick recovery and gut popping (edged property), I use elbows when I'm in the middle of a pile of enemies or want to knock someone back without sending them across the screen, and I use knees to smush faces or for a bit more forceful elbow type strike.
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IndigoFenix

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #347 on: June 22, 2016, 02:27:44 pm »

Scratching is pretty effective, even for humans (actually I think it's exactly the same regardless of species, aside from overall body size).  The game seems to calculate the nail as being the same size as the entire finger, so scratches are basically like stabbing with little stilettos.  You can regularly sever tendons and nerves with them.  They generally aren't as effective as bites though.

Broseph Stalin

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #348 on: June 22, 2016, 02:33:15 pm »

Fundamentals
Spoiler: Combat Levels (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Basic Attacks (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Zones of Attack (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Status Effects (click to show/hide)

Here's what I'm working with right now.

Eric Blank

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #349 on: June 23, 2016, 12:45:22 am »

You should also add gouges to your list of attacks and combat levels; gouges will immediately escalate a fight as well.
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #350 on: June 23, 2016, 03:16:44 am »

Yus. Now how best to seque this into some of the exploits, like grabjump? owo
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Broseph Stalin

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #351 on: June 23, 2016, 11:13:01 am »

Spoiler: Defense (click to show/hide)


Yus. Now how best to seque this into some of the exploits, like grabjump? owo
One of the big problems I had in the original manual was how to organize stuff. I think I'm going to put together a section on Advanced Techniques that includes the basic slams then include the weapon grab slams in the disarming section.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2016, 11:21:29 am by Broseph Stalin »
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leafbarrett

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #352 on: June 23, 2016, 01:35:16 pm »

I've found the slam to actually be very effective in a couple situations. One is when chasing a fleeing opponent that you're struggling to catch up to - a sprinting leap will cover the distance and crash into the enemy. Even if they aren't injured, you'll still be able to run up to them before they land and be ready to attack immediately, and they'll often be stunned as well.
The other is when an ally is getting hammered by one or more opponents and you're not immediately nearby to help - since jumping moves so quickly, leaping from a distance instead of just sprinting to close the gap can get you into the fray immediately and sometimes knock one or more attackers away, taking the pressure off of the ally. This is more important if you're actually concerned with keeping companions alive, like I am, as it does put you at risk should it fail, but it does its job in a pinch.
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Zanzetkuken The Great

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #353 on: June 23, 2016, 03:44:28 pm »

Out of curiosity, just how practical is it to perform these moves in reality?  I would find it hilarious if a practical fighting style was developed due to a video game.
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #354 on: June 23, 2016, 03:59:00 pm »

Out of curiosity, just how practical is it to perform these moves in reality?  I would find it hilarious if a practical fighting style was developed due to a video game.

I suspect the end result will be hilarity, regardless of how well it goes.
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peasant cretin

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #355 on: June 23, 2016, 04:13:56 pm »

Out of curiosity, just how practical is it to perform these moves in reality?  I would find it hilarious if a practical fighting style was developed due to a video game.

I suspect the end result will be hilarity, regardless of how well it goes.

Kisat Dur was very effective during previous versions (biting, punching, scratching and wrestling have always been overpowered), but now with the effects of shear force damage it'll be even better and with even more hilarity. DF has never really had " 'tis but a scratch!"
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Broseph Stalin

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #356 on: June 23, 2016, 04:28:57 pm »

Out of curiosity, just how practical is it to perform these moves in reality?  I would find it hilarious if a practical fighting style was developed due to a video game.
I never practiced any martial arts but I've read a lot of military combat manuals and I don't see it being particularly effective. The thing is that DF is super abstract in some places so the instructions for Kisat Dur are a lot more helpful in game than they would be in life. Like Asasokab, you catch a punch, make it a wrist lock, and snap the wrist. There's a lot of stuff you need to know to make that happen. You also have a lot fewer concerns in DF. If you punch someone in the helmet so hard that the whiplash snaps their neck then your hand is no longer going to look or function like a hand.

Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #357 on: June 23, 2016, 04:53:28 pm »

I was gonna say that yeah, it's maybe decent for illuminating the fundamentals like "joint locks are good for your health" and "don't forget that fingernails can really fucking hurt" and such. However. One, it doesn't translate from "what do I do?" to "how do I do that?" and two, you don't need Kisat Dur to get that sort of basic understanding. XP
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peasant cretin

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #358 on: June 23, 2016, 05:30:30 pm »

Out of curiosity, just how practical is it to perform these moves in reality?  I would find it hilarious if a practical fighting style was developed due to a video game.

I suspect the end result will be hilarity, regardless of how well it goes.

Kisat Dur was very effective during previous versions (biting, punching, scratching and wrestling have always been overpowered), but now with the effects of shear force damage it'll be even better and with even more hilarity. DF has never really had " 'tis but a scratch!"

Huh, I just completely misread all that...well that's pretty normal.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2016, 05:41:07 pm by peasant cretin »
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leafbarrett

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #359 on: June 23, 2016, 06:06:18 pm »

Öndin Abod (Fade Strike)
When fighting a large cluster of enemies at once, you may find that you can't even get a strike in because incoming attacks from all sides are forcing you to jump around constantly. Öndin Abod is a technique allowing you to guarantee a chance at an attack, while also avoiding these incoming attacks.


The first thing to note is that even the most inexperienced fighter can make use of this technique. You don't need to know how to read your opponent extensively.


Choose your target as normal, but before confirming your attack, make sure you have selected multi-attack with [z]. Confirm your desired attack.


[A]ttack the enemy again, but this time, select Dodge. The direction you dodge in is entirely your choice - move in whatever direction you feel works best in the situation.


Lastly, act with [,] or [.].


As you can see, even though the opponent acted first and attacked, I was able to avoid his strike and land a hit of my own, whereas under normal circumstances, jumping away from that attack, either automatically or manually, would have required me to forfeit my chance at attacking. Öndin Abod works no matter how many attacks are aimed at you, and works just as well when armed as when unarmed.

...if someone's already said this one, sorry.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2016, 07:39:34 pm by leafbarrett »
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Quote
They can do whatever the heck they want. That's why they are nobles, cause they CAN.
King Henry the IV or something had a lot of wives, most of whom he executed. Because he could.
A ton of them mass-murdered Jews and Muslims. CAUSE THEY COULD.
A roman emperor made his horse a noble, cause he could.
And I modded them all out of existence, because I could.
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