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No

Only Judeism

Only Islam

Yes to both Judeism and Islam

[TD1]

Yes...because God supports both Protestant and Catholic faiths, despite their differences? Your outlook on God helping people seems a bit medieval, but it doesn't stop the fact that the crusades were never won. IF there is a God, by his own nature he would not side with one HUMAN over another, let alone one religion over another. He is all-loving. This includes people that are not of his Chosen.

Also, on a separate topic, why do you believe in God, but not Santa Claus? I lost my belief in both at around the same time, though was more hesitant to admit it with God, given the whole church thing and people taking it seriously.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

Yes...because God supports both Protestant and Catholic faiths, despite their differences? Your outlook on God helping people seems a bit medieval, but it doesn't stop the fact that the crusades were never won. IF there is a God, by his own nature he would not side with one HUMAN over another, let alone one religion over another. He is all-loving. This includes people that are not of his Chosen.

Also, on a separate topic, why do you believe in God, but not Santa Claus? I lost my belief in both at around the same time, though was more hesitant to admit it with God, given the whole church thing and people taking it seriously.

I'll have to find the verse but somewhere it says whomever has god in their hearts and is living for god that they will be protected by him
And that's what I was trying to say with god doesn't pick sides when it's Christian vs Christian
When it's Christian vs non-Christian and the Christians are trying to defend themselves I think god would side with the Christians
Now when Christians are fighting other peoe that's when this gets a bit iffy because I don't truely understand how that would work myself


As for why I believe in god and not Santa
For one they aren't even close to the same thing
Santa is a fat guy at the North Pole who gives gifted to good girls and boys
Not to mention he only does that for one religious group (or if your in some nations aparently atheist kids celebrate it too just for the gifts as I've been told by said atheist kids)

God is the creator of everything
Including you and me
Who anyone can believe in and ya know provides salvation to anyone who accepts that his son died for them and after that keeps them from hell (I see how people can think that is far fetched)
But here's why I still believe
The cities, the events, and even the people in the bible have been found to be real
They have found all sorts of stuff on it
Unlike other ancient/ extremely old texts (ancient being OT and just plain old being NT)

[timferius]

Yes...because God supports both Protestant and Catholic faiths, despite their differences? Your outlook on God helping people seems a bit medieval, but it doesn't stop the fact that the crusades were never won. IF there is a God, by his own nature he would not side with one HUMAN over another, let alone one religion over another. He is all-loving. This includes people that are not of his Chosen.

Also, on a separate topic, why do you believe in God, but not Santa Claus? I lost my belief in both at around the same time, though was more hesitant to admit it with God, given the whole church thing and people taking it seriously.

I'll have to find the verse but somewhere it says whomever has god in their hearts and is living for god that they will be protected by him
And that's what I was trying to say with god doesn't pick sides when it's Christian vs Christian
When it's Christian vs non-Christian and the Christians are trying to defend themselves I think god would side with the Christians
Now when Christians are fighting other peoe that's when this gets a bit iffy because I don't truely understand how that would work myself


As for why I believe in god and not Santa
For one they aren't even close to the same thing
Santa is a fat guy at the North Pole who gives gifted to good girls and boys
Not to mention he only does that for one religious group (or if your in some nations aparently atheist kids celebrate it too just for the gifts as I've been told by said atheist kids)

God is the creator of everything
Including you and me
Who anyone can believe in and ya know provides salvation to anyone who accepts that his son died for them and after that keeps them from hell (I see how people can think that is far fetched)
But here's why I still believe
The cities, the events, and even the people in the bible have been found to be real
They have found all sorts of stuff on it
Unlike other ancient/ extremely old texts (ancient being OT and just plain old being NT)

And this brings me back to my previous post. I could be the worlds most Awesome person (and I do try to be) I could help everyone I meet in need, donate tonnes of time/money to the needy, just be an all around amazing guy. But I reject the notion of a christian God, after much contemplation on my part. This is both a grievous sin in many branches of Christianity, and to that God says "lolnope, you're on your own".

What good, loving God says "I will love you and protect you my child, but all you have to do is believe some old books and a bunch of people with no evidence".
When the Catholic Church and other christian churches called my friends sinners because they were gay, my faith was shaken.
When the Catholic Church told my mother that after my dad left her that, sure, she could return to the church community, but first she'd have to pay a bunch of money and go through a long, painful process to get an annulment, my faith was shaken.

So I left the church. I've built my own concept of spirituality that makes sense to me. I refuse to believe in a God that both can, and refuses to help you. I refuse to believe in a God that abandons his children to persecution by HIS OWN church. I refuse to believe in a God that let's people to do terrible things in his name.

I'm sorry to rant, and you are absolutely entitled to your beliefs, and I applaud the fastidiousness in which you adhere to them. All I ask is you be a REAL good christian, that you follow in the good examples, you love unconditionally, you refrain from judging and condemning others. Too many Christians fail at this, and that's what shattered my faith.

I just can't believe in a God who let's his flock perform atrocities in his name, but still expects us to believe in him.


I almost deleted this several times because I have a weird anxiety about posting strong opinions on the internet. If it's offensive at all let me know and I'll remove it, though I think I come across respectfully?

Sorry...

[TD1]

I'll have to find the verse but somewhere it says whomever has god in their hearts and is living for god that they will be protected by him
And that's what I was trying to say with god doesn't pick sides when it's Christian vs Christian
When it's Christian vs non-Christian and the Christians are trying to defend themselves I think god would side with the Christians
Now when Christians are fighting other peoe that's when this gets a bit iffy because I don't truely understand how that would work myself

God does not take sides. It goes against his current attributes...to be transcendent, to be omnibenevolent. An omnibenevolent father does not help one son of his kill another simply based on which is his favoured son.
Of course, yes, the OT is rife with a vengeful, protecting God...the only thing to keep a persecuted people believing in him, I'd imagine, was that he would offer some form of protection, to their minds. But that does not mean he helps Christians, or ever did.

Just think of how many Christians died in the Crusades, and that accomplished next to nothing. An all loving father does not take sides, does not love one son over another, and does not kill one of his sons for, metaphorically speaking, giving his favoured a black eye.

As for the historic accuracy you have a text written in a time when those historic facts would be known. If, in 2000 years, a copy of Harry Potter was unearthed, would they think it true simply because it mentions London, and London is known to have existed?

"Santa is a fat guy at the North Pole who gives gifted to good girls and boys"
God is a bearded guy in the sky who gives eternal gifts to good Christian boys and girls.
"Not to mention he only does that for one religious group"
God only, according to you, only lets one religious group, Christians, into his personal paradise.

Santa is the maker of presents!
No evidence.
"God is the creator of everything
Including you and me."
No evidence.
"Who anyone can believe in"
Anyone can believe in Santa. Even those atheist kids.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

Yes...because God supports both Protestant and Catholic faiths, despite their differences? Your outlook on God helping people seems a bit medieval, but it doesn't stop the fact that the crusades were never won. IF there is a God, by his own nature he would not side with one HUMAN over another, let alone one religion over another. He is all-loving. This includes people that are not of his Chosen.

Also, on a separate topic, why do you believe in God, but not Santa Claus? I lost my belief in both at around the same time, though was more hesitant to admit it with God, given the whole church thing and people taking it seriously.

I'll have to find the verse but somewhere it says whomever has god in their hearts and is living for god that they will be protected by him
And that's what I was trying to say with god doesn't pick sides when it's Christian vs Christian
When it's Christian vs non-Christian and the Christians are trying to defend themselves I think god would side with the Christians
Now when Christians are fighting other peoe that's when this gets a bit iffy because I don't truely understand how that would work myself


As for why I believe in god and not Santa
For one they aren't even close to the same thing
Santa is a fat guy at the North Pole who gives gifted to good girls and boys
Not to mention he only does that for one religious group (or if your in some nations aparently atheist kids celebrate it too just for the gifts as I've been told by said atheist kids)

God is the creator of everything
Including you and me
Who anyone can believe in and ya know provides salvation to anyone who accepts that his son died for them and after that keeps them from hell (I see how people can think that is far fetched)
But here's why I still believe
The cities, the events, and even the people in the bible have been found to be real
They have found all sorts of stuff on it
Unlike other ancient/ extremely old texts (ancient being OT and just plain old being NT)

And this brings me back to my previous post. I could be the worlds most Awesome person (and I do try to be) I could help everyone I meet in need, donate tonnes of time/money to the needy, just be an all around amazing guy. But I reject the notion of a christian God, after much contemplation on my part. This is both a grievous sin in many branches of Christianity, and to that God says "lolnope, you're on your own".

What good, loving God says "I will love you and protect you my child, but all you have to do is believe some old books and a bunch of people with no evidence".
When the Catholic Church and other christian churches called my friends sinners because they were gay, my faith was shaken.
When the Catholic Church told my mother that after my dad left her that, sure, she could return to the church community, but first she'd have to pay a bunch of money and go through a long, painful process to get an annulment, my faith was shaken.

So I left the church. I've built my own concept of spirituality that makes sense to me. I refuse to believe in a God that both can, and refuses to help you. I refuse to believe in a God that abandons his children to persecution by HIS OWN church. I refuse to believe in a God that let's people to do terrible things in his name.

I'm sorry to rant, and you are absolutely entitled to your beliefs, and I applaud the fastidiousness in which you adhere to them. All I ask is you be a REAL good christian, that you follow in the good examples, you love unconditionally, you refrain from judging and condemning others. Too many Christians fail at this, and that's what shattered my faith.

I just can't believe in a God who let's his flock perform atrocities in his name, but still expects us to believe in him.


I almost deleted this several times because I have a weird anxiety about posting strong opinions on the internet. If it's offensive at all let me know and I'll remove it, though I think I come across respectfully?

Sorry...

Don't be sorry
that sounds tragic


I... I really didn't know that a church would do that.
Mine wouldn't have even come close to doing something like that
then again its not catholic and i don't know much about Catholics

I'm sorry to hear that that happened to you

I'll have to find the verse but somewhere it says whomever has god in their hearts and is living for god that they will be protected by him
And that's what I was trying to say with god doesn't pick sides when it's Christian vs Christian
When it's Christian vs non-Christian and the Christians are trying to defend themselves I think god would side with the Christians
Now when Christians are fighting other peoe that's when this gets a bit iffy because I don't truely understand how that would work myself

God does not take sides. It goes against his current attributes...to be transcendent, to be omnibenevolent. An omnibenevolent father does not help one son of his kill another simply based on which is his favoured son.
Of course, yes, the OT is rife with a vengeful, protecting God...the only thing to keep a persecuted people believing in him, I'd imagine, was that he would offer some form of protection, to their minds. But that does not mean he helps Christians, or ever did.

Just think of how many Christians died in the Crusades, and that accomplished next to nothing. An all loving father does not take sides, does not love one son over another, and does not kill one of his sons for, metaphorically speaking, giving his favoured a black eye.

As for the historic accuracy you have a text written in a time when those historic facts would be known. If, in 2000 years, a copy of Harry Potter was unearthed, would they think it true simply because it mentions London, and London is known to have existed?

"Santa is a fat guy at the North Pole who gives gifted to good girls and boys"
God is a bearded guy in the sky who gives eternal gifts to good Christian boys and girls.
"Not to mention he only does that for one religious group"
God only, according to you, only lets one religious group, Christians, into his personal paradise.

Santa is the maker of presents!
No evidence.
"God is the creator of everything
Including you and me."
No evidence.
"Who anyone can believe in"
Anyone can believe in Santa. Even those atheist kids.

The crusaids have nothing to do with what i said

I said if the christians are defending themselves
not if they were out massacring other people for money 




As for the harry potter thing

The bible mentions more than just cities, it mentions people who did exist, and it mentions events that really happened

And you're right, there is no evidence that god exists
but he's not a physical being of this world
santa on the other hand is

You can go to the north pole and see that
want proof god does or doesn't you'll have to die and see

[timferius]

I do realize most of my issues are predominantly a Catholic thing. But yes, after a divorce you're free to come to church, but until you get an official annulment from the Vatican you can't partake of the Eucharist or any similar ceremonies, it's a bit alienating. And annulments are a long process that cost money.
And I do acknowledge and appreciate that there are many branches of Christianity that are more accepting of people of other sexual orientations etc.
It just shatters ones faith when you see all this pulled off by an institution you trusted.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

I do realize most of my issues are predominantly a Catholic thing. But yes, after a divorce you're free to come to church, but until you get an official annulment from the Vatican you can't partake of the Eucharist or any similar ceremonies, it's a bit alienating. And annulments are a long process that cost money.
And I do acknowledge and appreciate that there are many branches of Christianity that are more accepting of people of other sexual orientations etc.
It just shatters ones faith when you see all this pulled off by an institution you trusted.

I will also comment on the persecuting homosexuals
My church treats people as an, ¨Everybody is human¨ thing so they don't persecute one group of sinners anymore than another

If anything we just try to explain to them why we think its wrong but its not like we are going to keep them out of church as long as they aren't being disrespectful
and that goes for just about any sinner

[TD1]

It is out of respect for religion that I would say homosexuals should not become ministers or the like, but in what universe is homosexuality a sin? Sure, the bible speaks against it, but it also speaks against many things that you simply ignore nowadays.

As for protecting defending Christians...

This 1909 massacre of Armenian Christians by Ottoman Turks in the city of Adana amidst governmental upheaval resulted in a series of anti-Armenian mob violence throughout the district. Reports estimated that the massacres in Adana Province resulted in 15,000 to 30,000 deaths.

Edit: As for Santa being physical, and God not, people used to believe God literally was "up there" in the clouds/space. Space exploration rendered this view obsolete, as we did not find God.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

we already had a several page discussion on homosexuality



and god is not physical and simply going to space didn't prove anything seeing as space is infinitly massive. not saying i believe he is in space though

[TD1]

Huh, reading up on it, apparently it's thought to be a slumber and then awakening, not a trip to heaven after death. As Wikipedia says:

According to some views, some Christians in the 1st century believed that the Kingdom of God was coming to earth within their own lifetimes.[3] They looked forward to a divine future on earth.[3] When the Kingdom of God did not arrive, according to this hypothesis, championed by Bart Ehrman (2006), Christians gradually refined their hopes so that they came to look forward to an immediate reward in heaven after death, rather than to a future divine kingdom on earth[3]—despite the churches' continuing to use the major creeds' statements of belief in a coming Resurrection Day and World to Come.

As for God not being physical, what exactly was Jesus then? Obviously he has the power to become physical at will.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

Huh, reading up on it, apparently it's thought to be a slumber and then awakening, not a trip to heaven after death. As Wikipedia says:

According to some views, some Christians in the 1st century believed that the Kingdom of God was coming to earth within their own lifetimes.[3] They looked forward to a divine future on earth.[3] When the Kingdom of God did not arrive, according to this hypothesis, championed by Bart Ehrman (2006), Christians gradually refined their hopes so that they came to look forward to an immediate reward in heaven after death, rather than to a future divine kingdom on earth[3]—despite the churches' continuing to use the major creeds' statements of belief in a coming Resurrection Day and World to Come.

As for God not being physical, what exactly was Jesus then? Obviously he has the power to become physical at will.

oh i thought we were talking about god the father not god the son

jesus was physical up until his ¨death¨ when he rose from the grave and his body just kinda disappeared

[Frumple]

... so what's up with the Sabbath? I think I've seen at least three different interpretations of which ruddy day it's on, so anyone have a rundown as to what's going on there? Wikipedia page is actually oddly unilluminating.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

The sabbath is the day of rest kinda thing
in short it symbolizes the 7th day of creation when god rested
your supposed to not work and rest for the sabbath and keep the day holy

thats about as in-depth i can get on that one

[TD1]

oh i thought we were talking about god the father not god the son

So now there's two Gods? I thought the whole (rather strange) logic behind it was that they were the same God. No distinction really needed.

[Frumple]

The sabbath is the day of rest kinda thing [snip]

Yeah, I'm aware of what it is. The question's coming from the direction of inquiring into why people seem to be having so much trouble coming to a consensus on when it is. You'd... think it would be a fairly straightforward thing?