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Should other religions be added to this thread?

No
Only Judeism
Only Islam
Yes to both Judeism and Islam

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Author Topic: Christian beliefs and discussion  (Read 194608 times)

Lord Shonus

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1110 on: October 10, 2014, 09:34:47 am »

There's inconsistencies I'm not sure how translation errors would explain. Hell, genesis 1 and genesis 2 have different orders for the order of creation, and the second outright contradicts the first by separating the creation of man and woman, which were created together in gen 1.


While technically not a "translation" error, that's quite readily explained. There are two accounts that the scholars that compiled the text could not resolve, nor could they definitively declare one or the other to be older. So they included both.
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penguinofhonor

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1111 on: October 10, 2014, 09:42:21 am »

But that means there was human interpretation involved in putting together the Bible.
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timferius

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1112 on: October 10, 2014, 09:44:57 am »

While yes, there was human interpretation involved in writing it too. I believe there's a precedent of divine guidance for these situations. Which is also why Catholics hold the Catechism and the Popes word as Canon as well.
From my experience, honestly, most people take anything they want as law as literal truth, and anything that looks bad or doesn't agree with them is contextual/figurative.
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TD1

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1113 on: October 10, 2014, 10:46:13 am »

...

To be fair, the story doesn't make much sense anyway.

Just like the Bible! :P
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Phmcw

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1114 on: October 10, 2014, 11:10:37 am »

I never understood those "translation" excuses. If you think that you have the word of god written in front of you, learn the damn language. Latin isn't that difficult, and neither is ancien greek.

But don't hold your hopes too high : 100 year ago, any scientist in Europe spoke a decent latin, and they still found contradictions. 
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Helgoland

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1115 on: October 10, 2014, 11:40:31 am »

Latin isn't that difficult, and neither is ancien greek.
Fun fact: You'd only need Latin for the vulgata, which is the canonical _translation_ of the bible. The original was written in Hebrew (OT) and Greek (NT).
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Graknorke

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1116 on: October 10, 2014, 11:55:55 am »

Latin isn't that difficult, and neither is ancien greek.
Fun fact: You'd only need Latin for the vulgata, which is the canonical _translation_ of the bible. The original was written in Hebrew (OT) and Greek (NT).
I was going to say something to that effect.
Though despite not being a linguist, I would feel reasonably confidant in stating that the translations are accurate enough that any significant problems are going to be because of content rather than translation. I mean, there being  some 700000 other words (I think it's something around there anyway) to contextualise it with, I don't think a single stray word is going to be anything catastrophic. Unless you consider disagreement as to what the number of the beast is to be 'catastrophic'.
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Lord Shonus

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1117 on: October 10, 2014, 01:37:45 pm »

No, the differences between things like "witch" and "poisoner", "homosexual" and "coward", "kill" and "murder" are incredibly significant. That's just word choice. Going from the Greek and Hebrew to english can mangle entire sentences to mean something else, and that's before you get into paraphrases that tell you what the passage "really" means.
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scrdest

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1118 on: October 10, 2014, 03:18:26 pm »

Latin isn't that difficult, and neither is ancien greek.
Fun fact: You'd only need Latin for the vulgata, which is the canonical _translation_ of the bible. The original was written in Hebrew (OT) and Greek (NT).

And Aramaic.
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Orange Wizard

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1119 on: October 10, 2014, 03:46:34 pm »

This, dredged up by something like two seconds of google searching, provides a fairly interesting list involving various degrees of contradiction. Some could be explained by translation error (and some aren't so much biblical self-contradiction so much as contradiction between the bible and reality), but others... less so.
A lot of those aren't really contradictions in the first place.
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Frumple

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1120 on: October 10, 2014, 03:55:16 pm »

... which I mentioned, yes.
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Orange Wizard

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1121 on: October 10, 2014, 04:10:36 pm »

... you did, in fact. I've been really bad at reading things lately.
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Graknorke

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1122 on: October 10, 2014, 04:34:07 pm »

No, the differences between things like "witch" and "poisoner", "homosexual" and "coward", "kill" and "murder" are incredibly significant. That's just word choice. Going from the Greek and Hebrew to english can mangle entire sentences to mean something else, and that's before you get into paraphrases that tell you what the passage "really" means.
Sorry, I made the assumption that differences in translation would be reasonably close (As with "murder" and "kill") rather than having at best tangential similarities.
I suppose I can't really disagree with the 'if it really bothers you learn Greek' sentiment then.
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tahujdt

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1123 on: October 10, 2014, 05:41:06 pm »

My dad actually learned ancient Greek specifically for that purpose.
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freeformschooler

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1124 on: October 10, 2014, 07:36:28 pm »

My dad actually learned ancient Greek specifically for that purpose.

Wow. That's pretty impressive. Props to your dad.
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