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[Vector]

Two options.

a. Stereotyping and discrimination based on gender

b. Institutionally backed, oppressive stereotyping and discrimination based on gender

The "men cannot receive sexism" school is type b., which is said mostly in order to allay arguments that men and women are undergoing things with the same impact.  See unfair hiring practices, etc., blah blah blah.

[misko27]

There are going to be less women in the military.

WRONG SIR! One does not have "less" women, you have fewer! Haha! You must now concede your grammatical argument, and give to me your first born child!

[pisskop]

I thought it had to do with O-rings and waistlines.

[Scoops Novel]

Well, to kick this off, i was hoping Vector could go into more details about tensions, as well as how and how common it is to react adversely to the baseline gender roles, and why they do or do not take action or alternately twig on.

[Andrew425]

I for one have never understood how people can jump from averages to individuals so readily.

If 75% of one group was bad at something  I would not assume that an individual was bad at it until I asked them. Especially at an institute for that something.

[pisskop]

I always thought it was about brain organization.  We apparently form all of our decisions on is/isnot categories.  I read something somewhere that all thought distinguishing between is/is not and began in such a tribalistic manner.

And that's how I've always seen stereotypes.

[Max White]

So... Any chance of a new decent sonic NO! AND THERE NEVER WILL BE!
Anyway.

Two options.

a. Stereotyping and discrimination based on gender

b. Institutionally backed, oppressive stereotyping and discrimination based on gender

Could you elaborate on this a little? These two things seem very intertwined. Are they meant to be treated as two distinct categories or two possible causes?

[Vector]

No, they're two different definitions of sexism.  Under the latter definition, men do not suffer from sexism (much like that saying that you can't be racist towards white people).  Under the former, we take all forms of stereotyping and unfair generalization as sexism.  Really, they're different tools for different discussions.  One should be used to talk about a level of, well, horribleness that uniquely affects women (you know, the "this is not a 'what about the men' conversation").  The other one is for when you're talking about the effects of stereotyping as a whole.

[Max White]

Well when you look at the abysmal rates that fathers get any sort of child custody in a divorce, that would qualify as type b against men, wouldn't it?

[Tellemurius]

Well when you look at the abysmal rates that fathers get any sort of child custody in a divorce, that would qualify as type b against men, wouldn't it?

that is a yes, family judicial system puts the mother ahead of the father for custody. Ignoring the facts that the father could provide a better lifestyle for child but no you can't tear children away from their mothers thats horrid

Chances aren't slim but its a long and costly court battle.

[Vector]

Men who actually apply for custody get it 50% of the time (citation; you can follow their citations if you're so inclined).

I have a really hard time seeing that as discrimination.

that is a yes, family judicial system puts the mother ahead of the father for custody. Ignoring the facts that the father could provide a better lifestyle for child but no you can't tear children away from their mothers thats horrid

Courts usually place children with the primary caregiver.

[Dutchling]

I feel like people are talking about numbers and statistics without backing any of those claims up.
This is general discussion, not fanfiction, just sayin'.

PTW.

[Tellemurius]

Men who actually apply for custody get it 50% of the time.

I have a really hard time seeing that as discrimination.

that is a yes, family judicial system puts the mother ahead of the father for custody. Ignoring the facts that the father could provide a better lifestyle for child but no you can't tear children away from their mothers thats horrid

Courts usually place children with the primary caregiver.

That really depends on the state though, i know here the mother still gets precedence over fathers (even after there was like three laws to put in to change that). For Colorado it was even a big issue too (one of us here actually was in that trouble) and there has to be changes in the system.

[Vector]

Yeah, I added the citation.

Part of my problem is that I absorb a lot of information and then forget where I found it.  Usually the sources are good, but it takes a while to get them.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Posting to watch sexist thread

I thought you said sexiest.

I'm still of the opinion of egalitarianism being extended to every aspect of society, but we need to remove gender role enforcement. Breaking the glass ceiling, and such.