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[Tuck_Lion]

correctly the subculture is because our own culture are very interested in animals and anthropomorphic animals.

Children Cartoons are absolutely full of them to the extent where they often outnumber ones that use actual humans.

Related, it's interesting to note that shows like Family Guy can routinely and blatantly depict bestiality, but most people won't interpret it as such because it's animated. Brian (the dog) can have clearly sexual relationships with human girls, but it doesn't generally even occur to people to think of it as unusual.

Are you talking about the people in the show, or in real life? Because I always found it pretty weird.

I'm pretty sure we mean in the show

[Solifuge]

In a run of weird coincidence, my last two roommates have been Furries. One of them even did character illustrations for the fandom; an aspiring children's illustrator, known for doing a webcomic adaptation of Bram Stoker's Dracula, with anthropomorphic animal characters. Despite not being part of the fandom, I tagged along with him to a few furry conventions to help him do business. Apparently he's a reasonably well-known artist in the fandom too, since he was the guest of honor, and ran a few panels on illustration, his experiences being FTM-transgendered, and a few other things.

Spoiler: Solifuge's Adventures in FurryLand (click to show/hide)

In my experience, as an outsider who's been on the inside of the fandom, it's mostly about nerdy people who like cartoon animals, getting together and doing nerdy things. Though the fetish element exists, it's really overplayed; it wasn't any different than an Anime convention, with an equal amount of comics, crafted goods, strange and impressive costumes (I saw a few full-body puppets that would have made Jim Henson proud), and a mix of people both awkward and awesome. The costumes were probably the weirdest thing for me, but a large part of my feelings probably came from the fetish-type stuff you hear about around the internet. In reality, they were no different than mascot costumes, and few people were wearing them; most just sported colorful cat-ear hairbands, or fox tails linked to the back of their belts, or whatever.

On my off time, I played a bunch of games of 20+ Player Werewolf-themed Mafia in the game room, as well as a number of other card and boardgames. I browsed the artists alley, and though there were marked binders of animal-people smut, there were significantly more illustrations, paintings, and comics that were completely clean (again, not much different than an Anime Con). I attended a panel featuring a fellow who called himself Uncle Kage; apparently a PhD'd organic chemist from Darmouth. He did a panel where he shared stories of traveling the world and getting into hijinks, such as his experiences in Amsterdam where a meeting with an academic peer, and a date with a potential romantic interest of his, got crossed, and hilarity ensued. Great storyteller, and a really fun and nerdy guy.

At one point, a reporter from the local news tried to infiltrate the convention, to make a story out of it. She came in with a hidden camera, and a penguin ballcap as her disguise, and seemed to be trying and failing to make the con-goers out to be crazy deviants. Pretty sure she left disappointed.

On our way home from the Con, my roommate surprised me with a Dashing Steampunk Pine Martin-dude, done in Art Nouveau style, in appreciation for helping him. Basically, several of my favorite things, all in the same place. It's still one of my favorite presents I've gotten from a friend:



SO DASHING! AND VICTORIAN-ERA-COAT-HAVING!

[Tuck_Lion]

Loved your story, Solifuge! I really I wish I had the opportunity to go to a con.

[Sirus]

Loved your story, Solifuge!

Same here. An interesting look into a sub-culture I know very little about

[Neonivek]

Stupid people who have more artistic talent then me! ILL SHOW YOU ALL!

[LordBucket]

Brian is human in intellect and therefor it would not be beastiality.

That's debatable. But it's something humanity is likely to need to deal with sooner or later.

What exactly is an "animal?"

 * If 5% donkey DNA were added to a human, would sex with the result be bestiality?
 * if 5% human DNA were added to a donkey, would sex with the result be bestiality?
 * If we someday bridge the language barrier, and can have casual conversations with dolphins, will sex with dolphins be bestiality?
 * If aliens with vastly superior intellect show up and we have sex with it, would they be committing bestiality?
 * If you seed a dog's brain with exclusively human brain cells to create an intelligent chimera, would sex with it be bestiality?
 * If you seed a human's brain with exclusively dog brain cells to create an unintelligent chimera, would sex with it be bestiality?
 * What about chimpanzees that have learned sign language? Is sex with them bestiality?

No matter whether you look at intellect, or genetics, or even obvious outward appearance...there's a lot of potential gray zone. For that matter, if "intelligence" is your basis for evaluation, is sex with a stupid, but purely "human" partner bestiality? I think most people would say of course not...but I just don't see any way to draw a fine line that technology we either already have or will have very soon won't make a mockery of. We're already making hybrids. It's not going to take long before somebody gets creative with it.

Are you talking about the people in the show, or in real life? Because I always found it pretty weird.

I was thinking real life. You're the first person I've spoken to about it to say it occurred to them to think it was weird before I pointed it out.

[Tuck_Lion]

Um, in my experience with zoophile friends, beastiality specifically refers to attraction to animal-minded animals and close variants. DNA has little to do with it as it is a psychological anomaly and is determined based on physical appearance and behavioral accuracy.

I understand the conversation you're trying to start, though.

[Sirus]

Are you talking about the people in the show, or in real life? Because I always found it pretty weird.

I was thinking real life. You're the first person I've spoken to about it to say it occurred to them to think it was weird before I pointed it out.

What, seriously? Maybe I only thought about it because I don't like the show and look for ways to criticize it

Re Beastiality: I tried to look up an official definition, but Wikipedia had several images of what looked like ye olde tyme hentai. That made me close the tab pretty quickly, and suddenly I'm very glad I use AdBlock >_>
And that's all I'll say on that topic.

[Willfor]

* If 5% donkey DNA were added to a human, would sex with the result be bestiality?
 * if 5% human DNA were added to a donkey, would sex with the result be bestiality?

Is it bad when my first thoughts here are "DNA doesn't work that way"? We share a goodly amount of DNA with our fellow mammalian species and beyond, and it's more the lack of it being triggered during our growth stages that keep us as humans.

To be honest, lack of ability to consciously consent is the problem.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

We share 15% or so DNA with yeast. All Earth life is genetically connected, and DNA definitely doesn't work like that.

[Tuck_Lion]

His analogy was a hyperbolic exaggeration. No need to take him literally.

[Loud Whispers]

We share 15% or so DNA with yeast. All Earth life is genetically connected, and DNA definitely doesn't work like that.

I am bread

[Sirus]

I'm clearly sourdough. I get more and more sour as I grow older

[alway]

To be honest, lack of ability to consciously consent is the problem.

I've actually heard an argument on a philosophy podcast regarding this. It went along the lines of:

'You can't argue consent is an issue so long as we are simultaneously using them for foodstuffs. Based on current social attitudes, norms, and laws towards treatment of animals, the line is drawn not at consent, but rather at unnecessary discomfort'

[Scelly9]

To be honest, lack of ability to consciously consent is the problem.

I've actually heard an argument on a philosophy podcast regarding this. It went along the lines of:

'You can't argue consent is an issue so long as we are simultaneously using them for foodstuffs. Based on current social attitudes, norms, and laws towards treatment of animals, the line is drawn not at consent, but rather at unnecessary discomfort'

That's actually a really good point. Huh.