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[Kot]

you guys live on Ukrainian propaganda, truly

The difference is that our right-wing doesn't exactly have guns.

I wonder what they're using as a claim

The Operation Vistula. Also, while I don't belive that Right Sector witll actually do it, but it's quite weird, considering they told it to face of Polish television when it was in Lviv (of course I don't understand Ukrainian mixed with Polish translator voice, so there's a chance that Soviet propaganda changed their words).

It would be funny if they blew up the parliament on November 5th.

You know, funny in a horribly, world-shatteringly terrifying way.

It wouldn't be the first time people considered Anonymous to be terrorists, or even ISIS.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Right Sector is... Right Sector. Much changed from Maidan times. It is fragmented, it has some weird and suspicious personalities inside. And frontline Right Sector and behind the lines Right Sector look so different.

Anyway radicals can be handled. They don't have major military or political power and losing prestige real fast. 

The difference is that our right-wing doesn't exactly have guns.

Believe me or not but they have it. I know that there are some Poles fighting for both sides of Donbass war.

I find it rather surreal that Polish nationalists fight alongside with Russians...
On other side it is no less surreal to hear "Glory to Ukraine, Glory to Heroes" with Polish accent but I heared it with my own ears.

[Kot]

Right Sector is... Right Sector. Much changed from Maidan times. It is fragmented, it has some weird and suspicious personalities inside. And frontline Right Sector and behind the lines Right Sector look so different.

Possibly. You proably know better since you're Ukrainian, or at least hopefully more than about history, but the fraction I'm thinking about is based in Lviv, they had armed checkpoints around the city, and apparently got in few firefights with local authorities, don't exactly remember the details. Also, apparently, their commander said they want to "form an coalition with Poland against Russia", contrary to what was said before, so that proably pictures what's happening there really.

Believe me or not but they have it. I know that there are some Poles fighting for both sides of Donbass war.

You took me wrong. I meant that Polish inside Poland don't have weapons, the Ukraine is a whole different story, as everyone (as in, Polish, Ukrainians, Russians, Americans, Germans, etc.) fights for everyone there, but AFAIK, there is no organized POLISH armed group which wants to capture Lwów.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

there is no organized POLISH armed group which wants to capture Lwów.

There are no organized Ukrainian armed groups which want to capture some Polish city. Personal opinions of some radical members of Right Sector (even if they are leaders of regional organization) don't qualify. 

After all Western Ukrainians tend to have more anti-Polish views then weighted average. Unlike natinalist organizations of the past, Right Sector is not Western Ukrainians dominated.

As for armed checkpoints. It was a big bluff. Right sector wants to show that it is big and scary for politics stuff. I know how journalists like to exagerrate and I can only imagine that it had some impact in Polish media.

Right sector has its problems including, but if you think that some Russian Speaking Donetsk resident member of Right Sector has any desire to get a chunck of Poland - You are very wrong.

Huge portion of Right Sector's fighers don't  care  about political agenda of the political wing. Political wing that uses deaths of volunteers to get political capital... I can't express how disgusted I am by their PR on blood. That and constant descriditing of Ukrainian Army.

[Loud Whispers]

by the bye, have you guys heard that ISIS is going to assassinate the Queen on vj-day, it was on daily mail so it must be true
i'll bet LW is brushing his beret and greasing his STEN right now...
EDIT: Why nobody vote A? Is better than A.

Sometime in the past, a crazy Shiite sitting in a mountain Fortress is laughing at these fools from the future.

Thinking about it more, the Hashashin do seem like they've jumped out of Dorf Fortress.

• Completely bonkers
• Martial trances
• Nobles don't really make sense
• Setting up Fortress inside the enemy's lands
• Fortresses
• Everyone killed by Fun sieges
• Fortresses

At any rate the Queen's more likely to be killed by American friendly fire than ISIS so there's that

[scenegg]

I am Greek and feta rocks. Do not remove.

[Kot]

At any rate the Queen's more likely to be killed by American friendly fire than ISIS so there's that

Queen is more likely to melt under hot British sun (what), considering they replaced her with an wax figure long ago.

As for armed checkpoints. It was a big bluff. Right sector wants to show that it is big and scary for politics stuff. I know how journalists like to exagerrate and I can only imagine that it had some impact in Polish media.

Well, they set up at least one for a while to show Polish how srs bsns they are. There's not much impact yet, as this is pretty fresh news and they agreed to talk with only one group of journalists from Polsat.

Right sector has its problems including, but if you think that some Russian Speaking Donetsk resident member of Right Sector has any desire to get a chunck of Poland - You are very wrong.

Donetsk? No, as I said the whole thing was happening in Lviv. They were told that repeatedly and apparently were handed an "official" paper which described that "after they deal with Russia" they want to get back "Ukrainian land", presumably by force. You're right though, I can't really think there could be an organization that wants to at least help retaining the independence and yet make thinly veiled threats at journalists from the country that pretty much is supporting them in their fight and a part of NATO, so those who organized this "show of force" proably had no idea what they were doing, or actually wanted to put shit on Ukrainians, so there's that. Also despite what Ukrainian Army says, Ukraine has no chance to actually fight off Russia on it's own if it came to that, even you have to admit it.

By the way, this stuff apparently caused Polish right wing Falanga oraganization to gear up with some tacticool equipment and real guns that don't even shoot (as in, old gutted AKs or something) to patrol the border. They're apparently conviced that there is Right Sector armed group on our ground, doing some shady stuff, but after they faked images of Ukrainian helicopters attacking some forest and that the Russians reported it (including an opinion from "Polish expert" who apparently said the threat is serious, but the guy is known for being very pro-Russia) in their TV before those patrols even began to work, nobody really belives them. They proably just want to run around looking like soldiers and wave some Isis looking flags around.

[mainiac]

I am Greek and feta rocks. Do not remove.

I am American and I am going to remove your feta and eat it to add fat to my body.  Muwahahahahaha.

[Loud Whispers]

This guy is the national hero of Uzbekistan and was a renowned figure throughout much of Europe for a while. He slaughtered 17 million people. He built towers out of the skulls of the villages that he slaughtered in order to intimidate others. He also was a patron of the arts and would move all artisans and engineers from captured cities to his capital in Samurkand in order to work there, causing the city to flourish. He is the direct reason for the formation of the Mughul Empire by his descendants, and Persia from lands ravaged by him only years earlier.

See? There's someone who killed 100x more people and is also regarded as a hero.

Eh, I know that stuff like that exists, after all Stalin is still considered a saint in parts of Russia. Also, as you even mentioned, Timur seems to had some good sides for his country after all, while Bandera hardly did anything else than causing a genocide.

All this stuff about a bloo blooing over national heroes who genocided everyone have forgotten one thing. Genghis "I am WWII in human form" Khan. He is a legend amongst men, a national hero of Mongolia and many more. He is singlehandedly responsible for more deaths than any other man in all of human history and altered the course of history forever by spreading explosions, plague, fire and salt to everywhere from Europe to Arabia to China. So prolific was his conquering of the world that 1 in 200 people descend from Genghis Khan specifically. This man is a legendary hero, whose greatest achievement in life was to be the first man to build mountains of skulls. Long after he died Arabian and European explorers would still find hills capped in snow that turned out to just be skulls from his conquests.
Can you imagine people criticizing Achilles the Man Killer for being a hero by virtue of being good at killing people? They are national heroes because the conquered and did so well. Lest we forget Bulgarians and Romanians still hold their Vlad the Impaler as a hero; time makes legends of the victorious men considered monsters in their time for being victors. I feel people are missing the point when they point out a national hero is a hero in spite of killing so many when they are a hero because the conquered so many. Alexander is not remembered foremost for his cultural contributions to humanity.

I am Greek and feta rocks. Do not remove.

You are all Macedonian clay, give back to Alexander

[mainiac]

I dont understand what someone who murdered people to loot their corpes, a character out of a myth and someone who used widescale murder as a means of averting genocide have in common besides killing people.

[Loud Whispers]

I dont understand what someone who murdered people to loot their corpes, a character out of a myth and someone who used widescale murder as a means of averting genocide have in common besides killing people.

That is the point though, they are all people who were good at killing people

[WealthyRadish]

i'll bet LW is brushing his beret and greasing his STEN right now...

Sigged for greasy stens. Curve is coming along nicely.

[Kot]

stuff

Ghenghis pretty much singlehandely created an empire, he was for example pretty damn good at management and stuff. Also, all things considered, all of figures you mentioned fought, killed or even slaughtered their enemies. Even damn Hitler brought the Germany into a pretty good state before WWII and you could find a bunch of good things he did, even if they're outweighted by Holocaust and war, not to mention that's a tabu. And Bandera? Basically all Bandera did was to cause a slaughter of Polishm which country didin't even exist at the time, and were by no means enemies of Ukraine. Hell, you could think they would work together against Germans and Soviets, but no, that would be hard, slaughtering civilians you can blame for everything is easier.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I don't know what these implications about the Queen are, it's common knowledge by this point that Elizabeth II of Winsdor (or Lizzy The Rock to her friends) is a 5th Generation Ventrue.

[smjjames]

I don't know what these implications about the Queen are, it's common knowledge by this point that Elizabeth II of Winsdor (or Lizzy The Rock to her friends) is a 5th Generation Ventrue.

What is Ventrue?