Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

A

A

A

A

A

A

A

A

[GreatJustice]

Working class didn't use cars to get to work. They used public transit system to get to work. You know, like buses, trams, and the like.

Are you an American? Because it's a really American thing to ignore the existence of public transit systems.

Depends on where you live. Public transit didn't exist in a lot of places, and in those cases you would generally need a car. Though perhaps I overstated how many people were lucky enough to even have their own crappy Lada, so you can replace that with "ride the crappy, East-German built tram to work". Not American, by the way.

[LordSlowpoke]

OI

don't talk shit bout east german trams

[Guardian G.I.]

OI

don't talk shit bout east german trams

If you are talking about Tatra trams, they are from Czechoslovakia.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Working class didn't use cars to get to work. They used public transit system to get to work. You know, like buses, trams, and the like.

Are you an American? Because it's a really American thing to ignore the existence of public transit systems.

You see, normal countries have both good public transit and non-shity cars available for working class. Model T and New-York Metro appeared when Russians used horses

[Guardian G.I.]

The first electric tram system in the Russian Empire opened in 1898 in Vitebsk, although if Wikipedia is to be believed, an experimental line was build in Sestroretsk near Saint Petersburg in 1880. It also happened to be the first in the world.

[Sergarr]

Again: It happened in the ending days of Russian Empire, where 90% of population were forever locked in a class of "serfs" and part of them were even worse, forced to work at factories in a country with no anti-capitalistic forces in play.

Consider that, and then consider the fact that in 30-35 years after that, the Russia became one of only two world's superpowers and were the first country to launch a satellite into space. The first!

[Owlbread]

One Scottish Socialist Party policy is that we should have a completely free-at-point-of-use public transporation system. That includes every bus, train, ferry etc from Coldstream to Lerwick. I think taking the ferries in the Western Isles into public ownership would be a good start - it's ridiculous that islanders should have to pay as much as they do just to get from A to B.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

if Wikipedia is to be believed, an experimental line was build in Sestroretsk near Saint Petersburg in 1880

Yep, I know that world's first Electric tram was invented by a Ukrainian, born close to my home city.
His system was used by Siemens later

Oh, and first regular Tram in Russian Empire was in Kiev 1892, while Siemens used Pirotsky's idea to launch first commercial line in Germany in 1881

In fact it demonstrates how ineffective Russian business model was is. 12 years passed from experimental to practical use, Germans needed one year

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Again: It happened in the ending days of Russian Empire, where 90% of population were forever locked in a class of "serfs" and part of them were even worse, forced to work at factories in a country with no anti-capitalistic forces in play.

Consider that, and then consider the fact that in 30-35 years after that, the Russia became one of only two world's superpowers and were the first country to launch a satellite into space. The first!

Yep. Russia was first to launch satellite (thank another Ukrainian, Korolyov) so what? It was never used in a proper way, It had  close to zero commercial use, unlike Western countries that used it for wellbeing of its citizens (and profit, but that is how market economy works)

[Owlbread]

The USSR may have been the first to launch a satellite, but as Ukrainian Ranger correctly judged it's only really good for dick waving nationalism. The USSR could have spent some of that money on improving living standards in a few of the many oblasts and Republics that had people living in medieval conditions. Tajikistan is an example.

[LordSlowpoke]

if Wikipedia is to be believed, an experimental line was build in Sestroretsk near Saint Petersburg in 1880

Yep, I know that world's first Electric tram was invented by a Ukrainian, born close to my home city.
His system was used by Siemens later

Oh, and first regular Tram in Russian Empire was in Kiev 1892, while Siemens used Pirotsky's idea to launch first commercial line in Germany in 1881

In fact it demonstrates how ineffective Russian business model was is. 12 years passed from experimental to practical use, Germans needed one year

yes

it was only the cause of the russian empire being this bad at this

ur your knowledge of history is straight up embarrassing i don't even know where to begin with you

sure the empire was mismanaged as fuck but it's not like western europe was all enlightenment and geniuses

okay, scratch that. i do have an idea. you know how people in eastern europe were serfs? wanna know why that was really popular? because eastern europe sold wheat. fucktonnes of it. pretty much the main product.

who bought the wheat? western europe. what did they pay with? manufactured goods.

go from there

[Ukrainian Ranger]

LordSlowpoke, your post is confusing me... I can't understand WTF you mean

[Sergarr]

I guess he means that Eastern Europe was basically economically enslaved by Western Europe to produce raw materials for their economy.

EDIT: Although I would not agree with that part very much, at least in Russian case it was the Russian aristocracy physically enslaving 90% of Russian populace. And after the Nikolai II has shot a multi-thousand peace procession, the people of Russia has seen that they cannot rely on a tzar to protect them from corrupt aristocracy. Thus, the Great October Socialistic Revolution.

The USSR may have been the first to launch a satellite, but as Ukrainian Ranger correctly judged it's only really good for dick waving nationalism. The USSR could have spent some of that money on improving living standards in a few of the many oblasts and Republics that had people living in medieval conditions. Tajikistan is an example.

Of course, USSR may have spend all those money on peaceful applications! And it would get bombed into the ground around 50s-60s by NATO aggressors, because they really wanted to do that. End result: much, much worse than in real life.

And:

Again: It happened in the ending days of Russian Empire, where 90% of population were forever locked in a class of "serfs" and part of them were even worse, forced to work at factories in a country with no anti-capitalistic forces in play.

Consider that, and then consider the fact that in 30-35 years after that, the Russia became one of only two world's superpowers and were the first country to launch a satellite into space. The first!

Yep. Russia was first to launch satellite (thank another Ukrainian, Korolyov) so what? It was never used in a proper way, It had  close to zero commercial use, unlike Western countries that used it for wellbeing of its citizens (and profit, but that is how market economy works)

If Russia have had the kind of resources the USA have access to, we would do that too. Alas, the USA has never seen a real war on it's territory and thus, had a gigantic head-start on Russia.

[Owlbread]

"The Numbers Game" - a 25 minute independent documentary on polling in the Scottish independence referendum; how it is used (specifically as a weapon), the effects it has and just how accurate the polls are at the moment.

The documentary is from a pro-independence filmmaker and the man he is interviewing writes a pro-independence chiefly concerned with polling analysis. In spite of this bias, it shouldn't be too overt and you should be able to enjoy the perspectives it takes on things if you enjoy political analysis from a different perspective to the one you'll read in the Sunday broadsheets.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

August 24.... Happy independence day, my Ukraine. I am little depressed last days. I am so tired of blood. I am whining to much and sometimes allow myself to doubt final victory yet I know that the victory will come. The only question what the price will be.

Glory to nation!
Death to the enemies!