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[Sergarr]

Nationalist or cosmopolitan imperialists? Also secular or fundamentalist?
Does Russia even have secularists?

Most people there are already atheists (because USSR was atheistic), so no.

Also, what does "cosmopolitan imperialists" mean?

[Max White]

National imperialism: Destroy all the cultures! We must take the world and make everybody like us!
Cosmopolitan imperialism: Collect all the cultures! We must take the world and make all beliefs a part of our empire!

[Owlbread]

National imperialism: Destroy all the cultures! We must take the world and make everybody like us!
Cosmopolitan imperialism: Collect all the cultures! We must take the world and make all beliefs a part of our empire!

It's debatable about exactly how Putin's Russia is imperialistic. In some respects they are cosmopolitan imperialists in the way they've managed to absorb many religiously and culturally different states that very nearly could have been independent - e.g. Tatarstan, Tuva, most of the North Caucasus etc, but with respect to other cultures that have put up less of a fight and are maybe of similar faith then Putin just basically lets them drown in a sea of Russian migrants (see ethnic Republics that are 90% Russian). It's not like Putin started that though, that's been going for a very long time.

To be fair though, I do wonder quite often if there is a real policy involving ethnic Russian migration in order to dissolve the little nations like aspirin in glasses of water, but somehow I can't see that really being a... "thing". Russia 40 years ago maybe, 2013? I'm not sure. I wonder if it just... happens naturally in a way that completely benefits Putin and his cabal, you know, so he wouldn't bother doing much about it because it works in his interest. One thing of note is that the ethnic Republics/territories that now have very large ethnic Russian majorities are often the richest or have the most resources.

You must understand of course that when I have such criticism I am in no way criticising "Russians" (this could lead to a misunderstanding), my beef is with the establishment over there which I find abhorrent. Russia is a truly beautiful country with a fascinating history and culture, I just really wish you fellows weren't led by gangsters.

[XXSockXX]

National imperialism: Destroy all the cultures! We must take the world and make everybody like us!
Cosmopolitan imperialism: Collect all the cultures! We must take the world and make all beliefs a part of our empire!

I don't think "cosmopolitan imperialism" exists. Some empires just end up being somewhat cosmopolitan, since for example the British Empire would have been unable to culturally absorb India.
And national imperialism is never as clear cut as that. It usually starts as "unite all our people" (or "get our own state" if you haven't got one), then becomes "unite all territories ever ruled by our people". Then it becomes mostly driven by economic considerations.
In fact imperialism is mostly an economic thing, the question is just whether you want to directly rule everybody, in which case it makes sense to try to culturally unify them, or rule indirectly, which is the case in modern (Russian, American, Chinese) imperialism.

To be fair though, I do wonder quite often if there is a real policy involving ethnic Russian migration in order to dissolve the little nations like aspirin in glasses of water, but somehow I can't see that really being a... "thing". Russia 40 years ago maybe, 2013? I'm not sure. I wonder if it just... happens naturally in a way that completely benefits Putin and his cabal, you know, so he wouldn't bother doing much about it because it works in his interest. One thing of note is that the ethnic Republics/territories that now have very large ethnic Russian majorities are often the richest or have the most resources.

That was exactly what the Soviets did under Stalin, it's how Russians ended up being the ethnic majority in many areas. The original inhabitants were deported to economically unimportant places, mostly in Central Asia or Siberia (Wolga Germans for example ended up in Kazakhstan) and Russians were settled in. It doesn't happen naturally, but facts have been created, you couldn't really reverse that without major ethnic cleansings. Today I think it's just a natural process, since Russians are the majority they reproduce faster than the much smaller ethnic minorities.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

I just really wish you fellows weren't led by gangsters.

IMO, There are no such thing as good nation bad rulers. People should take responsibility for actions of it's rulers.

To be fair though, I do wonder quite often if there is a real policy involving ethnic Russian migration in order to dissolve the little nations like aspirin in glasses of water, but somehow I can't see that really being a... "thing". Russia 40 years ago maybe, 2013? I'm not sure. I wonder if it just...

Russians lost that game. Now the trend is reversed. Non-Russians simply have lower birthrates and if nothing will change that's Russians who will get assimilated. And I suspect Putin will not object, he doesn't care who will live in the empire as long as that empire will exist.

They may have 91.6% Russians in Moscow according to census... but that's official Russian style statistics. In real life, that's at most 60% of Russians and steadily declining. That will end in huge ethnic conflicts. They are staring already with events like Riot in Birulyovo. They say it's against illegal migrants, but the truth is that it is more against Russian citizens of "wrong" nationalities that moved to Moscow

I have some contacts among Russian nationalists. One that want what any sane nationalist wants - national state. Of cause separatists* like them aren't treated lightly in Russia so, unlike various xenophobic groups, they are mostly underground and have no officially registered structures.

*They want transformation of Russian Federation to an unitary state with granting Independence (or rather forcing independence, no matter want they or nor) to  many non-Russian majority regions and case to case decision where population is mixed. Oh, and they want forced removal of some non-Russians from the new Russia, so they are not liberals at all.

[Lagslayer]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I just really wish you fellows weren't led by gangsters.

IMO, There are no such thing as good nation bad rulers. People should take responsibility for actions of it's rulers.

To be fair though, I do wonder quite often if there is a real policy involving ethnic Russian migration in order to dissolve the little nations like aspirin in glasses of water, but somehow I can't see that really being a... "thing". Russia 40 years ago maybe, 2013? I'm not sure. I wonder if it just...

Russians lost that game. Now the trend is reversed. Non-Russians simply have lower birthrates and if nothing will change that's Russians who will get assimilated. And I suspect Putin will not object, he doesn't care who will live in the empire as long as that empire will exist.

They may have 91.6% Russians in Moscow according to census... but that's official Russian style statistics. In real life, that's at most 60% of Russians and steadily declining. That will end in huge ethnic conflicts. They are staring already with events like Riot in Birulyovo. They say it's against illegal migrants, but the truth is that it is more against Russian citizens of "wrong" nationalities that moved to Moscow

I have some contacts among Russian nationalists. One that want what any sane nationalist wants - national state. Of cause separatists* like them aren't treated lightly in Russia so, unlike various xenophobic groups, they are mostly underground and have no officially registered structures.

*They want transformation of Russian Federation to an unitary state with granting Independence (or rather forcing independence, no matter want they or nor) to  many non-Russian majority regions and case to case decision where population is mixed. Oh, and they want forced removal of some non-Russians from the new Russia, so they are not liberals at all.

Spoiler: Putin sees all, and he is displeased. (click to show/hide)

[Sergarr]

Assimilating russians is like assimilating chinese. Mongols conquered China, but after just a few generations they were chinified.

[Loud Whispers]

Assimilating russians is like assimilating chinese. Mongols conquered China, but after just a few generations they were chinified.

To invade China, you must become China.

[MonkeyHead]

Assimilating russians is like assimilating chinese. Mongols conquered China, but after just a few generations they were chinified.

To invade China, you must become China.

Or follow the Japanese route and commit horrible war crimes at each and every opportunity. However, that didnt end well for anyone involved, so go fish...

[Loud Whispers]

Or follow the Japanese route and commit horrible war crimes at each and every opportunity. However, that didnt end well for anyone involved, so go fish...

The Mongols weren't known for abiding the Geneva convention. Given time, Imperial Japan would have become China.

[MonkeyHead]

Or follow the Japanese route and commit horrible war crimes at each and every opportunity. However, that didnt end well for anyone involved, so go fish...

The Mongols weren't known for abiding the Geneva convention. Given time, Imperial Japan would have become China.

Good point. Pesky Mongols.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Assimilating russians is like assimilating chinese. Mongols conquered China, but after just a few generations they were chinified.

To invade China, you must become China.

This is surprisingly true.

[ChairmanPoo]

Actually, it's pretty much what happens when less developed civilizations overrun more advanced ones: the conquerors end up following the fashion and ways of the conquered. For more examples see what happened when the Nubians invaded Egypt, the Romans invaded the Greeks, the Goth invasion of the Western Roman Empire,  the Arab invasion of the Eastern Roman Empire, or the Turkish invasion of both Muslim realms and the Eastern Roman Empire. (those are all I can think of right now)

[Owlbread]

I wonder what Russians would think about that. Are we implying that Russians were less civilised than the Turkic Khanates, Uralic tribes and Caucasian Kings?

[Guardian G.I.]

I wonder what Russians would think about that. Are we implying that Russians were less civilised than the Turkic Khanates, Uralic tribes and Caucasian Kings?

According to Russian patriotic websites and books, Westerners have always regarded Russians as uncivilized barbarians that should be exterminated because they occupy territories full of natural resources. Also, Russian patriotic websites and books describe all Westerners as degenerate uncivilized barbarians that have no culture and any morality whatsoever. They often provide somewhat strange examples to prove their words - for instance, an article that I've read once claimed that the fact that Western languages (especially English) don't have as much diminutive suffixes denoting affection as the Russian language proves that Westerners are culturally inferior to Russians (source).