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[scapheap]

Agrees with Ukrainian Ranger, but to make clear we do not go 'worship me or die!', it 'you are a nice person, I will do likewise.' or 'you made a lot of bad life choices and now I the taxman.'

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Worship me or die should be saved for extreme cases... And it's more like: "Sadly, I am going to kill you because you are my enemy , but if you join my side, I'll forgive you and will make your life much more pleasant "

No terrorizing just for recruiting, but giving a chance to avoid death by joining.

And we accept all sentient beings as worshipers, no matter what their past is. And treat races equally

[Talvara]

Theres a pallete of lovely shades of gray between good and evil.

my main concern is with forcing people.

We'll violently protect 'ours', but new people should come to us by choice. if We'd have to force them to have faith in us, why would we even want them as our faithfull anyway?

Agrees with Ukrainian Ranger, but to make clear we do not go 'worship me or die!', it 'you are a nice person, I will do likewise.' or 'you made a lot of bad life choices and now I the taxman.'

I also don't see a problem with treating people as they would treat others, with perhaps a chance to change before putting the wrath of donut into them. (change --> chaos --> profit)

IMO, orcs and goblins can't be converted by any other way but fear

Donut is a two-sided god, he can create life and be a very nice guy, but he can be very cruel to his enemies and worshipers of his enemies

Oh, and what diplomatic victory are you talking about? Does it include hiring a cold-blooded maniac and making him even stronger then he was to let him kill much more effectively? If you want to be a good god then GET RID OF THAT VAMPIRE or stop pretending

Was it diplomatic to butcher a shitload of orcs and turning  them into fungus zombies? No one proposed to convert them, nor by force nor by persuasion

Was it diplomatic to kill Justicars?

It's perfectly fine to use fear to force worshipers of wrong gods to think again for their own good (Else we'll  need to kill them..)

we are flexible enough to incorperate Leksus into our schemes, although the werewolf thing has kinda backfired.
The orcs were attacking us, I see no reason why our response wasn't justified.
and we did try to be diplomatic with the justicars, when they failed to remove the stick from their asses and showed to be a threat to our followers we acted, in a justifiable manner.

we dont have to kill people that dont convert to us... we only have to kill them when they become a threat.

Worship me or die should be saved for extreme cases... And it's more like: "Sadly, I am going to kill you because you are my enemy , but if you join my side, I'll forgive you and will make your life much more pleasant "

No terrorizing just for recruiting, but chance to avoid death by joining

this also sounds fine to me, but we shouldnt go out there and try to convert through fireballs and death. protecting ourselves with fireballs and death is perfectly acceptable.


edit:

I guess a reason I'd see as acceptable to go on the attack would be to remove tyranical gods. (basically gods that are completely opposed to our interpretation of chaos)

but hey. we're all subsets of a greater persona here. Donut will most likely be a compromise between all.

[Urist McBeanie]

-snip-

I agree with that.

[jaass]

We should make something to at least scout out the area instead of going in blindly.

[Vgray]

Did we even do anything to heal the wounded Justicar? Or did we forget about him and let him die?

[GreatWyrmGold]

Short-term: Ask what's happening in Ravenholt, then go there to confirm.

Longer-term:
If Laskus can't do much to the goblins for whatever reason, send Tiberius and...whatever we named the dragon (dangit!) to help, supported by divine fire. Whatever happens, make sure to provide the goblins a display of our power before they are defeated, ideally via fire magic since that's the least like Uristiel's.
Speaking of Uristiel, talk with him about seeding the caverns with new life. For now, he can just "owe us one"--one is a very potent currency, in addition to making him feel grateful in his time of need.



(I already typed this, then I closed the tab. ARGH!)

[Karnewarrior]

IMO, orcs and goblins can't be converted by any other way but fear

Donut is a two-sided god, he can create life and be a very nice guy, but he can be very cruel to his enemies and worshipers of his enemies

Oh, and what diplomatic victory are you talking about? Does it include hiring a cold-blooded maniac and making him even stronger then he was to let him kill much more effectively? If you want to be a good god then GET RID OF THAT VAMPIRE or stop pretending

Was it diplomatic to butcher a shitload of orcs and turning  them into fungus zombies? No one proposed to convert them, nor by force nor by persuasion

Was it diplomatic to kill Justicars?

It's perfectly fine to use fear to force worshipers of wrong gods to think again for their own good (Else we'll  need to kill them..)

It was not diplomatic to kill a bunch of Justicars. One does not play a entire game of Civ on one path either. does this mean you always have to go for the domination victory?

Laskus is an Evil unit, but having one follower be Evil in nature does not an evil god make. Laskus being a vampire does not make us evil. In fact, I don't remember him ever drinking blood, nor any sign of him burning in the sunlight. It's possible we cured him of vampirism and "gifted" him with lycanthropy. Remember we admonished him for infecting Mahers followers, not because we cared for Maher himself, not because we thought they would go his way, but because it was an assholish thing to do.

We don't convert by force. We've been quite adamant about that since the begining of the game. We convert our followers with flashy displays and a peaceful-ish life, by offering them what they want, not by threatening to take what they need.

We do not shirk from war. But having a strong military does not make you not diplomatic. Our military is defensive, and Laskus has thus far been put to use saving lives. We don't convert by force. I oppose any movement to do so with the utmost of my ability.

If the goblins or orcs wish to come into our worship we will gladly recieve them. But it will be their own choice. After that first town, we don't ask for followers, we assume they will come to us. We're forming a center culture here, one that will continue to draw men and women from far away lands to see our wonders. We will become a shining beacon of freedom, equality, and innovation. Eccumenism is one of our main tenants, even.

We do not convert by force. To do so would be to tarnish everything we've done up to this point. Every good action we've made, wether to our followers or to others. I doubt many gods, even good gods, have helped followers of other gods without any promise of return. If we do so, our reputation will spread like wildfire. By simply not asking them to convert, we will recive more conversions from all over. Let our village grow to a city, then a metropolis.

We've played a hundred games with the intent to kill, destroy, and conquer. Let's play one with the intent to grow, create, and liberate.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Opening  a trade route by fireballs is absolutely justified too. That's protection of our interests.
Burning down city of enemy god is a good thing, too
And we didn't really tried to reason with Justicars, we made one attempt to negotiate and went to kill them all mode... By that standards - "Bow to me or die!" is a diplomacy, too.  (Actually it's even more more diplomatic, we attacked Justicars treacherously without any kind of warning. That's not a diplomacy)

I am sure that 250 incarnating firejackets, dragon and our own strike is enough to rout an army. Chance to convert some goblins  in process is only a bonus, a very nice bonus that may grant us real army, not a bunch of magical beasts...


Karnewarrior,  so you think it's better to go in kill them all mode then try to make them join our side? Is that more moral by your standards?

[kaian-a-coel]

WE DO NOT CONVERT BY FORCE.

The first commandment of donuts was as simple as it was confusing why he needed to put it as number one.

-Mark Dane, Historicist

Nobody ever wants to go for a diplomatic victory....

I agree in setting this commandment in stone.

Otherwise, we need to solve the werewolves (if it is werewolves) problem.
We are a nice god. We want to convert with love, make allies whenever possible, and protect our people with brutal force. You do not poke the dragon's babies.

The dragon is Brunikaar. If we are to make an open attack, combine it with Uristiel's.

Karnewarrior,  so you think it's better to go in kill them all mode then try to make them join our side? Is that more moral by your standards?

IT IS NOT.

[scapheap]

I view Laskus as our Token Evil Teammate.

[jaass]

Still think we should make some recon-flyers. Also, about the Justicars they come into our land and demand us to follow their laws even though there wasn't any type of treaty or agreement with their God.

[Talvara]

...
Karnewarrior,  so you think it's better to go in kill them all mode then try to make them join our side? Is that more moral by your standards?

being consistent with our own (donuts) morality, may be different than being moral as viewed from our respective social and cultural backgrounds irl.

morality does not equal good.

if we deem them a threat to us, we'll go with the intent of destorying that threat. There doesnt have to be an intent to convert them. If some DO convert after being amazed by destructive capabilities that would create an interesting scenario.

one that we would have to think about how to handle. Are those converts true believers? is their Manna just as good? is that all that matters? do we HAVE to accept them as our followers? interesting questions that we'll probably run into sooner or later

Still think we should make some recon-flyers. Also, about the Justicars they come into our land and demand them to follow their laws even though there wasn't any type of treaty or agreement with their God.

perhaps a new strain of firejackets? first give them a queen. and then introduce variant sub species?

[gman8181]

More followers is a good thing as far as I'm concerned.  If crushing greenskins under our metaphorical boots nets us more followers and opens up trade with the dwarves than I'll be a happy man.

[kaian-a-coel]

Also to all of those people hoping to get greenskin followers, first I'm not comfortable with these fellows, second they are unlikely to join us anyway, third Grumugga.