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[Hubris Incalculable]

Cartoons are better now than they were when I was a kid. Not only in production quality, but content as well. Even if someone were to feel some kind of misplaced nostalgia for Bugs Bunny or Tom and Jerry, the shows were simple minded trash. Now there are shows like Powerpuff Girls, and of course, ponies. There have been cartoons like the Justice League, which intelligently addressed some very interesting questions. Compare Justice League Unlimited in the 2000s to Superfriends from the 70s and 80s...same exact franchise and characters, yeah...sorry, but it got way better.

[Scoops Novel]

Ah, I see. The darned young'uns are all excited over their pop stars and their hippity-hop instead of fighting the Man and going to the Moon. That's clearly what's wrong with my generation and those younger than me, that our (generally, not personally—I couldn't possibly care less about the popular culture of my generation) focus is on the things that society deems important in the present day, rather than what society deemed important a few decades ago. But of course the shallow, stupid things today are so much worse than they were back then. I couldn't possibly be detecting a hint of rose tinting, could I?

That aside, the obvious bit about idiots having always been there but current technology allowing them to be far more vocal, etc. etc.

Speaking as one of our generation, the problem in my eyes is that there are a very many things which are wrong with the world and people who are just about to be of an age to do something about it still either know fuck all about it, care fuck all about it or do fuck all about it. As I'm far from perfect myself, a key point is opportunity. Movements like Occupy are not exactly prevalent in England, though the usual air of dissatisfaction is in effect, and the lack of people of a mind to join such groups means there is little and less for those who are of a mind to do. But bring in someone asking for blood and there's quite a few who are interested, because it's immediate, it's simple and it alleviates some of the guilt nagging at you. Getting people to do something big and complicated and uncertain has always been a problem, and it's very much a problem now.

Yes, we're in the position we are largely because of the generations before us. The fact that they have not left us in a stellar situation is lost on few of us. Nevertheless, what we currently seem to care about doesn't help, and more importantly just how fucked we are doesn't seem to sink in. Take the usual (think of those worse then yourselves, like those children who were killed in America. There was 20 seconds of since. I expect three more and contemplation of their sorrows will have left everyone's heads, because they've been asked to do that for their whole lives, and after all, there's not much we can do so business as usual. and much like DJ the ones who are in the worse straits can always afford some weed (i understand why, but for reasons I'm sure you understand it angers me).

The bigger issue is that people rarely feel particularly motivated for themselves, let alone others, when they're comfortable. After all, look at this thread. I can count the number of well off participants on the ion sails of my third elbow. Indeed, just motivation is a problem as has been stated, and I'm proof of that.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I spend my time reading things like this on the internet, and summoning up the motivation to work is a problem, particularly when i recognize the consequences of not doing so. Part of it's boredom with the work, part of it's dissatisfaction/boredom with my peers, and part of its just bloody minded laziness and that the internet can be so much more interesting. I came into A level expecting a jump, but i seem to have mainly got quantity, with the exception of history to an extent. On the other hand, i recognize that the hypocrisy of such selfish laziness, even with laziness like this, particularly since it could prevent me from ever doing something worthwhile with my life, is something i need to end, but i still haven't surmounted it yet.

In summary, the internet being the mother of all distractions doesn't help none, as you American's seem fond of putting it. Simply recognizing there are problems is something we need to work on, and just how much of the world is currently a shit-hole is something that few ever seem to remember. All of us have a couple of names they can throw out, like global warming or the recession, but getting to the heart of the problem, and the sacrifices necessary, well that has far less takers as it stands. It's not helpful that we've still got the odd ill-researched jingoistic bollocks popping up now and then of the took er jobs variety.

Flying Dice, to some extent this is to be expected from every generation, not least mine. Neither do i expect previous generations to be much better with their form of senseless spiel, but i do wish for mine to start getting some damn will together, and not just a tuppence. Earlier lot's were also lazy, but they do seem to have done something now and then, and that's without the internet little and less seem to be using to it's fullest.

Also, I'm with Redking on Cartoons, mostly because of DragonBallZ, Megas Xlr, Samurai Jack, occasionally the Power-puff girls and Ed and Eddy just being fun to watch .

[Mr Space Cat]

I think modern music is actually doing wonderfully, thanks mainly to the internet.  We have more variety now than ever in history, because  quality production tools are easily obtainable, self-publishing is easy, and a fan base can be spread out all over the world.

Yeah, music is really diverse now. There's various recognized bands (or pop performers, shudder) or other such musical groups on the radio and such, then there's developing music genres such as djent and guys like Bulb who are willing to experiment and produce provide these experiments for free and gets by through performing live with his band Periphery and their album sales.

Then there's stuff such as fandom music. For example, the brony fandom has a huge variety of music and musicians, many of whom also provide their music for free via Mediafire and Youtube. At the same time, there have been multiple instances where these musicians put together an album for sale through Bandcamp and other such providers, or even collaborate with their fellow brony musicians to put together a massive collab album featuring a variety of tracks and genres (Balloon Party, Seeds of Kindness, Seeds of Kindness 2, etc.)

Heck, Archie V was a brony musician who got signed up with a publisher to produce music professionally. (such examples here, here or here)

Yeah, modern music is doing great once you look past the generic pop.

[dei]

The only things I enjoy of this generation are the video games of nineteen-ninety-four to two-thousand-and-eight,
the music that doesn't sound like the horrid bastard child of a sleazy ghetto brothel and an ecstacy-laden rave,
and the pornography that has women which are actually attractive

Popular culture, fashion and entertainment...it's probably worth an entire thread of its own. To my eyes some things have definitely improved, but there's been some sheer stupidity in every decade. I look at pictures of myself from when I was a kid and the clothes look absolutely dorky to my eyes. But I remember thinking the same during the 90s when guys starting thinking it was "cool" to wear waistbands halfway down their thighs so you could watch their underwear while they tripped over themselves because their shorts went down to their knees. Then there was that ridiculous "inverted dress" thing that was in style when I was teenager. I don't even remember what those things were called, but trust me when I say the current generation should feel pretty good about not keeping those.

Cartoons are better now than they were when I was a kid. Not only in production quality, but content as well. Even if someone were to feel some kind of misplaced nostalgia for Bugs Bunny or Tom and Jerry, the shows were simple minded trash. Now there are shows like Powerpuff Girls, and of course, ponies. There have been cartoons like the Justice League, which intelligently addressed some very interesting questions. Compare Justice League Unlimited in the 2000s to Superfriends from the 70s and 80s...same exact franchise and characters, yeah...sorry, but it got way better.

I do agree whole-heartedly that animation has improved over time but personally outside of ponies, some of the stuff on Adult Swim and various Japanese animations I don't find myself watching much of the animation that goes on today. A lot of it is still made for children and what there is that is made for adults in my opinion is either a hit or a miss.

Personally I wish they would animate Deadpool into something awesome. I hope they aren't saving him for Generation Z to enjoy.

music that doesn't sound like the horrid bastard child of a sleazy ghetto brothel and an ecstacy-laden rave

Mixed feelings on this one. To be fair, there's always been generic, mass produced "popular" music during my lifetime. You have Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera, but we had Tiffany and Debbie Gibson. It's not that different. Before this silly gungnam style thing, there was the silly macarena thing and before that there was the silly hot, hot hot thing. But like you say, some genres are just...bad. I think that trend started in the 90s when people started trying to take rap seriously for some strange reason. At the time, rap was basically black men speaking in a monotone about beating and raping women with a drumbeat simple enough to tap with your fingers.

Look at an older artist like Metallica or Aerosmith, whether or not you like the music, I think most people would agree that they at least know how to play their instruments. Some of the music of the 90s and 2000s is kind of like a musical version of "modern art" that looks like somebody threw a splotch mustard on canvas and tried to sell it.

At some point it's not a matter of just nostalgia. Yes, I realize we had cheap, mass produced music in the 80s too, but some of things people do now and call music or art...somebody just needs to slap them and tell them they're being silly.

I love Metallica and Queen if that counts for anything. However most of the modern genres like dubstep, house, rap and hip-hop I am unable to even consider music outside of a few rare artists that would count as indie or doujin even. However that is mostly because my younger brother used blaring it as a means of psychological abuse - every time I would try to relax after a hard day he would start blaring the rap music of Generation Y at noise ordinance violating levels and to this day I cannot listen to musicians like Outkast or Ludacris without having a panic attack.

Personally, I also really like the music from the fifties to the seventies. I could listen to that stuff all day long because of how good, calm and clean it sounds. Of course I say the same things about the artists of the eighties through to today that I like, but something about the music of the baby boomers and generations prior just makes it sound good to me.

women which are actually attractive

Mixed feelings on this one too. Personally, I look at a legendary sex symbol like say...Marilyn Monroe, and I just kind of think, "huh? What?" She doesn't look physically attractive to me. But if you watch any of her movies, she was adorable. I understand why people found her personality attractive. In the 80s, "the look" of women was a lot more innocent than it is now, and occasionally it was downright silly. But that was ok. Maybe they looked silly, but they were cute silly. Sometime during the late 90s / early 2000s women's fashion started to head into slutty territory, and we started seeing more mainstream women with tramp stamps, "fuck me heels" and this whole "clubbing" look and so forth.

I'd say that women's fashion has a generally sexier look now than it used to. I mean...at one time this would have been considered sexy:



To me that looks just as silly as it probably does to you. But a lot of the things I see girls wearing now inspires a reaction of "yeah, that might be sexy...but if she offered I'd say no because she looks dangerously unclean." Tatoos are a big one. It was not socially acceptable for girls to have tattoos when I was a kid, but now I see teenagers wearing great big arrows pointing permanently at their butthole, and when I see something like that my initial reaction is generally to wonder how many dozens of guys have used it as a landing beacon.

I remember an episode of Happy Days in which Fonzi was talking about how there are some girls everybody wants to date, and some girls everybody wants to marry...and they're not the same girls. "Fuck me, I'm not marriage material" seems to be a popular look these days.

First of all the woman you used as an example looks to be the most attractive woman I've seen recently. She just looks really damn cute for some reason and I want to take her home. But with that aside I agree that tattoos are just horrible, especially these days with the sexualization of them.

I consider tattoos to be sacred and thus to not be used in profane situations like referencing the fact that you want access to the most effective form of birth control since the dawn of time, but instead in situations related to something metaphysical or spiritual that is best left outside of the confines of a profane place like this here forum.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Profane isn't anything bad. It just means that it's something everyday and thus not sacred. I learned that word in an anthropology class.

To see a tattoo that isn't of a sacred nature on a woman is a major turn-off, outside of one instance that in reality was probably just body paint now that I think about it. As for what you have said about how many women look unclean these days, well I would have to agree. However, due to the sake of brevity and a lack of desire for the banhammer, let me just say that I find the whole clubbing look to be most times destestable and I will leave it at that.

Now if you excuse me, thinking about the abomination that is "club culture" has made me kind of surly and agitated. Therefore it is time for tea. I do enjoy the good conversation and hope to continue this at a later date.

[Scoops Novel]

Club Culture, eh? Tell me what i have to look forward too .

[RedKing]

Club Culture, eh? Tell me what i have to look forward too .

Never did the whole clubbing thing myself. Less because of any kind of moral/ethical qualms, and more because it tended to trigger bouts of hypervigilance and social panic. Everyone else was getting down to some phat beats, and I'm the guy in the corner intensely scanning the upper gallery for snipers. WTF, brain? 

[DJ]

Also: mainstream pop? Is it ever good?

The Beatles.

[penguinofhonor]

I like to remind people on occasion that the Beatles started out as a boy band.

Also club culture isn't modern at all. It's shocking how similar it is to disco culture.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Let's not forget the late 60's and 1970's, when casual sex was no big thing until AIDS showed up on the scene and everybody went "OH SHIT".

The funny part is that with HIV/AIDS so suppressed in the West now, in no small part due to HAART, the casual sex attitude has almost immediately returned in full force.

Not a big fan of tramp stamps, but I don't automatically assume that having one makes a woman "unclean", as you put it.

Agreed, and I'd say that being so rabid about a tattoo is sexist. That said, they're usually really terrible, just from a design standpoint (though that applies to all tattoos). Not always, though, I've seen a few that were tasteful.

You see moral decay, I see people who are growing up in a culture where everything moves faster, and so they don't have time to waste in "courtship" if what they're really looking for is sex. I find that kind of refreshing, to be honest.

There's that, but a liberalization of mores contributes as well. It isn't tracked as well, but sexually Y is to X what X is to the Baby Boomers. While optimistic in a lot of ways, I'd say that Y has become cynical on the sexual front because of this. Nobody is "stupid" enough to believe that you can find emotional fulfillment or love. Highschool couples are an exercise in futility, and dating in college is more often code for casual sex. Marriage is a death trap, especially if you're the one making more money. Children are an expensive nuisance. The only "smart" thing to do is to fulfill your base desires with whomever comes along, whenever they come along, but don't go and get clingy. The only thing more trivial than sex are your so-called "feelings", and nobody wants to hear it.

That isn't necessarily a bad thing, but god forbid you are part of the minority who doesn't see it like this. I admit I might be a bit biased, being around people like my roommate, but I think that my roommate is actually a very legitimate example of how people see sex these days. To people like him, sex has literally become a competition.

If I had to speculate, I'd call it cognitive dissonance. Y grew up on the same expectations of romantic love as the past few American generations, but....the witnessed reality was now much different. Messy divorces, custody disputes, and unhappy stuck marriages were everyday occurrences for a lot of us, what with the divorce rate being higher than the marriage rate. This was the first generation for whom divorce is normal, more normal than staying together, even. I remember when I was in elementary school, one day I got curious and started trying to ask around. There were more people in my class with divorced parents than married parents. I didn't fully understand the implications of my data gathering back then, but at the time I still thought it was strange with media always depicting happy couples if this was how it really was.

As far as relationships go, if I admire Gen Y for being blatantly up front and in the moment about what they want, I admire the Greatest Generation for their commitment and patience. There were a lot of "sweethearts" left behind that waited for four years or more and married the men that came home. And many of them stayed married for life, which is exceedingly rare these days. It was a generation that really lacked the selfishness that their kids pioneered.

Personally, I feel like Gen Y has the potential to be a generation like this...they're just lacking that galvanizing event. If the current economic woes are analogous to the Great Depression, then who knows? A massive war with China/aliens/zombies might be the analog for WWII (and the subconscious desire for that kind of rallying point might explain the popularity of alien invasions/zombie apocalypse/tech crash in pop culture).

Speaking as a member of it, I think a galvanizing event like that would drive Y deeper into their current state of casual noncommittal attitudes.

[penguinofhonor]

... Michael Jackson?

[DJ]

Also: mainstream pop? Is it ever good?

The Beatles.

To me, that reinforced his point.

I'm sorry, but you may be a hipster.

[fqllve]

I love Metallica and Queen if that counts for anything. However most of the modern genres like dubstep, house, rap and hip-hop I am unable to even consider music outside of a few rare artists that would count as indie or doujin even. However that is mostly because my younger brother used blaring it as a means of psychological abuse - every time I would try to relax after a hard day he would start blaring the rap music of Generation Y at noise ordinance violating levels and to this day I cannot listen to musicians like Outkast or Ludacris without having a panic attack.

The greatest part of the non-classical music I listen to is from the fifties, sixties, and seventies, and even then those decades produced some of the best classical musicians ever, yet... even in the genres I like, which are few, I can hardly stand most of the artists. I like prog, as long as by prog you mean King Crimson and no one else. I like the 60's folk revival, as long as we're only talking about Bob Dylan and Bert Jansch. Seriously, was space rock any good, outside of producing Pink Floyd? How about jazz fusion, excluding Miles Davis's forays into the genre? What about sunshine pop and bubblegum pop? How about all those girl groups? Anything musically meritorious to that, other than the fact they sang well?

And just because you don't like rap doesn't make it non-music. It isn't really music on the same level as Bach, because music isn't the part you pay attention to. It's lyricism, and to that end there are good rappers. I pretty much only like Aesop Rock, but Outkast is pretty ok, dunno what you have against them, so are the Gorillaz, Sage Francis, Atmosphere, Busdriver. If you don't just dismiss the genre outright there are good examples in it. I don't listen to any dubstep, and I dislike electronic music in general, but I don't write the genre off as terrible because I don't know. It's not my thing and I couldn't judge it fairly, doesn't mean it all sucks.

Also: mainstream pop? Is it ever good?

The Beatles.

One band. The Byrds were also good, though not nearly as good. Good mainstream pop from last decade? Shiina Ringo. Good mainstream pop from the decade before that? Elliott Smith. Also, I could argue that basically everything they did after Revolver was not mainstream pop, they were just so awesome they turned it into mainstream pop.

It exists, but it's the obviously the exception. Most pop is barely remarkable. And comparing any pop act, even the good ones, to the Beatles is going to be hugely disappointing.

[Scoops Novel]

As far as relationships go, if I admire Gen Y for being blatantly up front and in the moment about what they want, I admire the Greatest Generation for their commitment and patience. There were a lot of "sweethearts" left behind that waited for four years or more and married the men that came home. And many of them stayed married for life, which is exceedingly rare these days. It was a generation that really lacked the selfishness that their kids pioneered.

Personally, I feel like Gen Y has the potential to be a generation like this...they're just lacking that galvanizing event. If the current economic woes are analogous to the Great Depression, then who knows? A massive war with China/aliens/zombies might be the analog for WWII (and the subconscious desire for that kind of rallying point might explain the popularity of alien invasions/zombie apocalypse/tech crash in pop culture).

Speaking as a member of it, I think a galvanizing event like that would drive Y deeper into their current state of casual noncommittal attitudes.
[/quote]

Hell no. You may be thinking of it realistically, but to them that would be the wild west born anew.

[Scoops Novel]

As for sex, well, I'm not one to talk, but more casual yes, death of all romance no. More people like your roommate though, yes.

[Frumple]

Rap... I think about that stuff pretty often. Big thing to me about rap is its pedigree is fucking amazing. You've got jazz/R&B/soul, rock, african-american gospel, and african percussion (which does some pretty damned impressive stuff) as strong instrumental aspects, beat poetry and the combined vocal history of both the european (Coming in via religious choral stuff and the gospel angle) and african vocal traditions as primary vocal/lyrical influence. With a history like that, by all rights the genre should be capable of producing shit that blows the mind. I mean, it has consistently failed to among the stuff I've heard so far, but...

So I keep giving it chances and... there's been a few that are solid. Not amazing, per se, but solid. I've gotten where I leave four or five on my music playlists -- nothing trending along bands, but some individual songs that are strong enough to pass muster. E: Though some of them aren't in languages I can understand. It's kinda' amusing how much not understanding the lyrics can improve some songs

I... just realized that rap is my musical equivalent to Aeon of Strife-style (DotA, etc, for a popular example) video games. Huh. Occupies the same niche of, "Why the hell is this not amazing!?"