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[scriver]

I've always wondered. Why are fish and bugs not considered meat? They're not plants.

Nirvana told us so.

[GlyphGryph]

Nah, cause the only reason I'm not Vegetarian is because of chicken, and the only reason I'm not vegan, other than chicken, is cheese.

Err... I'm pretty sure the other items on the list still make you not a vegetarian. You eat meat. Many different types. Literally the only thing you don't is mammals. Maybe there's a name for that, but it's not vegetarian.

Fish is DEFINITELY considered meat. Bugs are sort of an edge case, but most people consider them meat too. If you say you're a vegetarian but that you eat fish, most vegetarians are just going to laugh at you. It's like saying you're a hacker because you guessed someone's password to their email (which was password1).

[miauw62]

Fish does TASTE very different from meat, tough. Maybe that's why it's considered a seperate thing?

[GlyphGryph]

...fish IS meat. Different sorts of meat taste different, yes (veal versus turkey versus bacon versus salmon)

Many people actually have trouble telling the difference between white meats, whether it comes from a fish or a bird, from what I understand.

[Sirus]

...Say what? I've never had a problem telling bird from fish. The two are quite different.

[Sensei]

I can't take seriously anyone who argues that it's morally acceptable to eat fish but not land animals, or call themselves "vegetarian" while doing so. I have met some people who say they can't stand the taste of most meat but are okay with fish though.

...Say what? I've never had a problem telling bird from fish. The two are quite different.

Also this, fish muscle is very different.

[Owlbread]

Through long and complicated considerations I came to the conclusion that I was willing to play a miniscule role in the growing demand for meat production. If I stopped eating meat, which I enjoy, there would be very, very little effect on the big picture i.e. animals would be farmed, slaughtered and eaten all over the world whether I stop eating meat or not. I would just not be getting my hands dirty, but I'm not physically killing the animals anyway, I'm just eating their cooked corpses and contributing to the demand for their deaths by buying them. I think I can live with that, being a raindrop falling on the ocean.

[Darvi]

And if you eat books, you're a libertarian?

[miauw62]

And if you eat books, you're a libertarian?

Not sure. However, you'll probably get killed by an orangutan.

The Head Librarian would never do that. Not if you gave him a banana, anyway.

[RedKing]

I've always wondered. Why are fish and bugs not considered meat? They're not plants.

Nirvana told us so.

Damn, you beat me to it.

[GlyphGryph]

Through long and complicated considerations I came to the conclusion that I was willing to play a miniscule role in the growing demand for meat production. If I stopped eating meat, which I enjoy, there would be very, very little effect on the big picture i.e. animals would be farmed, slaughtered and eaten all over the world whether I stop eating meat or not. I would just not be getting my hands dirty, but I'm not physically killing the animals anyway, I'm just eating their cooked corpses and contributing to the demand for their deaths by buying them. I think I can live with that, being a raindrop falling on the ocean.

I find this point of view morally repugnant on so many levels. Like, completely aside from the vegetarian thing. I'll leave it at that.

...Say what? I've never had a problem telling bird from fish. The two are quite different.

Yeah, lots of people say that, and then it turns out that the differences are mostly in their head. Most people are... kind of bad at identifying what they are eating overall.

[Helgoland]

Through long and complicated considerations I came to the conclusion that I was willing to play a miniscule role in the growing demand for meat production. If I stopped eating meat, which I enjoy, there would be very, very little effect on the big picture i.e. animals would be farmed, slaughtered and eaten all over the world whether I stop eating meat or not. I would just not be getting my hands dirty, but I'm not physically killing the animals anyway, I'm just eating their cooked corpses and contributing to the demand for their deaths by buying them. I think I can live with that, being a raindrop falling on the ocean.

One thing I dislike about viewpoints such as this, is that people go 'Oh well, I don't have much of an effect!', whilst failing to realise that the way to have an effect is to have lots of small effects pile up.

Oh, I quite like that point of view, as long as it's handled right: "Doing this little thing will do nothing, so I won't do anything at all" is dumb, but "Doing this little thing will do nothing, so I'll start pushing forward a political solution" is great; much better than "Doing this little thing will do nothing, but I'll do it anyway just to have done something."

[Owlbread]

One thing I dislike about viewpoints such as this, is that people go 'Oh well, I don't have much of an effect!', whilst failing to realise that the way to have an effect is to have lots of small effects pile up.

I'm very much aware of that fact (it is in fact the source of the problem) and made reference to it in the post. I feel like a raindrop falling on an ocean though, and as Helgoland says I'd be more than happy to support a political solution to the problem, but in the meantime there's not much wrong with eating the corpses. There isn't much right about it of course other than the fact that I enjoy it and it gives me more choice in restaurants/throughout life.

I find this point of view morally repugnant on so many levels. Like, completely aside from the vegetarian thing. I'll leave it at that.

Please don't, I'd much rather you went all out. This issue is one that I've often struggled to get my head around so it's very helpful if you can robustly challenge my views. If that means completely trashing me, chances are I need trashed. The main problem that I can see is that similar arguments can be made to justify things like being a murderer in a world of murderers. I just have this strong feeling inside though that we'll have stopped killing each-other before we stop slaughtering animals.

[shrike.ex]

And if you eat books, you're a libertarian?

No no no, you're a libervore.

[Helgoland]

It's at least a fruitful debate topic, unlike definitions or beliefs. Seriously, good topic!

Spoiler: My position, in D&D alignment terms (click to show/hide)

Lawful neutral. I (and you) don't matter, it's ALL the people that matter. And they should do what I want.

EDIT: Librophage?