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[friendguy13]

      Really there are no 2 handed weapons just creatures unable wield a certain weapons in one hand.  Also as far as I know the only thing that effects how well a creature can use a weapon is their size (though strength improves damage for all attacks and affects most combat skills).

      For example 2h swords require size 62,500 to be used at all and are a 2 handed weapon for creatures under 77,500.  Humans are size 70,000 so they use it 2-handed while dwarfs are size 60,000 so the can't use it.  Note that the minimum size (to use not to wield 2 handed) restriction may or may not apply to adventurers.

[nenjin]

Just giving my anecdotal experience here, but the difference between 1 handing vs. 2 handing a 2-handed weapon is sizable.

Like, my above average strength adventurer went from damaging soft tissue or occasionally breaking bone when head shotting.....to decapping or destroying the brain in one swing. I'd know I'd forgotten to empty my offhand when successful head shots weren't immediately lethal.

[friendguy13]

Just giving my anecdotal experience here, but the difference between 1 handing vs. 2 handing a 2-handed weapon is sizable.

Like, my above average strength adventurer went from damaging soft tissue or occasionally breaking bone when head shotting.....to decapping or destroying the brain in one swing. I'd know I'd forgotten to empty my offhand when successful head shots weren't immediately lethal.

This implies that there is a damage, attribute(for attacking only)and/or weapon skill debuff.  In addition to or in place of the accuracy debuff I theorized.

[Greiger]

Old news but back before the materiel update Toady himself stated that it just divides all the attack calculations by 2 when a weapon needs to be wielded two handed and only one hand is available.  I've pretty much just been assuming that was still the case, but it's good to see actual ‼SCIENCE‼ confirm it.  But one little question still bugs me.

What about ranged weapons?  Crossbows don't need 2 hands anymore (the TWO_HANDED:0 no longer seems to force multigrasp anymore) but it is still possible to mod in a two handed crossbow.  I'm sure they suffer penalties as bashing weapons, but do they suffer penalties when used as a ranged weapon?

Since I'm a modder I decided to try to answer my own question.
Since quivers can't be added to arena mode, it is impossible to spawn ranged combatants with a multigrasp crossbow, so I did this.

Spoiler: Vanilla Crossbow (click to show/hide)

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_CROSSBOW]
[NAME:crossbow:crossbows]
[SIZE:400]
[SKILL:HAMMER]
[RANGED:CROSSBOW:BOLT]
[SHOOT_FORCE:1000]
[SHOOT_MAXVEL:1000]  This is just to make sure a near-weightless object doesn't go faster than the string could possibly go.
[TWO_HANDED:0]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:15000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:3]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:10000:4000:bash:bashes:NO_SUB:1250]

Spoiler: 2 handed crossbow for testing purposes (click to show/hide)

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_CROSSBOW_TEST]
[NAME:testcrossbow:testcrossbows]
[SIZE:400]
[SKILL:HAMMER]
[RANGED:CROSSBOW:BOLT]
[SHOOT_FORCE:1000]
[SHOOT_MAXVEL:1000]  This is just to make sure a near-weightless object doesn't go faster than the string could possibly go.
[TWO_HANDED:90000]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:15000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:3]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:10000:4000:bash:bashes:NO_SUB:1250]

I then threw two teams of 10 humans, each spaced 2 tiles apart to allow any accuracy reduction to play a part and let them go at it.   I'm pretty much going to do multiple rounds of the same setup.
10 humans w/ vanilla crossbow and 100 iron bolts vs. 10 humans w/ two handed crossbow and 100 iron bolts.

Trial1: Test crossbow wins with 8 survivors
Trial2: Vanilla crossbow with 9 survivors
Trial3: Vanilla Crossbow with 9 survivors
Trial4: Vanilla crossbow with 9 survivors
Trial5: Vanilla Crossbow with 5 survivors

So it's looking like multigrasp has an effect there too.  Trial 1 is odd, but I can't think of an explanation.

[cephalo]

The OP would indicate to me that having a shield might be the deciding factor.

[RadHazard]

I wonder how armor would affect these results? After all, a two-handed sword would have more force behind the swing, and might be able to penetrate armor easier.  Perhaps I'll test this when I have the time.

[friendguy13]

I will test scimitars Vs. 2H swords tomorrow and maybe some other things.

[huhwhozat]

This is intriguing to me as I had previously run similar tests with Dwarven combatants. (Running vanilla 0.31.25)

For these tests, all skills were set to Competent in Sword, Shield, Armor, Dodging, Fighting:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

10  Dwarves with Iron Longswords, full Iron Plate and Iron Shields
vs.
10 Dwarves with Iron Two-handed swords, full Iron Plate, and Iron Shields
victor:
10 surviving 2H-sword Dwarves

10  Dwarves with Iron Longswords, full Iron Plate and Iron Shields
vs.
10 Dwarves with Iron Two-handed swords, full Iron Plate
victor:
9 surviving 2H-sword Dwarves

10  Dwarves with Iron Longswords, full Iron Plate and Iron Shields
vs.
10 Dwarves with Iron Two-handed swords and !no armor!
victor:
6 surviving 2H-sword Dwarves!

Perhaps my results were anomalous?  I did not do multiple runs of the tests.  If Strength does make a difference in the attack power, arena Dwarves should be able to swing their 2H-swords better than Humans, but I would think the reduced Agility would have resulted in more accurate strikes which should have led to the unarmored team being sliced to ribbons.  Unless the iron armor reduced the Dwarves' speed so much that the unarmored team was able to get in extra attacks.

Regardless, I'd like to see you run some tests with other races, for the !!Science!!

[Cobbler89]

This is intriguing to me as I had previously run similar tests with Dwarven combatants. (Running vanilla 0.31.25)

For these tests, all skills were set to Competent in Sword, Shield, Armor, Dodging, Fighting:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

10  Dwarves with Iron Longswords, full Iron Plate and Iron Shields
vs.
10 Dwarves with Iron Two-handed swords, full Iron Plate, and Iron Shields
victor:
10 surviving 2H-sword Dwarves

10  Dwarves with Iron Longswords, full Iron Plate and Iron Shields
vs.
10 Dwarves with Iron Two-handed swords, full Iron Plate
victor:
9 surviving 2H-sword Dwarves

10  Dwarves with Iron Longswords, full Iron Plate and Iron Shields
vs.
10 Dwarves with Iron Two-handed swords and !no armor!
victor:
6 surviving 2H-sword Dwarves!

Perhaps my results were anomalous?  I did not do multiple runs of the tests.  If Strength does make a difference in the attack power, arena Dwarves should be able to swing their 2H-swords better than Humans, but I would think the reduced Agility would have resulted in more accurate strikes which should have led to the unarmored team being sliced to ribbons.  Unless the iron armor reduced the Dwarves' speed so much that the unarmored team was able to get in extra attacks.

Regardless, I'd like to see you run some tests with other races, for the !!Science!!

In 0.31.25 arena/adventure mode I believe you were capable of wielding a bazillion items at once -- basically, the one thing per hand rule, or whatever rule approximately boils down to one thing per hand in most situations, was largely unenforced. At least, that seemed to be my experience. Maybe I'm mixed up because I used to (r)emove further weapons/etc. from my backpack in 0.31.25 but don't bother doing so as often in 0.34.x? I thought I noticed some specific difference in what I was allowed to do in this area when I first started playing 0.34.01, but now I can't remember well enough to be certain. Can anyone else comment as to whether you really had to devote one hand to each item/weapon or else two hands to a two-handed one in 0.31.25 and whether you have to now?

[Anathema]

Unless the iron armor reduced the Dwarves' speed so much that the unarmored team was able to get in extra attacks.

Yeah I've seen this result occur before, it's typical of test subjects with no/low armor user skill - the armor often slows them down more than it's worth. A better test (although more annoying to set up) is to give all combatants good combat skills, it's more representative of how your ingame dwarves, whether it's fortress or adventure mode, are likely to perform.

[Gizogin]

What about 15 w/ 2H + shields vs 15 w/ 2H (no shields)?

[friendguy13]

What about 15 w/ 2H + shields vs 15 w/ 2H (no shields)?

Just finished the tests they are in the op.

Edit just finished testing scimitars.

[Shinotsa]

Just ran a quick group of tests of 15 on 15. Shields were wooden (mangrove I believe) to reduce speed decrease from weight. Featherwood would have been a better bet, but since there weren't many shield bashes in the logs and the weight is already pretty low I doubt that changing it would have made much of a difference anyway.

First test (No skill humans)
15 humans each with an iron two handed sword vs 15 humans each with an iron two handed sword and a shield.
Result: 12 survivors on the shieldless team.

Second test (Grandmaster fighter, dodger, swordsman and shield user for all combatants)
15 humans each with an iron two handed sword vs 15 humans each with an iron two handed sword and a shield
Result: 11 survivors on the shieldless team.

Even with a shield to block AND the skill to use it, it seems that there is no point to wielding multigrasp weapons with one hand

Edit: Reran the final test with featherwood shields and iron shields. Featherwood showed no change in results, iron ended with 14 shieldless, multigraspers alive.

[friendguy13]

Just ran a quick group of tests of 15 on 15. Shields were wooden (mangrove I believe) to reduce speed decrease from weight. Featherwood would have been a better bet, but since there weren't many shield bashes in the logs and the weight is already pretty low I doubt that changing it would have made much of a difference anyway.

First test (No skill humans)
15 humans each with an iron two handed sword vs 15 humans each with an iron two handed sword and a shield.
Result: 12 survivors on the shieldless team.

Second test (Grandmaster fighter, dodger, swordsman and shield user for all combatants)
15 humans each with an iron two handed sword vs 15 humans each with an iron two handed sword and a shield
Result: 11 survivors on the shieldless team.

Even with a shield to block AND the skill to use it, it seems that there is no point to wielding multigrasp weapons with one hand

Edit: Reran the final test with featherwood shields and iron shields. Featherwood showed no change in results, iron ended with 14 shieldless, multigraspers alive.

Thank you I have added your results.

[Naros]

PTW, 2handed weapon science is really bugging me :|

PTW?!?!?!?!1/?1/???!11?

Post to watch

You know you can just click Notify for this, right?

Also, to get somewhat reliable results, and to be properly science'ey, do every type of test 20 times. :9