Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 [2] 3

Author Topic: Were-fortress project  (Read 6487 times)

Helgoland

  • Bay Watcher
  • No man is an island.
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #15 on: July 16, 2012, 11:33:33 am »

The human forumite Helgoland gestures!
The forum thread shudders and begins to move!

AFAIK raised heads use a bite attack instead of the normal strike or whatever. Apart from undead head armies being better than headless undead armies, this should make spreading lycantrophy rather easy - if you can get your hands on a necromancer or evil biome as well as a werebeast:

1. Behead werebeast.
2. Animate head.
3. Let a dwarf fight the head. (Better use a medium-size one; too large and it will kill the dwarf, too small and the dwarf will kill it before being bitten.)
4. Rinse and repeat; then enjoy your army that once a month will completely heal and morph into some werebeast. (I wish it were a were-wren...)
Logged
The Bay12 postcard club
Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

Broseph Stalin

  • Bay Watcher
  • Dabbling Surgeon, Proficient Butcher.
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #16 on: July 16, 2012, 12:04:36 pm »

The human forumite Helgoland gestures!
The forum thread shudders and begins to move!

AFAIK raised heads use a bite attack instead of the normal strike or whatever. Apart from undead head armies being better than headless undead armies, this should make spreading lycantrophy rather easy - if you can get your hands on a necromancer or evil biome as well as a werebeast:

1. Behead werebeast.
2. Animate head.
3. Let a dwarf fight the head. (Better use a medium-size one; too large and it will kill the dwarf, too small and the dwarf will kill it before being bitten.)
4. Rinse and repeat; then enjoy your army that once a month will completely heal and morph into some werebeast. (I wish it were a were-wren...)
I thought toady removed undead werebeasts to avoid zombie cloning.

csebal

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #17 on: July 16, 2012, 12:42:10 pm »

My advice: keep those migrants comin'.
Really, I don't think there's any real way to infect dwarves besides having a were-creature rampaging through your fortress... And how would you get a were-animal in dwarf form to bite fellow dwarves, anyway? If drinking werewolf blood causes infection, it might be possible to create a "blood altar" or something in the same manner as the Fountain of Eternal Life - that would be your best bet, if possible. I've only seen one werewolf infection before, though, and that fort died...

Well, i got scared shitless the other day, when during my FIRST summer, a werebeast showed up on my doorstep. No military, only 7 dwarves, no defenses whatsoever.. I was like: well, this was a fast one.

Then the following things happened in short succession:

1) werebeast spots tame yak bull
2) werebeast attacks tame yak bull
3) tame yak bull runs
4) werebeast catches tame yak bull
5) short fight ensues in which the yak gets gutted and the werebeast is kicked a few times
6) werebeasts transforms back into a dwarf
7) runs off the map.

All this in about .. 15 seconds from its appearance and I'm like: what just happened?
Logged

Friendstrange

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #18 on: July 16, 2012, 02:42:51 pm »

To all atempting a full were-beast fort:
Keep a vampire locked up somewhere. When a dwarf becomes a were-beast he counts as "berzerk", so if all your dwarfs become were-beasts your fort will die as soon as the full moon hits.
Logged

Loud Whispers

  • Bay Watcher
  • They said we have to aim higher, so we dug deeper.
    • View Profile
    • I APPLAUD YOU SIRRAH
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #19 on: July 16, 2012, 03:30:09 pm »

When a dwarf becomes a were-beast he counts as "berzerk", so if all your dwarfs become were-beasts your fort will die as soon as the full moon hits.
It's not been tested yet though. What sounds good on paper self immolates in DF.

In answer to the old OP, send two untrained peasants in at a time to fight one were-creature. It's usually enough to allow one peasant to escape bitten. If not, just add more peasants. Works out quite well, with only an average 50% mortality rate.

Sabreur

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #20 on: July 16, 2012, 06:00:54 pm »

Works out quite well, with only an average 50% mortality rate.

I love this game so much sometimes.

Naros

  • Bay Watcher
  • [COVETS_SPOONS]
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #21 on: July 16, 2012, 08:28:28 pm »

PTWFA.

At the bottom of the page is a [NOTIFY] button. Click that, instead of spamming, please.
Logged

Rohain

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #22 on: July 16, 2012, 08:40:18 pm »

I did this with wereskinks and encountered one major problem.

The basic issue is the loyalty cascade.  Because the grabs and holds the werecreature establishes while mauling tend to continue beyond transformation they become an enemy of the fortress and are attacked while not transformed, causing a loyalty cascade.

If this could somehow be circumnavigated, you needn't worry about the fortress collapsing when only werecreatures survive, I had many months where all I had was a wereskink sitting around transformed without any problems. 

It also appears to be impossible to get the dwarves to bite without transforming, they definitely don't do it during sparring.

Logged

Broken

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #23 on: July 17, 2012, 07:39:49 am »

A bit of advice:

If you don't want to wait until you get a werebeast, search for lairs in adventure mode, then embark in them. That way you can have the
fortress infected since the begining, and you can choose the were-curse that you want.
Logged
Quote
In a hole in the ground there lived a dwarf. Not a nasty, dirty, wet hole, filled with the ends of worms and an oozy smell, nor yet a dry, bare, sandy hole with nothing in it to sit down on or to eat: it was a dwarf fortress, and that means magma.
Dwarf fortress: Tales of terror and inevitability

Sabreur

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #24 on: July 17, 2012, 09:47:06 am »

PTWFA.

At the bottom of the page is a [NOTIFY] button. Click that, instead of spamming, please.

In his defense, I think the Notify button notifies you via email.  That can get really annoying, especially if the topic updates frequently.  Simply posting in the thread gives you a nice summary of updated topics in the "Show new replies to your posts" section.

Helgoland

  • Bay Watcher
  • No man is an island.
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #25 on: July 17, 2012, 12:30:50 pm »

The basic issue is the loyalty cascade.  Because the grabs and holds the werecreature establishes while mauling tend to continue beyond transformation they become an enemy of the fortress and are attacked while not transformed, causing a loyalty cascade.

It also appears to be impossible to get the dwarves to bite without transforming, they definitely don't do it during sparring.
Really, the solution is zombie heads.

(Anyone gonna sig that? :D )
Logged
The Bay12 postcard club
Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

Friendstrange

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #26 on: July 17, 2012, 01:59:58 pm »

I did this with wereskinks and encountered one major problem.

The basic issue is the loyalty cascade.  Because the grabs and holds the werecreature establishes while mauling tend to continue beyond transformation they become an enemy of the fortress and are attacked while not transformed, causing a loyalty cascade.

If this could somehow be circumnavigated, you needn't worry about the fortress collapsing when only werecreatures survive, I had many months where all I had was a wereskink sitting around transformed without any problems. 

It also appears to be impossible to get the dwarves to bite without transforming, they definitely don't do it during sparring.
The solution is simple:
Q: What role entitles a dwarf to attack another dwarf without causing a loyalty cascade, even while untransformed?
A: The Sheriff/Captain of the Guard

Simply have no jails to place the criminals, dont give any weapons to your sheriff, ignore and defy every mandate and preferably have a reliable way to sever the sheriff´s hands and feet every so often so he can only use bite attacks. And either watch for the full moon or have an airtight way to drop criminals for a beating in a locked room where the sherrif is...and watch for the full moon.

Or you could just use an automated zombie werebeast: Have a werebeast in a cage, burrow dwarf next to cage, have militia on the next room, far a way enough to give the werebeast time to bite the dwarf. Link cage to lever and have a necromancer on an adjacent room with a bridge blocking his line of sight into the were-beast room, also linked to a lever. Then just resurrect as needed, or have everything on the surface of an evil biome if no necromancer is available, same result, less ability to control it.
Logged

Rohain

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #27 on: July 17, 2012, 02:34:29 pm »

I doubt a crippled sheriff would resort to biting for punishment.  I don't think he even will give punishments while he's that injured, or he'll just change it to jailtime.

I have't experimented with zombie werebeasts however, or even with captured werebeasts.  That seems like it would evade the loyalty cascade nicely, assuming you could disentangle them before the mauled dwarf dies.
Logged

Friendstrange

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #28 on: July 17, 2012, 03:18:19 pm »

I doubt a crippled sheriff would resort to biting for punishment.  I don't think he even will give punishments while he's that injured, or he'll just change it to jailtime.
When there is no jail (no restraint or cage set to be used by justice), every punishment defaults to "beating" which is basically the sherif punching, kicking, biting etc the "criminal" unless you give him a weapon.
Every creature´s default attack when they dont have limbs is biting, unless its a horeshoe crab, sponge, blob or simply dont have teeth in which case they will only "push".

A sheriff with severed hands and feet need only to stay a bit in the hospital to keep going, he will be slow and need a crutch but he will still be functional. Ive had my butcher get his leg and arm severed by a wild rutherer and still being able to carry stuff around and attack others.

The only problem here is having him survive the initial severing, having him heal up and finish beating someone before the full moon, every time. To be honest it would be best to simply have him carry around his business and let the RNG take care of making him bite, but always lock him up before the full moon.
Logged

Loud Whispers

  • Bay Watcher
  • They said we have to aim higher, so we dug deeper.
    • View Profile
    • I APPLAUD YOU SIRRAH
Re: Were-fortress project
« Reply #29 on: July 17, 2012, 03:49:12 pm »

I have't experimented with zombie werebeasts however, or even with captured werebeasts.  That seems like it would evade the loyalty cascade nicely, assuming you could disentangle them before the mauled dwarf dies.
1. Zombie werebeasts were removed - creatures that die in werebeast form transform back into their humanoid corpse selves come the waning moon :(
2. I've never had loyalty cascades with werebeasts before. I'm a bit bemused as to why a creature's grapple with a bodypart would continue onto a completely new one. Odd. Anyways, it's not a big problem. If a loyalty cascade were to occur, it'd be nothing you couldn't fix with a drowning lever.
Pages: 1 [2] 3