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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 3835564 times)

monk12

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10545 on: May 02, 2014, 08:15:20 pm »

Quote from: Devlog
Stopped prisoners from constantly agreeing to rescue each other.

Bug, or feature? Ignoring the fact it's obviously a bug or he wouldn't have fixed it

smjjames

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10546 on: May 02, 2014, 08:35:28 pm »

Quote from: Devlog
Stopped prisoners from constantly agreeing to rescue each other.

Bug, or feature? Ignoring the fact it's obviously a bug or he wouldn't have fixed it

I'm guessing bug because it sounds like they would repeatedly agree to rescue each other after it's already been agreed to once.
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Dirst

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10547 on: May 03, 2014, 01:34:46 am »

Quote from: devlog
Got rid of residual grass that provided stealth bonuses after being trampled.
This might not be a bug at all!  If elephants can sneak into fortresses, I imagine skulking little Kobolds can hide behind trampled grass :)

More seriously, it's amazing how Toady even notices these problems.
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Demonic Gophers

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10548 on: May 03, 2014, 01:43:50 am »

Quote
Fewer logs hanging in the air, though they can still get stuck in trees which is a little odd but maybe not a deal-breaker.
From what I've seen, big chunks of branch getting stuck in nearby trees is entirely realistic.
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smjjames

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10549 on: May 03, 2014, 02:11:35 am »

Quote from: devlog
Got rid of residual grass that provided stealth bonuses after being trampled.
This might not be a bug at all!  If elephants can sneak into fortresses, I imagine skulking little Kobolds can hide behind trampled grass :)

More seriously, it's amazing how Toady even notices these problems.

Well, he has devtools that let him see data that would otherwise be hidden. That and he has mentioned doing a lot of testing on the new mechanics under various environmental variables. In fact, the need to test under specific variables that he would have to hunt around for is what led to the arena getting the upgrade.
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Authority2

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10550 on: May 03, 2014, 02:40:02 am »

Quote from: Devlog
Stopped prisoners from constantly agreeing to rescue each other.

Bug, or feature? Ignoring the fact it's obviously a bug or he wouldn't have fixed it

I'm guessing bug because it sounds like they would repeatedly agree to rescue each other after it's already been agreed to once.
This bug sounds oddly sweet. Like, imagine two prisoners in the same cell, and every time it gets really bad they comfort each other by talking about how they'll rescue the other one on the day they finally escape, and all the things they'll do once they're free.
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PeridexisErrant

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10551 on: May 03, 2014, 04:06:45 am »

Quote from: Devlog
Stopped prisoners from constantly agreeing to rescue each other.

Bug, or feature? Ignoring the fact it's obviously a bug or he wouldn't have fixed it

I'm guessing bug because it sounds like they would repeatedly agree to rescue each other after it's already been agreed to once.
This bug sounds oddly sweet. Like, imagine two prisoners in the same cell, and every time it gets really bad they comfort each other by talking about how they'll rescue the other one on the day they finally escape, and all the things they'll do once they're free.

To me, it's not so much sweet as depressing revealing as to how desperate the prisoners must be, to resort to a ritual of comfort...

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The next night his brother's ghost appears - what is this dagger I see before me / it's handle carved from my hand? - and, slaying the elder, unites them in freedom at last. Both prisoners have kept their promises, and the ghosts rest.
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reality.auditor

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10552 on: May 03, 2014, 04:46:46 am »

So far it looks like bugfixing of new bugs... :( Pray to Armok moar.
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Manveru Taurënér

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10553 on: May 03, 2014, 04:54:00 am »

So far it looks like bugfixing of new bugs... :( Pray to Armok moar.

There won't be any old bugs fixed before release other than as a side effect of other fixes at best. Old bugs are tackled in one of the shorter releases following after.

(a good deal of old bugs have been fixed already by changed and updated mechanics coming with the release though)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2014, 04:55:40 am by Manveru Taurënér »
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Knight Otu

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10554 on: May 03, 2014, 05:02:33 am »

So far it looks like bugfixing of new bugs... :( Pray to Armok moar.
Manveru beat me to it, but well, yeah, that's how Toady works - first he tries to fix as many bugs he introduced as he can, then he releases, then there'll be releases to fix other new bugs, then he adds fixes for old bugs into those releases, then adds minor new features, and finally he moves on to major new features that he hopes won't take another year again, then he likely lets features creep in that may be somewhere between fully required and completely unrelated (depending on your viewpoint). Any fixes right now of old bugs are incidental.
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WordsandChaos

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10555 on: May 03, 2014, 06:36:24 am »

Prisoners agreeing to rescue each other repeatedly... That mental image.

"You're imprisoned!"
"So are you!"
"I'm going to save you!"
"No, I'll save you!"
"That's fine. I'm going to save you, too!"
"Great, I'll save you, and then you can save me! Or do you want to go first?"
"I don't mind really. Just as long as I get to save you. After you!"
"No, after you!"
"I insist, I I'll go second in the saving."
"I'm flattered, but I couldn't possibly impose on you like that! I'll save you after you save me..."

Jheral

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10556 on: May 03, 2014, 07:56:29 am »

Could be that they're roleplaying saving each other to pass the time...  ;)
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Rapozk

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10557 on: May 03, 2014, 07:56:46 am »

They say (I'm citing every military institution without evidence, yes) that no amount of training can ever prepare one's mind for warfare. It would seem silly for dwarves to be any different.

I'd expect it to be a separate trait from "getting used to tragedy." That's not being courageous or accepting and ignoring danger, just being apathetic to loss.

Well, do not for forget that, in the real world, stationing your cowardly soldiers in a drowning chamber, is not considered training. In Dwarf Fortress it is!
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Parisbre56

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10558 on: May 03, 2014, 08:11:34 am »

Yeah, you could have them stand in adjacent rooms separated by a glass window barrier with orders to attack and have your soldiers watch safely hidden behind the barrier as your useless cheesemaker migrants get slaughtered by a Dragon. Maybe use a pressure plate linked to two doors leading to a trapped hallway so that they can path to the Dragon but can never reach it.

EDIT: Probably not a Dragon now that I think about it, since they're building destroyers.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2014, 08:24:00 am by Parisbre56 »
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Kumis

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #10559 on: May 03, 2014, 03:01:47 pm »

This question is a little removed from the current line of conversation, and relates to possible economy developments in the future:

Critters already have preferences and levels of happiness and now you’ve added aspirations, but have you considered in the future giving them utility functions for goods that they possess?

The main advantages I can see to this are:
1. A logical level of hoarding – instead of merely collecting all the socks, maybe they’d see how many socks they have and would rather trade some in for a tunic (setting marginal utility equal and all that), and
2. It can serve as a foundation for a wider economy – rather than having to invent demand curves, and thus prices, for certain goods, the prices of those goods are determined by how many critters actually want them (and to what extent) in the wider world.

The main disadvantage I can see is that, unless abstracted, point 2 would lead to us all having to run super computers.

Or in any case, have you got any plans at the moment for future economic developments?
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