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Author Topic: Forces, Radiation, and Other Invisble Controls  (Read 848 times)

Nimbby

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Forces, Radiation, and Other Invisble Controls
« on: January 18, 2012, 08:30:26 pm »

Okay, this suggestion is rather complicated, and I will try to explain it to the best of my ability, please note that I am not a modder or coder, nor physicist or engineer, a meager writer and avid dreamer. The basic premise of this idea is that you may have procedurally generated forces of radiation, such as any wave that we as humans can observe, such waves or forces affect the fundamental or produced effects of any given interaction. Now I am not saying that we should procedurally generate the entirety of physical laws in ever single world created, but what I am suggesting, is that various forces, with various degrees of effect and affect-ability, should be generated. Now that the basic premise is laid down, permit me to elaborate.

Effects of Forces


The forces that are generated should have various ways they can affect the properties of objects, such as raising temperature, adding momentum, increasing density, ignition points, physical appearance, etc. and depending on the force, it may have a varying degree of effect on the property it affects, based on any number of secondary variables, such as magnitude. The forces, if it should be that they are slightly more complicated, may also affect the functions of intelligent beings, in any sort of manner.

It may also be that the forces have a direct control over the way interactions work, and not necessarily just be a active or passive influence on them.

Affecting the Forces


Just like radiation can both be affected and have an effect, generated forces would work in a similar way, forces that determine the way something works or influence it may be affected by doing so, or may be in some ways more dense in points of disturbance, similar to a gas. Worldly forces may also be able to manipulate the forces, and actions such as burning would emit the force for heat in appropriate quantities, or cooling might reduce it, some forces may be able to be produced or manipulated through artificial processes too. Such a force, that could be artificially affected, might be able to be manipulated by an intelligent race to produce a desired effect.

Implementation

Now this is the tricky part, since the forces would be rather boring if they couldn't be controlled, or if not boring, slightly less obvious. Since we don't have people running around with complete control over heat and IR radiation, it can't be completely controllable either. However, the beings that it may seem proper to possess the knowledge and skill required to manipulate such forces would be the Gods, and maybe Titans, FB's, and Clowns. Now, the Gods don't currently exist in the DF world as we know it, at least not to any major extent, so, unless the Gods are walking the Earth, we wouldn't see manipulation anyways. So, and the following statement is even more of an opinion than this suggestion has been, perhaps the Gods can either A. Exist in the real world, and have some interest besides what is described and may be described here, or B. We have the manipulation process being handed down in the form of secrets, but that is bordering on a magic suggestion, or C. Various creatures and beings that may not be playable possess the secrets, but they are rarely passed on, or even any combination of the above or something completely different. So perhaps it could be left at forces existing, or go in to fleshing out a fantastical but logical universe, but thank you for reading and maybe considering or scorning my suggestion.
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knutor

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Re: Forces, Radiation, and Other Invisble Controls
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2012, 12:59:30 am »

This is fantasy, why not just refer to your forces as Magic? 
Radiation as Miasma of a different flavor.
Invisible controls as world generation parameters.

I'm all for this suggestion, I like its streamlined logic.  In Discworld the color of magic is Octorine.  Its always Octorine.  Maybe we could have a random name for the Magic in DF, to keep it unique, and keep it a variable parameter.  I hope its certainly not a fixed parameter, as I hope one day to see a visiting enemy human wizard blast holes in my fortress the size of barns.  But certainly not consistantly the size of barns, in some embarks, maybe just have hedge wizards, instead of full blown battle wizards.

I know this sound more fantasized than your suggestion, but I can't help but interpret it all as Magic, in hindsight. 

Although, I guesss maybe the force could be gravity, however, I would certainly not want magma floating through the air to the surface, sizzling all my little dorfs.  Some control would need to be in place to control these forces.  I'm all for adding them, into the world generation, but I would hesitate to add these invisible controls into the game as it were.  It would be cool tho, to see a floating mountain or two, but unless we could fly, it wouldn't prove playable.

As for the effects of these forces, I whole heartedly agree to additions being made.  To definitely adding vectors and magnitudes into the game in some way, specifically in siege weapon accuracy and the ammo choices.  To me, the siege weapons in this game are a major distraction when it comes to gravity interpretations and simulations. 

I really wouldn't want the temperature to change much from the current advanced world generation parameters, however.  Have you dabbled at all with various advanced world generation options, yet?  There is a pretty clear cut way to increase the temperature of a world, both in a fixed way and a variable way, in there.  Even a trendy way, if you prefer the block schemes, 2x2 or 4x4 or 6x6, etc..

Sincerely,
Knutor
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Nimbby

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Re: Forces, Radiation, and Other Invisble Controls
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2012, 12:57:25 am »

I get what you are saying about the magic bit, since that is kind of what is, although I don't really want to come out and say we shoul have spells without providing some sort of logic and abstraction behind it, in all reality, passive forces for things like gravity should be more hardcoded, but if you have a sort of fabric type force that can influence gravity if applied correctly, that could be interesting. I have played with the tempature settings, but I was thinking more ways that heat could be influenced by various processes or regional anomalies. So the forces aren't quite as much to simulate the physical laws of each world, but more to add dynamic interest to them, hopefully in a way that could make each experience with DF fun and unique, without all objects being repelled from one another without good discernible and controllable reason.
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knutor

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Re: Forces, Radiation, and Other Invisble Controls
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2012, 02:37:27 pm »

So the forces aren't quite as much to simulate the physical laws of each world, but more to add dynamic interest to them, hopefully in a way that could make each experience with DF fun and unique, without all objects being repelled from one another without good discernible and controllable reason.

Like a bubbling hot murky pool, instead of always getting bleh.. murky pools, which I guess are always lukewarm? 

Or like getting isolated cloudcover, dropping which drops lethal ice blocks, instead of rain/snow?  Yeah, that type of force would be interesting and provide a smörgåsbord of physical simulations. 

I'm hoping better air patterns and sky cloud details are included in future versions, myself.  Theres so much empty space up there.  The occasional bluejay up in there, leaves a lot to the imagination of what could be passing overhead.

Maybe when scales for large and giant monsters get put in, they can also alter and manipulate their surroundings in a ripple fashion from where they stand. 

One force that would be and should be included in DF is earthquakes.  Or atleast ripples, from large beings footsteps.  And when your a dwarf, I would imagine more things fall into the catagory of 'large'. I would think a dwarf hunter or someone skilled in scouting should be able to listen for the marching hooves.. similar to but not exactly like Legolas. 

Lord forbid a dwarf imitate an elf!  Oh the horrors.

Sincerely,
Knutor
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Drago55577

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Re: Forces, Radiation, and Other Invisble Controls
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2012, 08:54:13 pm »

Auras that can radiate from strange creatures that are unique? or special properties of an area that affect some creatures but not all. You see a strange ripple in the air ahead You have been struck down.   Maybe aread that affect physical and mental attributes, or magic when thats implemented, anything like this would make DF very fun
 
 
(if the writing is a bit messed up, i used the view toggle thing so i dont know :o.)
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