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[dakenho]

I had a reasonably successful fortress,  5 million in created goods, over 100 gold barrels, bins, chests, door (100 each!).  the local rinocoress population provided ample food, (my legendary cook made 600 meals in a single season some valued over 100,000) ample alcohol.  3 full contingents of military dwarfs out fitted as such
steel helm
steel caps x2
steel breastplates
steel mail shirts x3
steal gauntlets
steal greaves
steal high boots
steal shields
steal axes/spears (one division of 10 axe dwarfs, one division of 10 spear dwarfs), the dwarfs were trained to legendary pump operators (and some were even high master or legendary wood cutters).  there skill was modest but they managed to slaughter a cyclops with no casualties, and wipe out my first siege while only losing one of the new recruits.  then my second siege came.

I stationed my dwarfs at the choke point entrance of my fortress, the goblin axe men came, there trolls kicking in my gold doors in my dwarfs charged,  4 or 5 injuried, no deaths, 20 goblins killed goblin legs, hands and feet and equipment strung out at the entrance to my fortress now covered in blood.  I think "whew that was close", the last goblin is routed, wait it still says siege, crap there must be another division, well this sucks my military power is almost halved, , and I am not making this up latterly 2 more full pages of nothing bot goblin bowmen and cross bow men.  My dwarfs fought valiantly, even getting or two of the buggers, but the rest were mercilessly shot down.

what could I have done?   I had a choke, to limit the range my dwarfs could be shot at I had 2 full contingents of dwarfs in full steel armor made by a legendary armor smith.  weapons made by legendary weapon smith, and 3rd contingent almost ready but still waiting on gym training to finish.  heck i even ordered my army to go about and kill the local wild life to improve there skills at a faster rate than training would allow, not to mention most of my dwarfs got to competent level just form fighting the colossus.

[MonkeyHead]

Without high skill in dodging or shield user, are you that suprised that they were used for target practice? Utilize crossbows of your own to achieve the same goals. Causing enemy crossbow users to path past a kill-zone with your own bowusers behind fortifications will take care of the issue.

[Monkeyfacedprickleback]

You need marksdwarves behind Fortifications.
Or you could charge them with your soldiers.
Or you could send a single useless recruit outside with three dozen wardogs assigned to him. The gobbo's would run out of ammo eventually.


Not much to do beyond that, other then waiting them out.

[rephikul]

Code: [Select]

G     G     G       DDDDD
   G     G     G <- DDDDD
G     G     G       DDDDD

G     G     G DDD
   G     G    DGD
G     G     G DDD
Let's analyze the situation.
Your melee dwarves all stack on each other to surround and fight the front line mark goblin(s). This mean they turn their back toward the other goblins, making their shields useless and/or crouch which reduce their speed to 1/3. Mean while ammos in vanilla are notorious for their ability to penetrate armors. The goblins have free shots (no shield so it's effectively 166% hit rate) and speed advantage (let's say half are crouched so they are 50% faster on average), creating overwhelming advantage over your melee force (250% combat efficiency not counting equipment). No wonder they win.

[Loud Whispers]

Only 20 military dorfs?

Dude, I use at least 90 soldiers, on the first year. The worst archer goblin siege I've gotten so far resulted in 6 deaths, the goblins were all killed. 1/9th of that army were using ranged weapons. They were all poorly armoured and equipped.

So, either Dwarf rush, or marksdwarf bunkers, your pick

[Poindexterity]

20 aint too few if ya use em right. i try to stick with about 30-40 myself, but ive made due with as few as 6 before, so whatever.
against archers, what i do is quite simple. i dig an entrance to the fort that has a 180 degree bend in it at some point. i station my dwarves just around the bend, so they dont see the enemy and the enemy doesnt see them until they're a step or 2 out of melee range. things usually go quite quickly from there.

[timotheos]

Make your fort entrance nice and twisty and place you melee dwarfs round the last corner so they are out of the line of site. Stick some weapon traps in there to thin them out a bit first too.
I had 8 dwarfs take out a 40 gobo siege this way. Even though my traps got jammed by the first wave of trolls. I may have danger roomed up the dwarfs first but they where also only wearing copper.

[dakenho]

Code: [Select]

G     G     G       DDDDD
   G     G     G <- DDDDD
G     G     G       DDDDD

G     G     G DDD
   G     G    DGD
G     G     G DDD
Let's analyze the situation.
Your melee dwarves all stack on each other to surround and fight the front line mark goblin(s). This mean they turn their back toward the other goblins, making their shields useless and/or crouch which reduce their speed to 1/3. Mean while ammos in vanilla are notorious for their ability to penetrate armors. The goblins have free shots (no shield so it's effectively 166% hit rate) and speed advantage (let's say half are crouched so they are 50% faster on average), creating overwhelming advantage over your melee force (250% combat efficiency not counting equipment). No wonder they win.

all melee goblins rushed ahead and got monkey slapped by my military.  there were no mellee goblins left when my dwarfs tried to attack the archers.

[dakenho]

20 aint too few if ya use em right. i try to stick with about 30-40 myself, but ive made due with as few as 6 before, so whatever.
against archers, what i do is quite simple. i dig an entrance to the fort that has a 180 degree bend in it at some point. i station my dwarves just around the bend, so they dont see the enemy and the enemy doesnt see them until they're a step or 2 out of melee range. things usually go quite quickly from there.

a good idea, I have been constructing a main chamber in the front of my fort for sieges to have to occur, which seems to have worked for the melee, I will try the hall way with the 180 degree bend, my only fear with that is the dwarfs will run out to kill a melleer and die to archers

[Loud Whispers]

They will if they see them, so use tank-trap like constructs or something to restrict view. Or station them near the wall.

[MonkeyHead]

Making a chequerboard type construct of walls works well, so there is no clear line of sight more than one tile in any given direction... they cant shoot what they cant see.

[Loud Whispers]

Making a chequerboard type construct of walls works well, so there is no clear line of sight more than one tile in any given direction... they cant shoot what they cant see.

Beware of "slamming into obstacle" spam.

[MonkeyHead]

Cos thats a bad thing?

[Loud Whispers]

Cos thats a bad thing?

If your Dwarves do it, fall down and get curb stomped, yes.

[MonkeyHead]

Well, the point of it would be to get marksdwarves into melee combat, and very little else. Slashing attack of a bow will 99% of the time be defelcted by any half decent armour.