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[Zangi]

Weird new silence enforcement gun.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/technology-blog/weird-gun-future-attacks-words-not-people-193050045.html

Great powers of trolling has been introduced to the masses.... 

Also, I can bet places that oppress free speech like China (and, hurr durr, the American police force) will be one of the first customers to field test the tar out of these fancy new guns.

[Mr. Palau]

Hey just on the subject of Danielle Maudsley, from everything I gather she really was just suspected, either they didn't continue with the prosecution afterward (as in after she was brain dead) or she really didn't do anything. I personally think that the police man made the right decision, because we have to trust them to do what they believe is right at the moment. His only other option would have been to tackle her or let her run into the highway. She weighed 100 pounds and he weighed around 270 so I think the kinetic force of that impact on concrete would have been much worse to both of them than the kinetic force of her body hitting the concrete because of the Taser impact. Of course there is the possibility of him tackling her in such a way as to attempt to divert force from her head, but I doubt he would have been able to consider that given the time he had to make his decision. His decision was likely one of the better choices; although perhaps not the best depending on the angles he could have tackled her from and other random things. He only had so long to make his decision though so I don't think this is a huge issue, he did what he believed would do the least damage and couldn't possibly have considered all the implication of his actions. I doubt he remembered the regulations on Tasing an individual, and even if he had remembered she probably would have ended up running into the highway and dying.

There are concerns with Taser use as police are likely to use a Taser in some situations when they would not use a gun, and thereby use excessive force. This is likely one of those situations. You could say that this was a choice between two ways of dying. Head bashed in on the concrete, or torso sheared off in the grill of a passing car. I think she would have continued running into the highway, this is disputable because a normal individual would not, but she clearly was quite high.

[Bauglir]

I can accept arguments that using a taser was actually the safest course of action (for the suspect) given the particular circumstances, or at the least I am not qualified to argue against them. So yeah, maybe it was. If so, damn, it sucks that it turned out that way. I just take issue with arguments that suggest that it's okay to make things worse for suspects (who, let me emphasize, are still suspects, and have not, in fact, been tried, convicted, and sentenced) to make things safer for officers, or, worse, more convenient for them. There's some qualification; if it's an extremely lopsided balance where you'll save hundreds of officers and accidentally kill one or two suspects, fine, that's debatable. The convenience thing, though, really isn't. The difficulty of the job is part of the selection bias that is supposed to ensure that only people who genuinely care about the community sign up.

Anyway, in more general terms for this thread... I know it's Cracked, but it's one of those not-actually-silly articles they occasionally write. It seems pretty relevant to current developments with the whole 99% stuff.

[DJ]

If she was tackled rather than tazed she wouldn't have been paralysed and thus would've most likely broken her fall with her hands, saving her head.

[Criptfeind]

If she was tackled rather than tazed she would have had another 300 pounds on her and thus snapped her neck.

[Luke_Prowler]

If the officer had, and I know this might sound crazy, reached out his arm the less than a foot distance between him and her to grab her by the shirt collar, we wouldn't be having this coversation

[DJ]

If he was an extraordinarily bad tackler. I've tackled people half my size lots of times with no injuries to either party. Not on concrete, granted, but still, not even bruises. And cops are supposed to be trained how to tackle people without killing them.

[Frumple]

If she had just been caught instead of any of that, there probably wouldn't have been a problem. Love a'Zeus, I've restrained hundred people people with absolutely zero physical training, almost a hundred pounds less weight than that guy, and the arms of a stick thing. Can spin a lot of things at me, but telling me that a trained and vetted police officer couldn't do the same or better...?

Looking at the video again, the policeman wasn't even trying to catch her, not even attempting to restrain, just kind of half-jogging and then -zap-. He was probably in the right legally, but someone either in that bad of shape or that unwilling to exert themselves should not have been in a police uniform, and because of that, we've got someone most likely braindead.

It's pretty hard to excuse that, yanno'? Either the officer or whoever hired him or let him stay hired needs to lose a badge and a job.

E:Thrust of statement ninja'd by luke. Meh.

[SalmonGod]

Yup... that's what I've been trying to say.  The guy clearly didn't try very hard to handle the situation responsibly.  He could have reached out to try and grab her arm.  She was still in arm's reach when he tased her.  Tackling wasn't necessary.  The guy is way too fucking out of shape to be a police officer whose job performance is directly related to his capability to chase and physically restrain people without harming them.

And above all, it is their fucking incompetence that allowed her to make a break for the door in the first place.  I mean seriously... was the front door of the building not even fucking closed???  Did everyone really just turn their backs and give this panicked/drug-influenced girl a straight shot through an open door?  That shit is their fucking fault and they should be held responsible.

[sneakey pete]

By that logic you could also argue its the persons fault for getting under the influence of drugs and getting caught in the first place by the way.

edit: Not that you're denying that.

[SalmonGod]

By that logic you could also argue its the persons fault for getting under the influence of drugs and getting caught in the first place by the way.

edit: Not that you're denying that.

It probably is, but it's possible that it isn't.  Now we'll probably never know.

Possible scenario:  She found herself in a vulnerable situation with a date rapist who slipped something into her drink.  When she started feeling the effects, she realized what was going on and escaped, hitting a couple parked cars along the way.  Bystander or even the attempted rapist himself calls the police to report a hit & run.  After police get her to the substation in her emotional and drugged state, she succumbs to a moment of panick, and you know the rest.

Suspects are supposed to be presumed innocent until proven guilty via proper legal processes, and it is an officer's job to put their own safety on the line to protect innocents.  In this situation, the officer either didn't care to do his job or failed at doing his job, and I think to defend him is to abandon a proper perspective on the role their supposed to play in society, which is something I see happening far too frequently these days.

[MadocComadrin]

it is an officer's job to put their own safety on the line to protect innocents

To nitpick here, the courts have upheld more than once that the role of the police is to protect society as a whole, not individuals. Likewise, they are allowed to arrest (with a warrant, if required) under probable cause and allowed to stop people under reasonable suspicion. Innocent until proven guilty matters more when it reaches the courts.

[lemon10]

By that logic you could also argue its the persons fault for getting under the influence of drugs and getting caught in the first place by the way.

edit: Not that you're denying that.

It probably is, but it's possible that it isn't.  Now we'll probably never know.

Possible scenario:  She found herself in a vulnerable situation with a date rapist who slipped something into her drink.  When she started feeling the effects, she realized what was going on and escaped, hitting a couple parked cars along the way.  Bystander or even the attempted rapist himself calls the police to report a hit & run.  After police get her to the substation in her emotional and drugged state, she succumbs to a moment of panick, and you know the rest.

Suspects are supposed to be presumed innocent until proven guilty via proper legal processes, and it is an officer's job to put their own safety on the line to protect innocents.  In this situation, the officer either didn't care to do his job or failed at doing his job, and I think to defend him is to abandon a proper perspective on the role their supposed to play in society, which is something I see happening far too frequently these days.

Your possible scenario is completely BS, do you actually believe that has even a 0.001% chance of being true?
She wasn't a innocent though, she was a suspect, which is different, and trying to say they are the same thing is just flat wrong.

[kaijyuu]

She wasn't a innocent though, she was a suspect, which is different, and trying to say they are the same thing is just flat wrong.

...

......



Here's the sole difference: One you assume innocent until proven guilty, the other you know is innocent.
Whatever precautions you take due to suspicion are just that: precautions. Any potentially harmful action a police officer takes should always be reactionary: they don't point a gun at someone until they appear threatening, for example.

I'm staying out of the whole tazer thingy due to ignorance about procedure/etc. But a police officer's duty is "serve and protect." That includes serving and protecting suspects and even guilty individuals.

[SalmonGod]

Right.  So if it's culturally and legally acceptable for police to treat anyone who is merely accused of a crime as a criminal who doesn't deserve basic human respect or attention, then I am correct in seeing every non-casual encounter with an officer as potentially life-threatening.

Your possible scenario is completely BS, do you actually believe that has even a 0.001% chance of being true?

You're lucky Vector's not around anymore.