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[krenshala]

So, has anyone actually achieved a dead dwarven civilization in Fort mode with the latest version of DF?  I've been generating world after world attempting to find one where I don't get more than the first years worth of migrants, but I always get a caravan, and always get migrants.

I've heard (and read in the wiki) about the fact that the first two migrant waves are automagically generated.  So I expect I'll always receive them, however, I haven't seen any consistent data on what exactly I should expect to (not) see to know I have selected a dead civ (and thus won't get migrants after the first year).

With my latest fortress I picked a civ that was destroyed in the year 168, and I embarked in 551, but I still got two caravans and six migrant waves before I accidentally the entire fort (stupid mistake with water pressure).

So, what am I missing?  Why can't I get a civ that doesn't send me migrants?

[IcarusOne]

If i remember correctly, whatever you do, you will always get those first two immigrant waves.
Except well, if there is no ground for them to walk to you in the first place, or it happens to be flooded (with magma?)

[krenshala]

But the problem is I keep getting additional (third, fourth, eightteenth) migrant waves.  What do I need to do/find in order to ONLY get those first two waves of immigrants?

[GreatWyrmGold]

But the problem is I keep getting additional (third, fourth, eightteenth) migrant waves.  What do I need to do/find in order to ONLY get those first two waves of immigrants?

I have had success by removing caverns, but don't play any one fort for long, so...??

[krenshala]

But the problem is I keep getting additional (third, fourth, eightteenth) migrant waves.  What do I need to do/find in order to ONLY get those first two waves of immigrants?

I have had success by removing caverns, but don't play any one fort for long, so...??

how does removing the caverns remove migrant waves?

[GreatWyrmGold]

But the problem is I keep getting additional (third, fourth, eightteenth) migrant waves.  What do I need to do/find in order to ONLY get those first two waves of immigrants?

I have had success by removing caverns, but don't play any one fort for long, so...??

how does removing the caverns remove migrant waves?

The same way not adding kobold farms removes kobolds: Unable to farm, they cannot get food and so starve, and so the civ dies.

[krenshala]

So, how do you know when you have a dead civilization?  With 0.31.25 I keep getting dwarves even when legends says the last city of the civ was destroyed more than 500 years previously.  I've also genned a world (small, 2 civs) in which all the dwarven civs failed to show the statue symbol on the embark map, yet I continued to get migrants, even after four years (that one I didn't check legends to see whether both civs had their cities were destroyed, however).

[GreatWyrmGold]

So, how do you know when you have a dead civilization?  With 0.31.25 I keep getting dwarves even when legends says the last city of the civ was destroyed more than 500 years previously.  I've also genned a world (small, 2 civs) in which all the dwarven civs failed to show the statue symbol on the embark map, yet I continued to get migrants, even after four years (that one I didn't check legends to see whether both civs had their cities were destroyed, however).

'c'. If there are no dwarves civs listed, your civ is dead.
...What if there are multiple dwarf civs with access to the site, but yours is dead?

[Agent_86]

You don't have to have a dead civ to get no migrants.  Just set your population cap to 0, you'll get no more migrants after the first two hard-coded ones.

[krenshala]

You don't have to have a dead civ to get no migrants.  Just set your population cap to 0, you'll get no more migrants after the first two hard-coded ones.

But by setting your pop cap to zero you also get no births, meaning your fortress will never grow.  I would like to play a fort that isn't on a tiny island cut off from the rest of the world, and yet does not receive more than the first (automatic, no matter what) migrants.  I'm trying to find out what I need to be looking for to identify such a scenario.

As for checking the 'c'ivilization screen, I've done that, and my selected civ showed "there are no significant people" (or whatever the message is), but I still receive migrants season after season.  I know I've read posts from folks that have run forts where they only received the summer and autumn of year xxx1 migrant waves, but all of those have been on older version of the game.  I have not been able to have that happen and am trying to find out what I'm doing "wrong".

[Agent_86]

No, population cap only effects migrants.  There's a separate variable for the amount of babies and children in your fort.

[clockwork]

No, population cap only effects migrants.  There's a separate variable for the amount of babies and children in your fort.

Yup

[krenshala]

in .25, it would seem you are UNABLE to play fort mode if all dwarven civs are dead. I tried, and it said I couldn't play as them

Hmm ... that makes it sound like playing a Dead Civ game is no longer possible, and would explain why I keep getting migrant waves no matter what.

As for the pop limit, I thought dwarves wouldn't have babies if the pop cap had already been exceeded?

[Agent_86]

As for the pop limit, I thought dwarves wouldn't have babies if the pop cap had already been exceeded?

Nope.  I currently have a fort with pop cap set to 100.  I got migration waves to 105 dwarves, then they stopped.  I currently have 112 dwarves, and tons of children running around.

[Girlinhat]

Children use a different cap than adults.  That's why there's two entries for it in the init.

Try making your dwarves something like [SIZE:1] during worldgen, and then reverting to normal once the world is generated.  They'll get slaughtered by crundles and weigh less than a bracelet, making any war instantly fatal.  This should rather effectively remove them from the game.  For added thoroughness, temporarily make them unable to speak, which makes them an enemy of every civ.