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Author Topic: CJ's personal project, "The Color of War is Gray" OR "Pretentiousness Incarnate"  (Read 4259 times)

CJ1145

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So yeah, I'm writing a sci-fi story. There's a whole ton of background I've got set up, but I don't have time to write it right now, so I'll just leave the first two chapters (a combined total of 4500 words  :o ) and go. Any criticism, comments, or praise would be appreciated.

Spoiler: Chapter 1 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Chapter 2 (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: May 07, 2011, 12:14:04 am by CJ1145 »
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Vector

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2011, 01:01:01 pm »

I think you need a better hook.  Basically, if the first sentence is just "Space," I'm not going to read it.  Not because I dislike science fiction, but because that simple idea of "Ooh, space" doesn't grab me anymore.

As they say, the closer you get the problem to the first sentence, the more your reader has to be interested in.
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Supermikhail

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2011, 02:16:18 pm »

Well, that about "Space ooh" was bullshit. I went away from the forums for some time, read some good literature, or literature that no one begs you to criticise, or literature with more than a thousands words to read... and had some good night's sleep, and took up an exercise schedule. I want to say that stuff reads much clearer these days. And at least the first paragraph is readable.

If you allow for a brief digression, the longer I give feedback, the more difficult it becomes to define what characterizes good literature. You know, I used to go to all those writing blogs - yep, they give sound advice - advice that'll help you to sell your story. But does the quality of being sold make your story good? I mean the general public will suck on anything that's big and shiny...

On that profound note, I'd like to ask the author, what motivated him to write this story? Does he hope to give anything? Or to get? What's the goal? I liked the first paragraph, then I started slipping away. I'd call it, you take too much for granted. Namely, for me the Guild was a pretty vague entity, and all that stuff happening or being described in the second paragraph touched upon too lightly to be comprehensible, too quickly to involve. Yeah, and you probably should get rid of "a very grim joke" - it's words which don't really mean anything without context, which comes afterwards... I guess I'll remember some blog advice - each word should have it's place and meaning, and reason, and something...

I'll skim. You should put quotation marks around all dialogue, including "Do you think it might be Lucius?" Confusing.

A few logic slips. First, I think you meant "a knife was slipped between his ribs, and he was dead in minutes". Or maybe without "and he was..." at all. Technically, we can guess how it concluded.

I didn't understand why there's all that bullshit with cloning. If there was a woman that was ready to bear a child to Albus Amagai, why couldn't they do it naturally? I didn't read Ch.2, did soul of the father get transfered into the son? Otherwise, brains can't be cloned. And anyway, that adamantium and the Arrakis worm are kind of too obvious "hommages". So far they don't achieve anything except for the geek value and sounding silly.

Well, in general, with rought spots, the writing comes out as decent "teenage novel" kind. That's definitely for a certain demographic. And the demographic is around this forum. I don't get it.

Oh. Also. Spellcheck is your friend, and you may want to check out this nifty tool (which was introduced to me on this very forum by either user Fishbreath or Willfor, or somebody else with a similar two-syllable name, anyway).

If I call this good writing, I know I'm going to be called on it. But it's regular teenage writing. With pretty rich language, I think, or at least fancy.

Now, to actually make some use of my feedback, the thing you want to do is to completely ignore it and keep on trucking. I see where you're at, and pretty much nothing will do you much good here other than practice. I said my piece.
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CJ1145

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2011, 03:42:46 pm »

I think you need a better hook.  Basically, if the first sentence is just "Space," I'm not going to read it.  Not because I dislike science fiction, but because that simple idea of "Ooh, space" doesn't grab me anymore.

As they say, the closer you get the problem to the first sentence, the more your reader has to be interested in.

I had trouble thinking of quite what to start it off with. I wanted to make it clear from the beginning that the galaxy was divided, but also that paragraph was something of a vehicle to introduce the first major faction, and introduce a color theme. The color of red, like blood was important to the Guild, as it's a hereditary organization, but also of rust, to symbolize that it is an ineffective and crumbling system, thus the need for change. If you have any better ideas I'm open to them, that's why I posted this here.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Wow. Lot of stuff to cover here. It's reasonable stuff and I understand where you're coming from, but I'd like to at least make my intentions clear on the muddier areas.

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On that profound note, I'd like to ask the author, what motivated him to write this story? Does he hope to give anything? Or to get? What's the goal?
I guess, to tell a story? Ever since I was about 12 I've had this basic idea in my head for a story, about an intergalactic war. I never finished it entirely, because I'd read it through and see how juvenile it was, and start from scratch. But more recently, I've wondered, how did that war start? This story is something of a prologue to the story I really want to tell, a set-piece, meant to explain the world the war takes place in over the course of a novel. So, I guess it's something of an experiment as well, a story meant to let me flex my writing muscles and try to see what does and doesn't work in my storytelling style. But I also wish to entertain while I do this.

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Namely, for me the Guild was a pretty vague entity, and all that stuff happening or being described in the second paragraph touched upon too lightly to be comprehensible, too quickly to involve.
I recognize that I gave very little description of the Guild, but I was hoping to make their function and their inner-workings apparent over the course of a story. Sort of a "show, don't tell" approach. But I'm entirely novice at this, so my idea might be misguided, obviously.

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I'll skim. You should put quotation marks around all dialogue, including "Do you think it might be Lucius?" Confusing.
Among my friends this is the most consistently criticized paragraph. The thing was not meant to be a single line from a single character, but a jumble of various gossiping and shouts that demonstrate how chaotic these meetings were.

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I didn't understand why there's all that bullshit with cloning. If there was a woman that was ready to bear a child to Albus Amagai, why couldn't they do it naturally? I didn't read Ch.2, did soul of the father get transfered into the son? Otherwise, brains can't be cloned. And anyway, that adamantium and the Arrakis worm are kind of too obvious "hommages". So far they don't achieve anything except for the geek value and sounding silly.

Amagai went for cloning for two reasons. One was because it was entirely unexpected. Not only was cloning entirely unexpected, thus allowing him to keep his heir safe until he came of age, it also allowed him to hand-craft his son, and make up for his own physical shortcomings. It also allowed him to imprint whatever education he wished on him, without outside influences. And no, Albus is a posthumous character, Darius is an independent individual.

As for the "homages", yeah, maybe they were a bit gratuitous. But I needed a justification beyond "magic space ooze" for where he managed to make an otherwise unheard of cloning formula, and I figured I might as well give a bit of a nod to a novel far better than mine while I was at it. The adamantium was an unintentional reference, but looking back I can't see how I missed it.

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Well, in general, with rought spots, the writing comes out as decent "teenage novel" kind. That's definitely for a certain demographic. And the demographic is around this forum. I don't get it.
Well, I am 17... but I'd like to improve my skills, as teenage writing is not necessarily my preferred demographic. Of course, when I heard teenage I think Twilight, and I'm desperate to distance myself from that monstrosity as much as possible.
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Supermikhail

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2011, 03:44:48 am »

Er, I was thinking of a more traditional teenage demographic - mystery and horror stories. Felt there.

You've probably realized in the process of writing your reply that you shouldn't have needed to explain stuff to me, a reader, in correspondence. There's intended mystery, and there's the reader going "This is bullshit".

About quotation marks again. They have very little to do with creativity. They are a convenient sign to show the reader that someone's talking. It doesn't matter if that's a lot of people, but you don't want to unnecessarily confuse the reader. You can enclose each line in "", and separate from another one with - . Thus they'll still be jumbled together into a single paragraph, but much more readable.

About reasons. There is the thing with wanting to tell a story which is that "tell" implies a recipient. So you need to think who you intend your story for. You can't please everybody. With some ironing out, it can do for a teenage sci-fi... novel. If you aim at general public, with whom those writing blogs I spoke about are concerned, well, you'll have to work a bit more. Starting with kind of controversial dialogue tags topic which blog writers just "love".

Yeah, and don't forget to check out that thing I linked.
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CJ1145

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #5 on: April 03, 2011, 10:07:48 pm »

Well, I was thinking about what you told me Supermikhail, and I also checked out that site. Very useful. I edited the first chapter to explain a little more about just what the Guild was, fixed the quotation issue, and changed around a few other things.

Spoiler: Revised Chapter 1 (click to show/hide)
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Supermikhail

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2011, 02:13:44 am »

Okay. Yes, the beginning is now easier to grasp, but... As you said that teenage demographic is not for you, I'm going to get down dirty.

"You daft bastard..." It's pretty hard to take this sentence seriously, at least on this forum. I don't know if it doesn't sound childish somewhere else.

Bad choice of words - "he assured himself that assassins would start making attempts shortly". Maybe it would be better - and more sane - to say "suspected", "foresaw"?

A new thing about adamantium... I mean, amagium. Assuming a somewhat realistic universe, every stable chemical element has been discovered. Which implies that amagium is an alloy. What prevents competitors from buying a sample of amagium and reverse-engineering the composition? Especially if it's an advanced civilization - they don't even need to be able to cut it.

Issue with cloning potion - "curious chemical" mixed "with several others" sounds a bit like "wizard did it". At least either the chemical or the mixture could have a scientifically-sounding name. After all, you don't need to worry about the readers stealing the formula. ;)

With homages to Dune, I've got this idea - the thing with Dune was, the spice was an organic compound - there's a lot more variation and possibility for new compounds among organics than inorganics. It was produced by a living creature - natural compounds are always hard to synthesize, due to the complexity of the natural synthesizing system (which has been refined for millions of years). The spice had paranormal qualities - and it's this thing with paranormal - nobody can tell for sure if they exist or not, and certainly no one can say what they can or cannot do. The thing with your worms was that it's already been done (not very exciting to read). You don't want to treat science too lightly, and especially if it comes as a gimmick on the first page. And you don't want to treat a gimmick lightly. If you go with a natural cloning compound, you could think about how it could be useful in the nature of Amagai's planet. Not easy at all, but such is the life of a writer.

Which makes me think that the secret of Darius Amagai could stay secret for the readers, too, for added intrigue. You know, it could be another mystery to be uncovered in the course of the story.

How do you imagine him rolling his shoulder before talking? Well, it's certainly possible to do, but it would as certainly look stupid. Even, you know, cracking his neck wouldn't be cool because, as you've said, he is surrounded by frail old men, and this demonstration of physical power wouldn't be appropriate, either for a good character among evil ones, or the other way around.

"This is because it was several minutes, and no guards had arrived yet." It would sound better replaced by just "But no guards arrived." First, "this is" qualifies as a tense shift, second - it's just a simplistic sentence among otherwise pretty lofty style.

"Bargo had a look similar to bewildered, spoiled puppy on his face" - Bargo had a look of a bewildered, spoiled puppy. Well, you just don't say it like this. Or maybe it's a matter of conciseness.

"the funniest thing Darius had seen in his short life" - I wouldn't say that twenty years is so emphatically short.

"The Staunt’s Vipers are supposed to guard this chamber daily for the rest of the year!" Or something. They aren't guarding anymore.

"That’s insane, and more importantly completely at odds with the traditional order! The Staunt’s Vipers guard this chamber daily for the rest of the year! The Amagai do not have their turn for another decade! The pattern has been set in stone for centuries, and you dare to challenge it?” Consider this sentence without the dialog tag (which wasn't good anyway, because, as they say, try to talk in spits in real life).

The reaction of the councilors to the Darius's proof is a bit comical. At least provide a sample of the writing that made them so meek. - A more logical response would be a resentful confirmation of the fact that the paper has indeed been made with accordance with legal procedure (or however you should say it) and has Albus Amagai's signature. Something more sci-fi would involve blood analysis, or Albus announcing his will via a hologram (and they certainly could use a lawyer; or some sci-fi figure of that order). And even after that among such furious people there could be someone who would prefer to storm out of the council chamber calling the will a scam. Or something like that. It's unfortunately kind of hard to identify who's on which side there. For example Darius - a dashing rouge, or a cunning villain, or a clever messiah...

Chapter 2 for a good measure.

...Nevermind. Darius is definitely a messiah, but there's no indication of how he and Albus became this way. 40% below poverty line isn't just a number. These are people, and apparently for a long time they've been content with the situation. There must be an explanation, like a rich top supported by the military keeping the lower strata at bay, which then must be a legal situation. But if it was one of the core fields of Albus's work how come he failed to enlighten Darius on it?
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CJ1145

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2011, 07:38:24 am »

Okay. Yes, the beginning is now easier to grasp, but... As you said that teenage demographic is not for you, I'm going to get down dirty.

"You daft bastard..." It's pretty hard to take this sentence seriously, at least on this forum. I don't know if it doesn't sound childish somewhere else.

It was meant to sound silly. The council is made up of some very childish, bratty people. They're intended to come off this way.

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Bad choice of words - "he assured himself that assassins would start making attempts shortly". Maybe it would be better - and more sane - to say "suspected", "foresaw"?

I used the word "assured" because he ended up basically lying to himself. Assassins did end up coming, but it was twenty years after he first began to become paranoid about them.

Quote
A new thing about adamantium... I mean, amagium. Assuming a somewhat realistic universe, every stable chemical element has been discovered. Which implies that amagium is an alloy. What prevents competitors from buying a sample of amagium and reverse-engineering the composition? Especially if it's an advanced civilization - they don't even need to be able to cut it.

I know, it's pretty much adamantium. But I doubt it would end up being called that unless the man who discovered it happened to be complete nerd. By chance it was an Amagai that discovered it, who was proud enough to name it after his clan. The reason it is exclusive to the Amagai clan, and certain parts of the Guild, is because it is tightly controlled. They are responsible for trade, legal and otherwise, both in and out of their cluster, and are therefore able to keep a close eye for any amagium that is being exported to an unauthorized buyer.

Of course, that is not to say that certain other civilizations are not producing it on their own. Amagium is a highly precious resource, but it is only unique within that cluster. Throughout the entire galaxy it is more common. The Amagai worry more about whether the other clans have it than if some group they'll likely never meet face to face has it.

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Issue with cloning potion - "curious chemical" mixed "with several others" sounds a bit like "wizard did it". At least either the chemical or the mixture could have a scientifically-sounding name. After all, you don't need to worry about the readers stealing the formula. ;)

Yeah, replacing the worms made it sound even more conveniently magical than before. That's pretty much a stand-in until I think of a better sounding name.
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With homages to Dune, I've got this idea - the thing with Dune was, the spice was an organic compound - there's a lot more variation and possibility for new compounds among organics than inorganics. It was produced by a living creature - natural compounds are always hard to synthesize, due to the complexity of the natural synthesizing system (which has been refined for millions of years). The spice had paranormal qualities - and it's this thing with paranormal - nobody can tell for sure if they exist or not, and certainly no one can say what they can or cannot do. The thing with your worms was that it's already been done (not very exciting to read). You don't want to treat science too lightly, and especially if it comes as a gimmick on the first page. And you don't want to treat a gimmick lightly. If you go with a natural cloning compound, you could think about how it could be useful in the nature of Amagai's planet. Not easy at all, but such is the life of a writer.

Thanks for the advice, I'll think about that.

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Which makes me think that the secret of Darius Amagai could stay secret for the readers, too, for added intrigue. You know, it could be another mystery to be uncovered in the course of the story.

That is also a good idea. I'd have to think about how I could work out the sudden appearance of Darius, but do-able I think.

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How do you imagine him rolling his shoulder before talking? Well, it's certainly possible to do, but it would as certainly look stupid. Even, you know, cracking his neck wouldn't be cool because, as you've said, he is surrounded by frail old men, and this demonstration of physical power wouldn't be appropriate, either for a good character among evil ones, or the other way around.

He isn't really trying to be intimidating there, he's just kind of stretching a bit before he talks. I guess a better way to explain it would be he is kind of rotating his arm at the shoulder.

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"This is because it was several minutes, and no guards had arrived yet." It would sound better replaced by just "But no guards arrived." First, "this is" qualifies as a tense shift, second - it's just a simplistic sentence among otherwise pretty lofty style.
Entirely my bad, I read a Terry Pratchett novel recently, and my writing style sort of gets influenced by the latest couple of books I read, so those sorts of things sneak in.

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"Bargo had a look similar to bewildered, spoiled puppy on his face" - Bargo had a look of a bewildered, spoiled puppy. Well, you just don't say it like this. Or maybe it's a matter of conciseness.

Maybe. I guess I was just trying to convey how spoiled the councilors were. That seemed the best analogy to me.

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"the funniest thing Darius had seen in his short life" - I wouldn't say that twenty years is so emphatically short.
Actually, he's only spent about 6 months out of the cloning vat so far. I planned to do a flashback later to explain how he got to where he was from there.

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"The Staunt’s Vipers are supposed to guard this chamber daily for the rest of the year!" Or something. They aren't guarding anymore.

I guess it makes more sense in my mind to have it the way I do, but the closest to a justification I can make is that she refuses to accept that this has just happened.
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"That’s insane, and more importantly completely at odds with the traditional order! The Staunt’s Vipers guard this chamber daily for the rest of the year! The Amagai do not have their turn for another decade! The pattern has been set in stone for centuries, and you dare to challenge it?” Consider this sentence without the dialog tag (which wasn't good anyway, because, as they say, try to talk in spits in real life).

Tried it just now, and yeah it does look better.

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The reaction of the councilors to the Darius's proof is a bit comical. At least provide a sample of the writing that made them so meek. - A more logical response would be a resentful confirmation of the fact that the paper has indeed been made with accordance with legal procedure (or however you should say it) and has Albus Amagai's signature. Something more sci-fi would involve blood analysis, or Albus announcing his will via a hologram (and they certainly could use a lawyer; or some sci-fi figure of that order). And even after that among such furious people there could be someone who would prefer to storm out of the council chamber calling the will a scam. Or something like that.

This was intentional. The council is meant to be portrayed as ineffectual, and this was one of the bigger hints. The fact that they're all so convinced by a single stamp actually becomes a major plot point in just a couple of chapters. They're not really meant to be this clever group of evil bureaucrats, they're a bunch of bumbling idiots who are so caught up in their own power struggles they can't even do their jobs properly.

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It's unfortunately kind of hard to identify who's on which side there. For example Darius - a dashing rouge, or a cunning villain, or a clever messiah...
Like I said, at the moment there's not really a side that could be designated as good or bad. The councilors are stupid and petty, yes, but there are proactive members among them and they aren't purposefully ruining the economy. They just can't properly manage it.

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Chapter 2 for a good measure.

...Nevermind. Darius is definitely a messiah, but there's no indication of how he and Albus became this way. 40% below poverty line isn't just a number. These are people, and apparently for a long time they've been content with the situation. There must be an explanation, like a rich top supported by the military keeping the lower strata at bay, which then must be a legal situation. But if it was one of the core fields of Albus's work how come he failed to enlighten Darius on it?

Darius does definitely appear to be the ultimate good guy in chapter 2, but I'm trying to tone that down in the following chapters. He has the best interests of the galaxy at heart, but while he is the protagonist I have no intentions for him to be the hero.

Albus happened to be a good person, one of few in the council. He saw how bad the situation was, and began to work to fix it. The many years he served did indeed see improvement, which is also why the people of the galaxy have been so complacent for the last century. As for the situation with the poverty line before that time, even if the people were able to organize enough to try and reach the Guild, they would have to go through their private military companies, each with enough firepower to take on anything that could be scrounged up by them for a fight. There may have been uprisings in the past, but they are irrelevant here.

Darius does not know about it because his education was not fully complete. Albus intended to instill him with everything, but he was killed before it could be completed. Darius was taught most of what he needed to know by Albus, but he didn't learn about the current situation in the galaxy beyond his immediate focus: the council.

« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 07:47:01 am by CJ1145 »
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Supermikhail

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2011, 09:05:55 am »

O-okay. I can't remember when I read a comedy last time. Maybe never. You're saying that the councilors are comical characters? That's kind of poorly conveyed. I actually thought it was just bad writing and was going to get on it next time. Well, and the humor doesn't work. The beginning, which sets us into mood, is just too somber. After this beginning you expect the Guild members to be cruel and manipulating, not simple and incompetent. How do they wage their wars? And, well, you don't automatically achieve a humorous effect by saying that a character has a squeaky voice or wears funny clothes. Also, if the Amagai are so cunning and other members are so stupid, why hasn't the Guild been taken over by the Amagai, or dissolved and replaced by "the Amagai administration economics branch" or something? If you've got answers to these questions, you probably should have included them into the text from the start.

About shoulders? Albus should have explained to Darius that diplomacy starts from the toes of your boots. Rolling one's shoulders is definitely a display of physical strength and an attempt to intimidate. He probably shouldn't have done that, now that I better understand your intentions.

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"Bargo had a look similar to bewildered, spoiled puppy on his face" - Bargo had a look of a bewildered, spoiled puppy. Well, you just don't say it like this. Or maybe it's a matter of conciseness.

Maybe. I guess I was just trying to convey how spoiled the councilors were. That seemed the best analogy to me.
I meant you shouldn't say "look similar to" it's a) too long and clumsy, b) metaphors (or comparisons, a bit rusty on literature terms here) just don't work like that. You simply say "Bargo looked like a bewildered, spoiled puppy". "similar to" is just clumsy.

Why did Darius spend only 6 months out of the cloning vat? What's the point of the cloning vat if it, apparently, slows down development. In that time Albus could have had a real child and trained him in the ways of the ninja, so that Darius would conceal himself actively. And at the same time Albus would have more time to teach Darius important stuff.

Re: Chapter 3. If he knew what must be done, why couldn't Darius eliminate whoever he wanted at the council meeting, concidering he had sent all but his own guards away?

And shouldn't Layton take a bit more persuading. In my opinion he agrees too easily. Darius could be more eloquent. He basically makes a single point - 40% below poverty line. However strong a point, you don't go to court with only one.

Also, I don't think storing information on paper makes it more secure than if it were stored in a digital form. If someone wanted it badly, they could sneak in and photograph it.
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CJ1145

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2011, 02:57:24 pm »

Well, I think I have miscommunicated here. I do not intend the council to be "funny", they are not meant to be "comical" as much as "comically inept".they're ruthlessly cunning in politics and espionage, but are so caught up in it their work in the economy is less.

They wage their.wars in various ways. Some prefer covert assassinations. Others, such as the twice-mentioned McCaines, are nore openly violent and militaristic.

And the Amagai were not ever naturally superior. Albus just happened to see an advantage and seize it. If he'd raised a normal son he might have become distracted or influenced by the world around him. Inside the tube Albus could teach him whatever he wanted. But since this was the first time the cloning process had been performed teaching him took a very long time, as there was no known way to speed the process up. I'll edit the chapters at another time and try to make this clearer.

As for chapter 3, Darius could not just have them killed because, simply, it wouldn't work. There would still be the extended families controlling their respective mercs. Darius could not fight them all, so he decided to coerce them instead.

Layton believes Darius simply because he wants to. Albus was his closest ally, and he wholeheartedly believes that any child of Albus is worth trusting. There is also a lot of cultural meaning to an alliance in the Guild. Have you seen the movie Highlander? In it, even the foulest most unscrupulous characters refuse to fight on holy ground. That is how sacred an alliance is to them. Most people would not break such a partnership, but the councilors literally cannot.

The paper thing, if you want, could be perceived as more inept practices of the Guild, or you could also view the necessity of hiding documents from a society so advanced that wireless hacking of electronics would be as trivial as making toast.

I don't mean to sound rude at all here, and I'm on a phone so quoting individual sections is beyond my means, but I'm just trying to explain what goes on in my head as I write this stuff.
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Supermikhail

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #10 on: April 04, 2011, 03:49:30 pm »

Didn't see anything rude. ;)

You know, what goes on in your head is exactly what we want to read here. At least I do. Or how you (and writers in general) translate into the heads of your characters. I'd much rather Darius overexplained his motivations (at least in the first draft), than I had to wonder what exactly the author meant here.

I get the cultural thing - the not-complete-humannes of the society is visible, but the rough spots overshadow it a bit. Also, similar to Dune, you could want to put more emphasis on the cultural aspects in the beginning, intermingling exposition with actual events. You kind of jump in as if it's Star Wars, and I expect to find the simplicity of Star Wars, but glimpses of not-so-starwarsy stuff confuse me. Kind of ironic how I first praised your "Space" beginning, as it might look similar to the Star Wars title roll. Of course, you may employ this as a trick slowly submerging the reader into the story, but consider Highlander (which I, being a devout Queen fan, am bound to have seen at least once) - most of the strange things are pretty much patiently explained in the first scene - medieval sword-masters with super-human abilities chasing each other throughout eternity, and aiming for only one cause of death - decapitation. I don't remember if Connor says anything about "only one" in the first fight. You, well, bring very little of the significant stuff into the beginning. Amagium and worms (or chemicals) don't seem to play a major part; Albus comes into the action already dead; intimidating military forces of the rest of the Guild are dealt with peacefully and promptly at the start of the council. What seems to continue into the rest of the story is only the political structure of the cluster, but even it is too weak to hold against Darius.

By the way, you don't want to make your antagonist(s) weak - if you intend to make the Guild members the antagonists. It's not interesting to read about a strong noble character overpower weak corrupt ones. You generally need to at least have the odds even. Although, we're only 3 chapters in, so I'm not going to play a precog here. Just passing ideas and suggestions that might be useful.
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CJ1145

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2011, 04:43:56 pm »

Quote
You know, what goes on in your head is exactly what we want to read here. At least I do. Or how you (and writers in general) translate into the heads of your characters. I'd much rather Darius overexplained his motivations (at least in the first draft), than I had to wonder what exactly the author meant here.

I get the cultural thing - the not-complete-humannes of the society is visible, but the rough spots overshadow it a bit. Also, similar to Dune, you could want to put more emphasis on the cultural aspects in the beginning, intermingling exposition with actual events. You kind of jump in as if it's Star Wars, and I expect to find the simplicity of Star Wars, but glimpses of not-so-starwarsy stuff confuse me. Kind of ironic how I first praised your "Space" beginning, as it might look similar to the Star Wars title roll. Of course, you may employ this as a trick slowly submerging the reader into the story, but consider Highlander (which I, being a devout Queen fan, am bound to have seen at least once) - most of the strange things are pretty much patiently explained in the first scene - medieval sword-masters with super-human abilities chasing each other throughout eternity, and aiming for only one cause of death - decapitation. I don't remember if Connor says anything about "only one" in the first fight. You, well, bring very little of the significant stuff into the beginning. Amagium and worms (or chemicals) don't seem to play a major part; Albus comes into the action already dead; intimidating military forces of the rest of the Guild are dealt with peacefully and promptly at the start of the council.

That's all true, and I'm considering adding more to work it all in, but it'll probably end up doubling the chapter length. Not that I'm complaining.

Quote
By the way, you don't want to make your antagonist(s) weak - if you intend to make the Guild members the antagonists. It's not interesting to read about a strong noble character overpower weak corrupt ones. You generally need to at least have the odds even. Although, we're only 3 chapters in, so I'm not going to play a precog here. Just passing ideas and suggestions that might be useful.

Actually, the Guild are not the main antagonists of the story. I intend for them to be fully dealt with by the time the first quarter of the story is over. The story isn't so much about Darius rising to power, but how that rise to power (and the rise of another, yet to be introduced character) ends up sparking a massive conflict.
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Supermikhail

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #12 on: April 04, 2011, 07:02:39 pm »

Okay. Hey, I actually didn't read the second chapter after I discovered Darius was a strange hero. Caught up on that now. So, Darius's ignorance we've kind of figured out. Why is Bill so surprised at the 40%? He's a veteran. He's supposed to have seen a lot.

Also, you do some weirds things with some words. I noticed "energy" and "smog" with the article "a" as if countable. They, well, sound weird, even if they could be countable in some cases. But not in those. Smog probably couldn't be countable in any case.

The culture appears more prominent in the second chapter, with descriptions and conduct. However, I think the dialog could use more show-don't-tell. "Bill responded by telling the guard, whom he referred to as “Chuck”, that his boss was terrible at showing two fine ladies such as themselves a good time. One rifle-butt to the head later, a quieter Bill followed Darius inside." This set of sentences makes a person imagine the dialog in the same voice that's been setup by the starwarsy descriptions. However, if voiced directly, the way these lines were spoken could show more of the culture, speech patterns.
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CJ1145

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2011, 07:50:55 pm »

I've been writing more, and editing. I have four chapters done so far, so I'll post them all in a group. Keep in mind, Chapter 1 is only changed from the last draft by adding a bit more backstory about Albus and the Guild itself, and Chapter 2's only major change was making Bill's line actually quoted to him, which I think does look better.

Spoiler: Chapter 1 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Chapter 2 (click to show/hide)

The maximum character limit has been exceeded with all four, so I'll need to double-post.
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CJ1145

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Re: CJ, unsatisfied with his shitty art, declares war on literature
« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2011, 07:51:37 pm »

Spoiler: Chapter 3 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Chapter 4 (click to show/hide)

There's the newest two.
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