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[freeformschooler]

I'll just say it right now. I'm honestly looking for something with the open endedness of DF's Adventure Mode (do anything to anyone, optionally go anywhere) and the complicated interactions between characters present in games like The Sims. Both are two of my favorite series. To give you a better idea I'm looking for games that have:

-Interactions between characters (socializing? love/hate/friendship?) less on the level of "kill/don't kill" and more on the level of The Sims but not necessarily that much.
-The open endedness of DF's game world. In that you can go anywhere and importantly the same rules for interaction applies to every character. If you can kill someone in-game, you should be able to kill anyone, theoretically. If you can boost your relationship by talking about things in general you should be able to do the same for everyone. And so on.
-PREFERABLY: given the openendedness I'm looking for, at least the potential to have a great quantity of denizens of the game world.
-PREFERABLY: assuming direct control over one character, or a family, or a group, etc. Guiding their interactions to and extent.

Oh, and in the case any of you guys suggest a lame socialization MMO (IMVU, Gaia Online or what have you): no thanks. I'm doing this mostly as a recommended side project of my game design teacher (study why certain niches of games are compelling to me and others and precisely what makes them that way, along with examples), but of course I'm doing this for myself too. I've been searching for hours and haven't come up with much, really.

[Biag]

Europa 1440: The Guild sounds kind of like this. It's basically the Sims only in medieval times and you can kill people. Supposedly the sequel isn't as good, but there are two of them.

[Moogie]

Having been eager to find games like this myself, I can pretty much say The Guild and its sequel are exactly the sort of thing you're looking for. Unfortunately, no other games really come anywhere close.

The games have towns with full supply/demand trading and economy; everything is resource gathered/crafted.

There are 'filler' NPCs, and then there are the major Families. Family NPCs are numerous and perform all the actions you can, including marrying/having kids, buying and selling houses and businesses (and making improvements/renovations), trading, buying and using personal items (weapons, perfume, poems), participating in council meetings and running for offices, and doing things to either befriend other families (including yours) or sabotaging them.

You and the NPCs can run for council offices, which give you power over such things as taxes, or ordering business inspections (fucks with their productivity) or even locking someone you hate up in jail.

Towns are governed by law and criminals are prosecuted in courts. The entire system -- from holding an office where you have control over the city guardsmen, right down to being a prosecutor or even judge of the trial -- is entirely open to you and other NPCs.

You can bribe people or flatter them, or give them gifts. Conversely, you can slander them to other people (spread rumours to lower their reputation with other people), or steal from them, or get them voted out of offices. NPCs can also do all of this to you.

Towns grow as they prosper, and you can end up filling all the office seats and running things exactly how you want.

The only serious flaw in The Guild games, are their buginess. Thankfully, most issues have by now been addressed through patches and expansions.

It is a seriously impressive "medieval life sim" game.

[freeformschooler]

Having been eager to find games like this myself, I can pretty much say The Guild and its sequel are exactly the sort of thing you're looking for. Unfortunately, no other games really come anywhere close.

DARN. Oh, well. I'll by far definitely try the guild out. Thanks for the suggestions, guys. I know it's a niche game but I'm surprised the nonlinearity of open world games and the nonlinearity of personal simulation games haven't merged that much before.

[Virtz]

The Guild 2: Renaissance. Although be sure to get the latest standalone expansion pack (Renaissance) rather than vanilla The Guild 2. There's fewer problems the expansion. The first game was similar, but from what I recall it had a bit less of what you're looking for (less detailed world simulation and less social interactions, I think). Although it was less buggy as well.

You basically control a dynasty (beginning as one person) starting from the year 1400. You work your way up as a patron (food industry), craftsman (goods industry), scholar (things requiring higher education) or rogue (stealing, blackmail, killing). You eliminate rival dynasties and/or get your dynasty in all the best positions and good relations with important people and organizations. It's possible to off pretty much anyone, either through direct assault, dueling or going to court and getting the person the death penalty (although that takes a considerable amount of influence and evidence).

The social relations system is a bit simple, though. Relations with others are linear and universal for the entire family, and increasing this relation is a matter of using an appropriate skill on a person and hoping the given character's attributes are good enough to succeed. It feels more suited towards diplomatic relations rather than things like friendship or actual love. There is courting when seeking a suitable partner to keep the dynasty going, but following the guide lines for the given social class, this goes by quickly and is completely forgotten once the chosen person becomes part of the family.

[Moogie]

Yeah, I was about to add that my opinion is of The Guild 2. I haven't actually ever tried the first one. Sorry if there was any confusion.

[Tellemurius]

The Sims Medieval when it comes out.

[Chandos]

I wanna try playing Guild 2 again, but I'm still wary of its bugginess. Does anyone have a good handle on how well the game is patched currently?

[Dr. Johbson]

I own all of them by accident, The original Guild 2 is the least buggy I think, the most and nigh unplayable for me has been Renaissance, but I've only tried that a few times since the bugs drove me insane.

Also, the game is multilayer, so if anyone wants to set up some games, I will gladly play, I'm not too good though.  But yes, that's the only game I know of that fits this description.

[Virtz]

I own all of them by accident, The original Guild 2 is the least buggy I think, the most and nigh unplayable for me has been Renaissance, but I've only tried that a few times since the bugs drove me insane.

Huh. I had the opposite sentiments. To me the original Guild 2 was so full of memory leaks and gameplay inanities it became unplayable after some time. Only notable thing I've encountered in Renaissance was passing carts becoming looped for all eternity in this one place on the Hansa map around Danzig. Didn't happen on the other maps, though. So pick your poison, I guess. Both of them are more buggy than the first Guild. Renaissance at least offers some more carrear options in return. And I think it's still being patched since it's the newest.

[Ringmaster]

It really is pot luck for which Guild 2 game plays best on your computer.

Unfortunately, as previously stated, no other games have attempted what Guild 2 has, so until the developers decide to fix bugs instead of release expansion packs, you're stuck with that.

One more useful thing to know about the game is that there is a modding community on the JoWood forums (Make sure you go to the English version, or learn German) and they have created some very useful modifications. The only drawback is that this game requires you to back up files before you add mods, otherwise something is likely to go wrong and you won't have anything to go back to.

[Dr. Johbson]

I own all of them by accident, The original Guild 2 is the least buggy I think, the most and nigh unplayable for me has been Renaissance, but I've only tried that a few times since the bugs drove me insane.

Huh. I had the opposite sentiments. To me the original Guild 2 was so full of memory leaks and gameplay inanities it became unplayable after some time. Only notable thing I've encountered in Renaissance was passing carts becoming looped for all eternity in this one place on the Hansa map around Danzig. Didn't happen on the other maps, though. So pick your poison, I guess. Both of them are more buggy than the first Guild. Renaissance at least offers some more carrear options in return. And I think it's still being patched since it's the newest.

Yeah, I have no idea anymore, I just played Renaissance again for a few hours and everything was working, more or less, guess it patched at some point, must have missed it. I won't complain, it is indeed awesome.

[Xotes]

While it's still under development and probably won't be out for at least another year, Kenshi sounds like it fits what you're looking for. To quote most of the game's feature list (in no particular order).

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Intelligent AI that allows for characters to reason and work towards long-term goals and desires. Squads work together and carry their wounded to safety.

Variation and possibilities of gameplay. Be good, be evil, be a business man, be a thief, live in a town, live in the desert, join the army, fight the army, travel alone, travel in hordes, build a fortress, raze a city.

Dynamic, ever changing world. Support or hinder whoever you wish, or keep to yourself, the world won't stop moving. This is not just a "game", you are living and surviving in a simulated world.

You are not the chosen one.  You're not great and powerful. You don't have more 'hitpoints' than everyone else. You are not the center of the universe, and you are not special.

Freeform gameplay in a seamless game world stretching over 400 square kilometers.  The game will never seek to limit you or restrict your personal play style.

Original take on the RTS-RPG hybrid genre. No "hero" characters with artificially stronger stats than everybody else-  Every character and NPC you meet is potentially an equal, and has a name, a life.

Sounds like it fits what you're looking for perfectly.

[Puzzlemaker]

While it's still under development and probably won't be out for at least another year, Kenshi sounds like it fits what you're looking for. To quote most of the game's feature list (in no particular order).

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Intelligent AI that allows for characters to reason and work towards long-term goals and desires. Squads work together and carry their wounded to safety.

Variation and possibilities of gameplay. Be good, be evil, be a business man, be a thief, live in a town, live in the desert, join the army, fight the army, travel alone, travel in hordes, build a fortress, raze a city.

Dynamic, ever changing world. Support or hinder whoever you wish, or keep to yourself, the world won't stop moving. This is not just a "game", you are living and surviving in a simulated world.

You are not the chosen one.  You're not great and powerful. You don't have more 'hitpoints' than everyone else. You are not the center of the universe, and you are not special.

Freeform gameplay in a seamless game world stretching over 400 square kilometers.  The game will never seek to limit you or restrict your personal play style.

Original take on the RTS-RPG hybrid genre. No "hero" characters with artificially stronger stats than everybody else-  Every character and NPC you meet is potentially an equal, and has a name, a life.

Sounds like it fits what you're looking for perfectly.

Huh, you should make a thread about that.  Looks interesting, he just released a new demo, and it looks like he could use support.

Edit:  My bad, the last demo he released was around this time... last year.

[Zangi]

That Kenshi game... sounds epic.

Make a thread for it so I could tag it.