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[Leafsnail]

To me, a policy lynch is voting someone not for being scum, but because you feel their playstyle damages the game.  So... yeah, that was a policy vote for me.

I guess it all makes sense if you had a different definition though, so never mind.

[Darvi]

Bah. Semantics.

[Book]

And now, a Public Service Announcement:

LurkerTracker^®
Why ask "Why"? Drink alcohol! Nobody likes a thinker! You may not be able to change your life, but you can change the way you look at it. Alcohol. The more you drink, the less you think!

Argembarger has 6 posts; the last 7 hours ago. Red text: Ottofar Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6]
Book has 13 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: Unvote Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13]
Darvi has 17 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: SirBayer Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13][14][15][16][17]
IronyOwl has 9 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: Zrk2, Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9]
Jack A T has 15 posts; the last 14 hours ago. Red text: Mr. Person Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13][14][15]
Jokerman-EXE has 10 posts; the last 21 hours ago. Red text: Mr.Person Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10]
Leafsnail has 9 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: Zrk2 Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9]
Mr.Person has 4 posts; the last 41 hours ago. Red text: Unvote, vote SirBayer Posts: [1][2][3][4]
NativeForeigner has 7 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: Org Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7]
Org has 17 posts; the last 19 hours ago. Red text: Bayer Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13][14][15][16][17]
Ottofar has 11 posts; the last 4 hours ago. Red text: Unvote RedWarriorVote Zrk2 Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11]
RedWarrior0 has 4 posts; the last 41 hours ago. Red text: Posts: [1][2][3][4]
SirBayer has 16 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: Unvote, vote Mr. Person. Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13][14][15][16]
Toaster has 12 posts; the last 2 hours ago. Red text: IronyOwl Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12]
Tyberix has 1 posts; the last 25 hours ago. Red text: Posts: [1]
Zrk2 has 21 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: SirBayer Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13][14][15][16][17][18][19][20][21]
lordnincompoop has 7 posts; the last 0 hours ago. Red text: Unvote Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7]
webadict has 1 posts; the last 41 hours ago. Red text: Posts: [1]


Moderator has 16 posts; the last 10 hours ago. Posts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13][14][15][16]

Moderator: please prod Mr.Person, RedWarrior0, webadict. They haven't posted in over 36 hours."Here's to alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems!" -- Homer Simpson

Note: The Tracker (and I) are a bit confused about spectators, nonplayers and the like. I left their posts and prod requests in, but they may or may not be needed. I'll fix them for the next one, assuming I understand the game better by then.

[Pandarsenic]

Votes:
SirBayer - 4 - Zrk2 Darvi Mr.Person Org
Darvi - 0
Leafsnail - 0
Ottofar - 1 - Argembarger
Argembarger - 0
Zrk2 - 3 - Leafsnail Ottofar IronyOwl
lordnincompoop - 0
Book - 0
Jack A T - 0
Org - 1 - NativeForeigner
Jokerman-EXE - 0
Toaster - 0
IronyOwl - 1 - Toaster
NativeForeigner - 0
Mr.Person - 3 - SirBayer JokermanEXE Jack_A_T

Deadline is in 25 hours.

Edit: On account of 3 people having been listed as voting multiple times, I'm no longer going to attempt to be generous about people forgetting to unvote. Yes, you now have to even say "Unvote nobody, vote X" from now on.

All votes must be in the form of Unvote _, Vote _" or I will ignore them from here out.

[Pandarsenic]

Also, I'd like to see more (soon-to-be-spoiled) spectator participation. Just saying.

[Darvi]

Where's Book's vote?

[Darvi]

Or Lordnincompoop's?

[Book]

I'm not voting anyone, I unvoted last time I did something in red, as you can see in the tracker (and clicking the red text will even take you to that post!)

[Darvi]

Pandar still should've put a "not voting" list there.

[Zrk2]

Other than Org, my main pick is SirBayer because
1. Org is his scumbuddy and he's trying to save him.
OR
2. Org is townie, and SirBayer is defending him so when he is lynched he looks more townie.

Zrk2, why did you try to hammer him just for that? Why isn't Jokerman on that list for also defending Org?

Actually the only vote I had placed out of the two or three it said I had was on SirBayer, so now we only need one to hammer.

And I think lynching SirBayer now would just end the day sooner, it seems pretty obvious who we're lynching, but mroe time means more discussion, means better odds for town.

Ah, so now you're advertising for someone else to finish the job, while saying it's inevitable but spouting a townlike catchphrase completely at odds with what you're actually doing.

Well, being townie is usually a good way to go about being townie...

In regards to my almost hammering, I was sleeping/at school since 10pm EST last night, and that was the first chance I'd had to post since then. I looked at my own logic and saw that out of the possible situations I saw, Org was only scum in 1 while, Sir Bayer is scum in 3.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So there's also a 4:
4. Sir Bayer is town and the idea that Org has to tell someone each day is legit.

Following my logic I decided that voting Bayer made more sense than voting Org because Bayer seemed extremely scummy to Orgs' simply useless, with a side of annoying and a pinch of scumspice. Therefore, after collecting all my logic trains my own ideas lead to concluding that Bayer was a legitimately better vote. The hammering wasn't even noticed by me as I had concluded I was voting Bayer as I was reading ~page 10.

The hammering issue seems moot now, as well.

[SirBayer]

Native:  Do you think Bayer and Jokerman are scummy for their "utter bullshit" arguments against the Org lynch?

I find Bayer questionable because I don't know his meta, but I've seen Jokerman say the exact same things about Org when he was town. He just never really approves of an Org lynch.

Bayer: Noted. You are currently one vote away from being hammered. Is that causing you to consider to roleclaim or do something else in an attempt to persuade everyone otherwise? Or do you think you can get out of this some other way?

Meh. I honestly didn't notice I was so close until the votecount.

Pandar:    Book, Zrk2, and Darvi are all voting twice.  Zrk2 is listed as having 3   votes despite having only two names beside him.  Are these all correct?

Ah, I get that now. Wow, I should vote more often *joke, for those of you without humor*
 
 

 

  While   I'm not averse to believing that Org is a jester, I still don't believe   Bayer to be entirely innocent either. For all we know the PM never   happened and he's making it all up to cover for his buddying.
 

 
  Well yes, perhaps the PM never happened.
 
  But notice when Org started contributing - when he was no longer the focus of attention and of desired lynch.
 
  Only then did he change his slant. So if you disbelieve me I'm fine with that, I just think it warrants more faith than you're giving it.
 

Point. But his contributions weren't really much (only half a roleclaim, and stating that "Zrk isn't scum").
    Chances for his roles imo are 40% for Jester, 55% for scum engaging in   RiA and 5% other. While you... really, your initial arguments for   defending him were bullcrap. I'd say 75% scum and 25% other.

If I'm defending scum, I'm scum, sure. If I'm defending town, I'm scum, sure. If I'm defending Jester, what am I? So 40% "whatever," and 60% scum, which aren't really your numbers there. I'd like to see consistency, here.

Unvote.

Dunno if you've heard this sentiment before, but anti-town =/= scum. Just because they're useless doesn't mean they're scum. Could mean they're an idiot. Could mean they're a jester, as is the case.

It may not always be, but it's a pretty good place to start, as it can also lead to hostile third parties.

Zrk2: Outside of Org, who do you suspect?  How about if Org is town?

Other than Org, my main pick is SirBayer because
1. Org is his scumbuddy and he's trying to save him.
OR
2. Org is townie, and SirBayer is defending him so when he is lynched he looks more townie.

Haven't we already discu-

Oh, and
3. Org is a jester, and SirBayer is defending him because he's cool like that.

Oh hey. Alright, you're being reasonable anyway. Though why you didn't think of this in the first place...?

IronyOwl, if Org did not have a track record for Orglike behavior, how would your thoughts on this game be altered?

I'd have considered Jester a LOT more readily.

But notice when Org started contributing - when he was no longer the focus of attention and of desired lynch.

Only then did he change his slant. So if you disbelieve me I'm fine with that, I just think it warrants more faith than you're giving it.

This is kind of interesting, but "contributing" in this case means "two coherent sentences." It's more than he was giving earlier, but it's hardly a massive jump.

I'm also curious exactly what the reasoning for a jester would be in this situation. Attention is on him, so he herps and derps as much as possible, then starts contributing when everyone ignores him?

I'll unvote SirBayer for now, but I'd like to hear your reasoning.

Contributing is relative, with Org.

Okay, let's say you're Org. You just start herping and derping and everyone votes for you. Hooray, you're a jester, you're winning!

But then someone starts defending you. Oh no, this isn't good! But it's okay, they'll just lynch him first and you'll be next. That's fine!

But oh no, he's winning! So now you have to do something. Switch tactics, roll another way.

Scum wouldn't do it that way. SK wouldn't do that way. Anyone who didn't want to be lynched would've switched tactics when they saw they were being threatened. A townie might do it, but as someone pointed out to me I was wrong, Org actually contributes these days (I'm still in shock). So my initial arguments were BS, but now we find we have something out of them anyway.

That's a tangent, though. DO you get my point now?

Other than Org, my main pick is SirBayer because
1. Org is his scumbuddy and he's trying to save him.
OR
2. Org is townie, and SirBayer is defending him so when he is lynched he looks more townie.

Zrk2, why did you try to hammer him just for that? Why isn't Jokerman on that list for also defending Org?

Actually the only vote I had placed out of the two or three it said I had was on SirBayer, so now we only need one to hammer.

And I think lynching SirBayer now would just end the day sooner, it seems pretty obvious who we're lynching, but mroe time means more discussion, means better odds for town.

Ah, so now you're advertising for someone else to finish the job, while saying it's inevitable but spouting a townlike catchphrase completely at odds with what you're actually doing.

Well, being townie is usually a good way to go about being townie...

In regards to my almost hammering, I was sleeping/at school since 10pm EST last night, and that was the first chance I'd had to post since then. I looked at my own logic and saw that out of the possible situations I saw, Org was only scum in 1 while, Sir Bayer is scum in 3.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So there's also a 4:
4. Sir Bayer is town and the idea that Org has to tell someone each day is legit.

Following my logic I decided that voting Bayer made more sense than voting Org because Bayer seemed extremely scummy to Orgs' simply useless, with a side of annoying and a pinch of scumspice. Therefore, after collecting all my logic trains my own ideas lead to concluding that Bayer was a legitimately better vote. The hammering wasn't even noticed by me as I had concluded I was voting Bayer as I was reading ~page 10.

The hammering issue seems moot now, as well.

Mmm. You completely fail to actually address Owl's concerns, and then go ahead and raise some more.

The hammering issue seems moot now, as well.

No, it's not moot. And you're trying to just pass off what's a pretty clear scumtell as nothing, which is, of course, scummy.

[Jack A T]

Also, I feel that newer meta trumps older meta.

Why?

People change over time, and their playstyles do too, somewhat.  Ergo, meta changes over time.

[IronyOwl]

Well, being townie is usually a good way to go about being townie...

This doesn't explain anything. You're pointing out that "we just need one more to hammer," like you're inviting someone onto the wagon, then saying "Well more time is always good for town!" It doesn't add up.

In regards to my almost hammering, I was sleeping/at school since 10pm EST last night, and that was the first chance I'd had to post since then. I looked at my own logic and saw that out of the possible situations I saw, Org was only scum in 1 while, Sir Bayer is scum in 3.

So "He's town defending a bad idea" isn't an option? Or were you referring to the PM specifically?

Following my logic I decided that voting Bayer made more sense than voting Org because Bayer seemed extremely scummy to Orgs' simply useless, with a side of annoying and a pinch of scumspice. Therefore, after collecting all my logic trains my own ideas lead to concluding that Bayer was a legitimately better vote. The hammering wasn't even noticed by me as I had concluded I was voting Bayer as I was reading ~page 10.

If Org is merely useless, what's so damning about Bayer's defense of him? You also ignored my question as to why Jokerman's not in there as well- he's been defending Org also.

Contributing is relative, with Org.

Okay, let's say you're Org. You just start herping and derping and everyone votes for you. Hooray, you're a jester, you're winning!

But then someone starts defending you. Oh no, this isn't good! But it's okay, they'll just lynch him first and you'll be next. That's fine!

But oh no, he's winning! So now you have to do something. Switch tactics, roll another way.

Scum wouldn't do it that way. SK wouldn't do that way. Anyone who didn't want to be lynched would've switched tactics when they saw they were being threatened. A townie might do it, but as someone pointed out to me I was wrong, Org actually contributes these days (I'm still in shock). So my initial arguments were BS, but now we find we have something out of them anyway.

That's a tangent, though. DO you get my point now?

We're talking about a player whose whole strategy revolves around RiA. You can't say "Nobody would do this unless they wanted to be lynched" while pointing out that Org is always spamming "herp derp derp derp" instead of defending himself or scumhunting, because nobody would do that either. Your non-PM evidence that he's a jester is directly opposed to your evidence that we shouldn't lynch him.

[RedWarrior0]

Again, Org hasn't been this herpderpdoubledownsderp for a while, apparently. But yes, remember BYOR Panda. Baybay, Org being Org is often not going to lynch him.

[Zrk2]

The hammering issue seems moot now, as well.

No, it's not moot. And you're trying to just pass off what's a pretty clear scumtell as nothing, which is, of course, scummy.

Actually, since (as explained earlier) I had decided who to lynch before the issue of the hammer came into play, I never was in danger of setting off the hammer. Anyone who had kept an eye on roughly where the votes sat would have known that it was not as near hammering as it appeared.