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[Oneir]

One difference is you can buy things back from a merchant, but you can't untransmog things. I have never used this feature.

[Neonivek]

Its a roguelike. Elitism is 50% of the reason you play them.

Otherwise why else would they include noob traps?

[Robsoie]

I'm not sure where you see elitism in ToME4 , it's one of the most beginner accessible RL while keeping the difficulty high enough to keep the seasonned RL-er hooked

[Neonivek]

I'm not sure where you see elitism in ToME4 , it's one of the most beginner accessible RL while keeping the difficulty high enough to keep the seasonned RL-er hooked

Don't ask me, I've long since learned my lesson in diving headfirst into Roguelike communities.

"Hey I think the game should disperse ranged enemies a bit earlier in greater quanities, that way when they start to become regular enemies it isn't a sudden extreme shift in paradymes"

"Learn to play the game idiot!"

"Hey, can we just remove that invisible enemy from the tournament it is just a needless noob trap"

"thanks noob! glad we snagged someone"

Note: The above didn't actually happen. It was actually met with a "sounds fair"

Still ToME4 still has enough Noob traps, head scratching mechanics, and HOLY CRUD TON OF SPEEDBUMPS to justify a strong elitism drive. So I would not be surprised to hear if it had a elitist community.

[Frumple]

Its a roguelike. Elitism is 50% of the reason you play them.

Otherwise why else would they include noob traps?

Where did this comment even come from? Why just... drop it in the middle of a completely unrelated conversation?

[Robsoie]

I fail to see how a dozen of vocal "elitists" make up for a whole RL community to be labelled as elitist.

[Neonivek]

Someone mentioned it earlier, I responded to them.

[Robsoie]

Ah the ingame chat, i thought it was about the te4 community being elitist in general.
I can't comment about what's going on with the chat because i don't read/don't participate and i'm not interested in doing so.

The only te4 community i follow is the one on the main te4 forum and here, and i have not seen the kind of behaviour mentionned, but many users helping people to build their characters and answering questions without all the elitist thing, hence me not really understanding what Neonivek was posting about.

[Neonivek]

I should have probably have used a word other than "community". Since there is quite the difference between 12 distinct and noticeable jerks and everyone else.

That way even if you didn't understand what I was getting on about, it would have seemed less like I was trying to talk about all of TOME4.

So I am hardly blameless for my lack of successful communication

[Darkmere]

I can't even remember the last time I bothered with in-game chat. To be fair, most of them seemed decent enough but the same handful of arrogant shits were always looking for a fight or reason to down-talk anyone who wasn't playing ultra-oneshot-super-insanity roguelike peen builder mode.

*shrug* better and more easily parseable info on the forums, or I can just ask here if it's something i can't figure out on my own.

[Mailo]

To give a counterpoint, I've never encountered unhelpful people in ToMEs chat. Every time I've asked a question (and a couple were rather dumb I have to admit), they were answered in a friendly manner.

Then again, I don't think I've ever encountered this elitism (which I'm sure does exist, I guess I've just been lucky) even in my Nethack and ADoM newsgroup days.

Don't get me started on elitism in PvP games though ... *shudder*

[Dr Feelgood]

I don't participate in chat, but the people on the forums are alright.

Anyway, if you felt the game was too long here's an addon to quicken the pace:

http://te4.org/games/addons/tome/shorterdungeons

Warning: It will probably make the game harder. There's less exp and loot, though the loot is slightly better.

[AlleeCat]

Best run I've ever had was with a Higher Human Berzerker. Found out the Ruins of Kor'pul are actually not the best place to go after the Trollmire, so I wandered around, did the Old Forest and the Maze, and ended up dying trying to go back to the Ruins. Why are the Ruins of Kor'pul so difficult if they're right next to the Trollmire?

[Frumple]

They... shouldn't be? Biggest notable threat in them is opening the vaults that might generate.* Everything else is... fairly trivial. It used to be the actual starting zone for everyone, ha, but the shade was killing too many people so it got shifted elsewhere

What exactly is killing you inside 'em?

E: Though I rescind that statement if you're playing above normal. Talent level boosted skeleton magi are pretty vicious, from what I understand.

E2: Which, yeah, don't open those unless you've got a reliable escape method -- movement infusion or teleport rune, ferex. PD won't cut it. Maybe not even then... if you don't have the right tools, a ghoulking disease can be a guaranteed death that early in the game.

[AlleeCat]

I was doing fine with the skeletons and rodents, but I came to this big open room on the second or third level with a bunch of high level animals and humanoids that killed me pretty quick even at level 14.