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Author Topic: Switch to x-bow?  (Read 1831 times)

The Dog Delusion

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Switch to x-bow?
« on: January 09, 2011, 09:46:46 am »

So right now, my military is a pretty tight operation - everyone's outfitted in steel, and they're all wielding steel battle-axes. Of the 16 dwarves in service, 11 have named their axes. I've recently been contemplating switching to a crossbow force, since I haven't tried that yet with DF2010, but I have two questions:

1) If a weapon becomes named, and thus, an artifact, does that mean that it receives the damage multipliers and such that it's equivalent to a mood-induced artifact? or is it just a regular weapon that happens to have a name?

2) While axes have served me quite well up until now, I'm curious - are crossbows very effective in this version? I remember that before, with well-placed ammo stockpiles and well-trained dwarves, you could pincushion entire sieges before they got to the gates, but I don't know whether this has carried over or not. Other questions aside, which is better? Axes or x-bows?
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Qinetix

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2011, 09:50:48 am »

I like both of them , but i think you should go with a combined force
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shlorf

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2011, 10:02:52 am »

I don't like the crossbows that much, but if you train them up to legendary on the archery range they will pull their weight. As bolts tend to not dismember their targets, the only way a marksdwarf can kill something is by making it bleed out or suffocating from puncturing the body enough, or with a bolt to the head. The latter happens sometimes with highly trained dwarfs, but the whole setup of fortifications ammo and quivers and then getting them to actually equip it all means i often don't bother.
In my current fort i had 4 crossbowdwarfs trained up to legendary in a tower who did a great job at keeping the goblins from fleeing once the sieges were routed. Until one siege came with a bowgobbo squad led by an elite crossbowgobbo. He shot every marksdwarf in the legs and when they fell over they got destroyed by the bowgoblins. Only one guy managed to make the way to the towers stairs and was patched up.
Crossbows only will not work without traps (and then you could as well build the traps strong enough to not need any soldiers). Unless you have really lots of them, they take too long to kill stuff.
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doctorspoof

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2011, 10:03:41 am »

So right now, my military is a pretty tight operation - everyone's outfitted in steel, and they're all wielding steel battle-axes. Of the 16 dwarves in service, 11 have named their axes. I've recently been contemplating switching to a crossbow force, since I haven't tried that yet with DF2010, but I have two questions:

1) If a weapon becomes named, and thus, an artifact, does that mean that it receives the damage multipliers and such that it's equivalent to a mood-induced artifact? or is it just a regular weapon that happens to have a name?

2) While axes have served me quite well up until now, I'm curious - are crossbows very effective in this version? I remember that before, with well-placed ammo stockpiles and well-trained dwarves, you could pincushion entire sieges before they got to the gates, but I don't know whether this has carried over or not. Other questions aside, which is better? Axes or x-bows?

From what I've personally seen in combat, it helps to have a variety of attack types.
To answer your questions:

1) Yes, a named weapon is more effective for the name-r, almost like an increase in quality modifier. Also they will be much less likely to upgrade to a better weapon.

2) Crossbows have been nerfed, but are still effective if you combine them with a standing melee force, i.e. have a melee squad charge the enemy while your marksdorfs fire from your walls.

So i'd suggest you keep your 16 axedorfs and press the next migrant wave or so into service as marksdorfs.
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The Dog Delusion

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2011, 10:05:52 am »

there's no way to use the scheduling/uniform/equipment menus to set it up so that soldiers use certan weapons during certain seasons, is there? That would be boss.
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CapnUrist

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2011, 10:32:23 am »

there's no way to use the scheduling/uniform/equipment menus to set it up so that soldiers use certan weapons during certain seasons, is there? That would be boss.

AFAIK, sadly not. It would indeed by highly boss.

@OP, I use crossbows as a support force, either behind melee or above traps in a pillbox accessible only from my military wing inside my fortress. As I've seen, they're not what I'd call lethal on their own, but can do a decent job crippling individuals and making them prime candidates for an axe or spear to the skull.
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EddyP

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2011, 01:07:58 pm »

Marksdwarves are best used softening up an attacking force for the melee troops. They don't kill many, but they'll make a lot of goblins wish they were dead - and your axedwarves will be happy to oblige.
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nanomage

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2011, 04:31:22 am »

too bad dwarves can't use both a sword and an xbow like adventurers
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FrisianDude

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2011, 04:36:53 am »

I'd keep the axedorfs as they are and simply set up a new squad with crossbows.
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Karakzon

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2011, 06:27:30 am »

too bad dwarves can't use both a sword and an xbow like adventurers

i have actualy managed somehow to get dorfs to dual weild. the problem is: they tend to run into melle instead of stand and shoot.
mind: i cant realy be sure of this, my only close quarters encounter was a FB in a tight confined passage way with 20 dwarfs. -12 melle, 8 marks-
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Di

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2011, 07:14:59 am »

If you somehow manage to get them working, the first bolt in every fight will be deadly indeed. I saw giant pass out because of one arrow chipping his leg bone, I've also seen a bronze colossus with both of his arms broken by bolts.
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Karakzon

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2011, 07:47:33 am »

i belive if you assign them the crossbow first, then a weapon like a short sword and no sheild/buckler they should work.
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nanomage

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2011, 07:51:03 am »

too bad dwarves can't use both a sword and an xbow like adventurers

i have actualy managed somehow to get dorfs to dual weild. the problem is: they tend to run into melle instead of stand and shoot.
mind: i cant realy be sure of this, my only close quarters encounter was a FB in a tight confined passage way with 20 dwarfs. -12 melle, 8 marks-
yeah, that's possible. the problem is they only seem to use one weapon (idk if it's one in main hand or just picked up first), until the hand wielding it gets chopped of.
still i hope to see berserking dwarves swinging 2 axes simultaneously some day
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Encased in burning magma

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2011, 08:50:09 am »

I just use 2-3 ranged dwarves to get annoying flying critters down in range.
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martinuzz

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Re: Switch to x-bow?
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2011, 09:24:32 am »

I'm curious, if undesignating all ammo for a ranged squad, from the military menu, while they are in combat, will cause the to stop firing, and start hammering.
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