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[telamon]

When a bridge's raise direction is determined, that decides what side of the bridge becomes wall when raised right?

[Jacob/Lee]

Yes, if it raises < then the left will be the wall. if it raises ^ the top will be the wall, etc.

[LordBucket]

Yes.

The wall will be on the side that the bridge is raised in. If you raise a drawbridge to the right, that means it will be attached to the ground on the right side, and therefore the left side will raise up to the right side of the bridge.

[Rat Of Wisdom]

The wall will be on the opposite side that the bridge is raised in.

Wait, wut?

Code: [Select]

╔═╗
║+║ Bridge lowered
╚═╝

╥..
║.. Bridge raised to the left
╨..

..╥
..║ Bridge raised to the right
..╨

Et cetera. Same side, not opposite.

[telamon]

OK, thanks.
Here's another quick question: what stockpile does cloth and thread go into?

[LordBucket]

Wait, wut?

Check the timestamps. I beat you to the edit.

I was thinking of something I read once about building destroyers, which I'm uncertain whether is still true, and the wiki...while it does not explicity say, seems to imply that it is not true.

That being that building destroyers can destroy raised bridges from the inside, but not the outside. So of the single tile that is the "wall" of a raised drawbridge, I've always thought of one side as a "wall" and one side as not. The "wall" side is the opposite of the direction that it raises to.

Can anyone confirm whether this is true of building destroyers?

[Rat Of Wisdom]

OK, thanks.
Here's another quick question: what stockpile does cloth and thread go into?

Finished Goods.

Wait, wut?

Check the timestamps. I beat you to the edit.

I was thinking of something I read once about building destroyers, which I'm uncertain whether is still true, and the wiki...while it does not explicity say, seems to imply that it is not true.

That being that building destroyers can destroy raised bridges from the inside, but not the outside. So of the single tile that is the "wall" of a raised drawbridge, I've always thought of one side as a "wall" and one side as not. The "wall" side is the opposite of the direction that it raises to.

Can anyone confirm whether this is true of building destroyers?

Lol, you ninja you.

Also, I don't know whether that's true, though it sounds logical. However it begs the question: if this bridge is relevant to building destroyers, why not just separate them from it by means of a channel? It shouldn't matter if they can't actually reach it.

[LordBucket]

why not just separate them from it by means of a channel?

Personally I avoid channels because dwarves tend to fall into them, but I see a couple possible reasons. You might have pressurized water on the level beneath. Or perhaps it opens up to the middle of your fortress. Or, for example, let's say you have a trap room composed of two bridges in a corridor:

Code: [Select]

XXXXXXXXXXXX
.╔═╗....╔═╗.
.║+║....║+║.
.╚═╝....╚═╝.
XXXXXXXXXXXX

If for aesthetic reasons you chose to raise both bridges in the same direction:

Code: [Select]

XXXXXXXXXXXX
.╥......╥...
.║......║...
.╨......╨...
XXXXXXXXXXXX

A building destroyer between the two bridges would be able to break through the bridge on the right, but not the bridge on the left. At least...if it works the way I think it does. And with that orientation, building a channel in the middle tiles under the bridge on the right doesn't stop the trapped monster from getting to the bridge. It might prevent him from escaping after he's destroyed the bridge...but that's not necessarliy a good thing, and if the next level down beneath that channel happens to be an unprotected level of your fortress, one misplaced hammer blow might knock him in. Which would not be good.

[telamon]

The reason is because I don't want to moat out my base, I have tons of stuff on zlevel 1. So I'm going to construct a wall around my base and another wall outside that one, with ramps leading up onto it. Then I'm going to create bridges to link my inner wall to the outer ramped one. If a building destroyer gets at my bridges I'll have to rebuild them so I just want to make sure that they raise up to the unreachable sides. A building destroyer can't take out a raised bridge because it counts as a wall (right?)

[Rat Of Wisdom]

Hmm. I don't usually consider the impact of building destroyers on traps that complex, or the inside of my base for that matter (I try and take them out before they get that close) but yeah I see what you did there.

The intuitive solution would be to build two bridges, back-to-back, that raise towards each other. And of course that makes me wonder if stuff that ends up between them is crushed out of existence too.

[LordBucket]

A building destroyer can't take out a raised bridge because it counts as a wall (right?)

I think they can, but only from one side. Since bridges are built with b+g not b+c, the wiki description for building destoyers seems to suggest that they can destroy bridges...but again, I think they can only destroy them from one side. I'm not certain.

So you don't need channels as long as you orient your bridges to raise towards the safe side of your fortress.

But, either way...if I understand the arrangement you've described, the bridges won't be the weakness. It will be that monsters will be able to walk right up the ramp and spread out on your exterior wall. If you get archers up there, they may be able to shoot over the inside wall into the middle of your fortress.

Which you could solve by building the inner wall so that it extends one level higher than your exterior wall.

[telamon]

Don't worry about that. I intend to have fortifications looking down over the entire entrance path on zlevel +2 or +3.
Which raises yet another question.
Let's say I have fortifications up on zlevel +3. Things that get right next to the fortification at zlevel +2 are unshootable from the fortification because the dwarves can't lean down to that angle. But let's say I have enemies on zlevel +1. Do they have to be next to the fortification's base to be unshootable or can they stand a further distance away?

Code: [Select]

side view (F is fortification, w is wall)
F
W* <- invaders here are immune to the fire from above
W * <- what about here?

[LordBucket]

Do they have to be next to the fortification's base to be
unshootable or can they stand a further distance away?

I'm not sure where exactly that threshold lies, but in my experience, once a drawbridge breaks their pathing to the inside of a fortress...siegers and goblins tend to mill about psuedo-randomly rather walking up to a wall and staying there. So it's probably not a concern. But...

I intend to have fortifications looking down over the entire entrance path

Could you place fortifications on both sides of the path? That way, even if a few stray goblins decide to hug one wall, your archers on the other side would still have line of sight to fire.
 

[gtmattz]

OK, thanks.
Here's another quick question: what stockpile does cloth and thread go into?

Finished Goods.

WAT...


I'm pretty sure cloth and thread go in a cloth stockpile...  Clothing goes in a finished goods stockpile.

[blue emu]

Code: [Select]

side view (F is fortification, w is wall)
F
W* <- invaders here are immune to the fire from above
W * <- what about here?

Why not off-set your Fortifications? I always do:

Code: [Select]

F
W
W