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[Aqizzar]

The problem is still pesticides, because things like DDT have been shown to cause harm to lands and animal wild life. (And yes I know that DDT is banned under the Stockholm Convention, but it's just one example of many.)

The point is that organic is not just meant to be good for you, but good for the environment.

And if you read any of the articles on the study, you'll see that argibusinesses have basically bribed the USDA to the point that you can still get an Organic label no matter how much DDT you sprayed on it.

[sonerohi]

You could probably shit on it too if you put in $40 a turd.

[Jreengus]

Pesticides, smesticides, I put DDT in my cereal instead of milk.

That explains a lot about you.

[JoshuaFH]

His TV show was great. It wasn't 'spend a day' it was 'spend a month'. And it wasn't him, usually, it was other people. Every season had one episode where he was part of it. Such as the 30 days on minimum wage, and 30 days working in a coal mine.

Anyway, I read an article recently called The Ubiquitous Matrix of Lies.

http://www.realitysandwich.com/ubiquitous_matrix_lies

It discusses the cheapening of the meanings of words. I was reminded of it in this thread, how Organic, All Natural, and Fat Free have become meaningless misdirections that people no longer care to notice.

That was a very nice essay... but ironically, I both understood it and barely understood it at all. It felt more like a very long, oddly arranged poem than an essay. So, sadly, I can see something as well written as that not making that large of a difference, since nothing in it really stuck out or moved me. Seems like he segwayed from topic to topic without any real effort to really pound the point home.

WAS quite depressing though.

[HAMMERMILL]

Actually, DDT is very safe for humans. There was even a scientist that literally drank full glasses of the stuff to prove his point.

http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/articles/Fall02/Mosquitoes.html

In some ways, you could consider the banning of DDT to be the greatest human tragedy in history. Millions of people have died of preventable malaria deaths and crop failures from insects since the banning of DDT. Its a very persistant, effect and CHEAP pesticide that even very poor countries could afford to spray everywhere to control the misquito population.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDT#Criticism_of_restrictions_on_DDT_use

[Neonivek]

So what even IF DDT was harmless to humans?

It still is an uncontrollable danger to wildlife.

[Leafsnail]

You could probably shit on it too if you put in $40 a turd.

Um, natural fertilizers tend to be manure.

Anyway, DDT could be an important tool for fighting malaria, but there are health risks involved, so it needs to be used carefully.

[mendonca]

Just to throw my two cents in:

The 'yuppies' that buy organic food believing it to be more nutritious have clearly always been ill-informed. This shouldn't be a surprise, should food grow better with or without pesticides / additives etc.? Probably it would grow better with human and scientific intervention.

That is almost beside the point.

Also the issue of 'organic' food tasting better must be purely 'in the head'. Why would it taste better? This doesn't really make sense either? Does it?

Fresh food grown locally, yes I can see this.

No, I propose, as briefly alluded to by others, that the overwhelming benefit of organic food is to other things. If you were to walk round a farm producing crops truly organically, the difference in biodiversity is huge. i.e. the strips of wild planting at the edges of the fields which are necessary such that birds can live there to eat pests etc.

Compare that to the comparitive 'desert' of the highly efficient modern farm, square mile after square mile of wheat and nothing else.

It is a shame as far as I am concerned that this never gets brought up for the following reason:

'It costs'

'I don't benefit'

Hence they have to sell organic food on lies, as no-one gives a flying f*ck about the number and health of various species of birds living in Norfolk, and other such important things.

Also, I personally disagree with the blanket statement that Organic farming is not sustainable. I do not believe this has been tested sufficiently to prove either way.

[Jude]

Basically, just have your own garden, and buy locally from farmers in your area, buy into community-supported agriculture and go to farmers markets. Raise your own chickens in your backyard. Good to go.

[Aqizzar]

Raise your own chickens in your backyard.

Just to point out, in most parts of America, this would be a serious violation of zoning laws.

[Leafsnail]

I think my cat would probably end any ownership of chickens in my back yard prematurely.

[JoshuaFH]

Do you mind if I ask what country you live in Jude?

Also, I used to have a Goose that lived in my Backyard.

[Jude]

I live in the US.

Obviously you can't grow your own food everywhere. And I'm just talking; I'm in a place where I COULD grow some of my own food if I really wanted to, but I don't. But I'm also not on a big organic kick.

[ToonyMan]

Raise your own chickens in your backyard.

Just to point out, in most parts of America, this would be a serious violation of zoning laws.

THANK YOU, SOMEONE UNDERSTANDS ME.  DAMN ROOSTER.


Someday...that rooster....is going to get it.......


Ah well, atleast it beats me alarm clock.

[Cthulhu]

His TV show was great. It wasn't 'spend a day' it was 'spend a month'. And it wasn't him, usually, it was other people. Every season had one episode where he was part of it. Such as the 30 days on minimum wage, and 30 days working in a coal mine.

Anyway, I read an article recently called The Ubiquitous Matrix of Lies.

http://www.realitysandwich.com/ubiquitous_matrix_lies

It discusses the cheapening of the meanings of words. I was reminded of it in this thread, how Organic, All Natural, and Fat Free have become meaningless misdirections that people no longer care to notice.

That was a very nice essay... but ironically, I both understood it and barely understood it at all. It felt more like a very long, oddly arranged poem than an essay. So, sadly, I can see something as well written as that not making that large of a difference, since nothing in it really stuck out or moved me. Seems like he segwayed from topic to topic without any real effort to really pound the point home.

WAS quite depressing though.

I thought there was an awful lot of bloviating for a guy who's worried about words becoming meaningless.