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[Putnam]

I'm pretty sure the pact was something along the lines of "DON'T FUCKING KILL ANYONE YOU GENOCIDAL FREAK"

[Rolan7]

That's exactly what I was suggesting, he was keeping his good friend Eridan pacified.  I don't know about "FREAK", though, considering that by all indications they were strong friends before SGRUB.  Then again, Karkat loves throwing insincere insults.

[hops]

I think they were pretty good friends up until Kanaya created Eri Amp and Dan Pora.

[XXXXYYYY]

That's exactly what I was suggesting, he was keeping his good friend Eridan pacified.  I don't know about "FREAK", though, considering that by all indications they were strong friends before SGRUB.  Then again, Karkat loves throwing insincere insults.

By that metric, Terezi<>Vriska has been a thing since before sgrub until just before Vriska was stabbed/punched, because of the pact they made not to kill any more of their friends. It was more of a pact out of necessity than an actual relationship. There was none of the actual substance of a moirallegence there. The only reason that I can see that Vriska and Eridan followed the rules so to speak was because if they broke them, they would be effectively banished, rather than following through because they valued the other person and their judgement (see Nepeta<>Equius and how they interact).

[Bauglir]

DAVE: ok i guess what im saying is
DAVE: i dont think its all as simple as you think it is
DAVE: or maybe not like ACTIVELY think it is but continue to assume it is on account of NOT thinkin about it much
DAVE: due to a lot of junk about the subject that gets shoved into our brains from movies and stuff while we were just dumb kids

...

DAVE: im just saying it probably isnt as absolute or simplistic as the way youve been framing it

[Rose]

How do they pronounce their typing quirks? Besides karkat, that is.

[XXXXYYYY]

[snip]

Yeah. I guess what I'm really saying under all my semi-coherent late-night rambling is that such a relationship requires upkeep - one pact isn't really enough to call it diamonds.

[hops]

How do they pronounce their typing quirks? Besides karkat, that is.

Gift of Gab.

AKA I assume they can magically transmit text into people's head when they talk.

[Bauglir]

[snip]

Yeah. I guess what I'm really saying under all my semi-coherent late-night rambling is that such a relationship requires upkeep - one pact isn't really enough to call it diamonds.

Fair enough; not aimed at anybody in particular, it's just a particularly topical quote to lob conversationward here, I figure.

[Rolan7]

That's exactly what I was suggesting, he was keeping his good friend Eridan pacified.  I don't know about "FREAK", though, considering that by all indications they were strong friends before SGRUB.  Then again, Karkat loves throwing insincere insults.

By that metric, Terezi<>Vriska has been a thing since before sgrub until just before Vriska was stabbed/punched, because of the pact they made not to kill any more of their friends. It was more of a pact out of necessity than an actual relationship. There was none of the actual substance of a moirallegence there. The only reason that I can see that Vriska and Eridan followed the rules so to speak was because if they broke them, they would be effectively banished, rather than following through because they valued the other person and their judgement (see Nepeta<>Equius and how they interact).

Well, yeah.  Vriska <> Terezi was seemingly a thing while they were flarping.  They had a falling out which lasted for sweeps, but now they're back to being Scourge Sisters thanks to John's intervention (Explicity <> http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=6&p=009400).

Which brings up an interesting point...  Since we've established that all moirallegiance involves pacifying one or both parties, which Scourge Sister is getting pacified?  Ideally both, but I don't see how either are.  Oddly it seems to be Terezi more than Vriska, now, based on recent exchanges we've seen (Terezi mysteriously backing down).  But Terezi isn't actually violent, in any dangerous way.  Perhaps this is a sign that the relationship isn't troll-healthy.  But arguably Vriska has been backing down too (at least, appearing to) so maybe it is healthy.  I doubt it though.

Vriska wasn't "banished" per se, but her moirail cut her off.  Then cut off her arm and eye.  She basically just had her "creepy" neighbor Equius, and Kanaya who had unrequitable red feelings for her.  She had Eridan as a kismessis, but she cut that off too.  I don't think she ever followed any rules for fear of banishment, she was ostracized and probably found it affirming.  (Yes she deserved all that, I'm just saying she didn't fear banishment)

Eridan was a sea-dweller.  Genetically he should have been like sober Gamzee but less discriminate.  Like his ancestor, Dualscar.  In my opinion, he either just wasn't into the whole genocide thing, or someone was pacifying him out of it.  Possibly both.  His "doomsday" weapons were all jokes and he knew it.  Though it's reasonable to suggest he was just a freak like Feferi, mysteriously kind despite his caste.

Keep in mind that Vriska and Eridan murdered countless trolls and lusi to feed Vriska's lusus and Feferi's lusus.  Nothing indicates that they actually enjoyed that, in fact there's a lot suggesting it was as traumatic as it was necessary.  Which is one reason I resent Feferi's resentment of Eridan.  On the other hand, she made the wonderful dream bubbles...

Edit:  Wow, in retrospect, this potential spades relationship between Terezi and John was more foreshadowed than I thought.  Looking over their early interactions.

[Bauglir]

I take it back. This is aimed directly at Rolan7.

DAVE: ok i guess what im saying is
DAVE: i dont think its all as simple as you think it is
DAVE: or maybe not like ACTIVELY think it is but continue to assume it is on account of NOT thinkin about it much
DAVE: due to a lot of junk about the subject that gets shoved into our brains from movies and stuff while we were just dumb kids

...

DAVE: im just saying it probably isnt as absolute or simplistic as the way youve been framing it

EDIT: In my own words, trying to work out the precise qualifications for the various quadrants is exactly as misguided as trying to work out the precise qualifications for a romance in the human sense, largely because the two seem to be basically exactly the same phenomenon. Relationships are fuzzy things, and I think they suffer from attempts to box them into species-wide definitions with no room for individual nuance, no matter how helpful it may or may not be to articulate in explicit detail what they mean to you in particular.

[Rolan7]

I'm not saying it's simple though :?
I'm saying a lot of what Karkat did was easily interpretable as <>, which is kinda the opposite.  Though I feel like I abided the canon definition too.  (Kanaya being the weakest of my example ships).

Though if you're saying that it's vague, so your own interpretation is valid, that's truly fine too.  It *is* very vague.

[Bauglir]

Well, more what I mean is, there's certainly a lot of interpreting you could do, but that's all it is. "Canon" is exactly what's not the point; the very notions of romance are vague ones that do not lend themselves well to categorization of the, "Well, this pair has X, Y, and Z true about their interaction, therefore it is a moirallegiance". It seems better to say, "X, Y, and Z are consistent with moirallegiance, but maybe that's not what's going on here."

Although, in fairness, I have a dog in this fight given my own meatspace relationships. Labeling is fairly innocuous on its own; I don't much care what people call my relationship with my dearest friend, for example, but there's always rider assumptions that go with the labels in question, and people are quick to assume something's not right if they're not met. I have literally been asked why I'm not fucking the aforementioned friend, for instance, because there's a good deal of cuddling and talking about sexual stuff that would be a lot weirder if either of us thought the other was actually serious, and the assertion that that's what the relationship ought to be is actually kind of annoying. Not that people are terribly obligated to avoid offending me, obviously, but it doesn't seem to me that it's a relationship terribly unique in its uniqueness, if you see what I mean. There's all kinds of nuanced history that goes into making any given relationship, and while the vaguely-defined cultural touchstones of romance do provide useful notions to build on, they're pretty damn confining when you start reversing the polarity on how language interacts with reality.

Which, I guess, really is just my interpretation at the end of the day - that all this troll romance business is a commentary on how silly people get about their definitions and mental constructs for what is ultimately something that defies that kind of structure by its very being. Whereas it seems your interpretation of it is as more of a framework to be explored, puzzled out, and applied to various situations in the interests of understanding. Which is fair enough, I suppose.

[Rolan7]

Believe it or not, I can relate to that.  I've only ever had one close friend at a time (with other contacts who are just... not the same.  I hesitate to even call them friends).  And yeah, that's resulted in multiple people assuming I was gay, before I ever seriously considered the possibility myself.

That's why I started this by complaining that moirailships seemingly *weren't* monogamous, heh.  I wanted it to match my personal experiences.

Rails before pails!

[Bauglir]

Rails before pails!

Suddenly I have to reverse course and ask if you're me. I mean, more than usual, obviously, because Pathos, but y'know.